acco40

When I was a den leader and my wife Pack committee chair, we found it best if dens took care of their own expenses for materials and supplies (via den dues or what ever) and did not involve the Pack leadership. Pack event (Blue & Gold, Pinewood Derby, etc.) were taken care of by the Pack committee. My only beef was the Pack seemed more intent on "hiring" entertainment as opposed to putting in the time and effort to have the boys involved in the pack meetings. In my community we tended to be money rich and time poor so to speak.

Parents should be allowed to attend and strongly encouraged NOT to attend and given reasons why. Should parents of a high school football player be allowed to attend the half-time speech by the coach in the locker room? Should parents be allowed to attend every visit a student makes to his high school guidance counselor? Parents - get a clue, let go and let your charges grow up. Can't you see that your child will view the event much differently given the fact that your are there vs. are not there? Having the right and acting upon that right are two very different things. My oldest son went through his Ordeal the year before I did. On the eve of my Ordeal, I asked him a few questions about preparation and he just smiled and said he couldn't tell me about it! Truth be told, I knew that and wasn't really looking for a response but wanted to give my 14 year old son a reason to be one up on his dad/Scoutmaster. It gave him immense joy. I ask parents, why the compelling need to want to attend?(This message has been edited by acco40)

Some of the responses on this topic reflect one of the reasons I've recently greatly curtailed my involvement with troops in the area. Parents who so blindly put there precious little darlings first and don't even think about the consequences that their actions may have on other children and adults. I really don't have a problem with the decision ... different time, different world. We, as parents, are constantly being harped at to "take responsibility" for our kids well being .. I think that is what these parents did. If he's really that motivated, he try one of the other 100 troops in the area. Personally, I find that attitude disgusting. Why would a kid in college, with all the activities, workload and what not available to him want to be involved in a Troop that he's not been around; want to help us? My guess is that none of these parents have a college aged Eagle scout or the answer would be readily apparent.

During my first year as Scoutmaster, at summer camp a Scout couldn't find something so his mother, who was residing in "family camp" but came to visit every day, proceeded to enter his tent and look through his mess to try and find the article. Soon afterward, I took her aside and told her that adults can't go into tents of Scouts that are not immediate family members - and her son was sharing a tent with another Scout. She violated YPT rule and I did not report anything. I've been forced to share a bathroom with boys during Scouting events that occurred at facilities not under my control - for example a MLB game. Yes there are rules and yes there is common sense. For Scouters like us, our emphasis should be on prevention, not trying to figure out who to blame. Scouting is no different than everyday life. I you feel a crime has been committed, report it to the proper authorities.

If smoking marijuana was legal, this tragedy would have been prevented. Making certain stupid behaviors illegal, doesn't prevent future stupid behavior.

Discussing the BSA's position on a variety of topics IS a scouting issue. I have had Scouts from my unit quit because of the "gay" and "God" issues. Teens can be very idealistic at their age (we can save the world) which is refreshing in some sense, tragic in another. I've also noticed that discussing these issues makes some folks uncomfortable. As for me, I just get the generic "Your Ad Here" plea.

I always said, be wary of Buckeyes!

Barry, I was not aware that Scoutmasters had any "power" to pick and choose members for an Eagle Board of Review.

If I feed and cloth my neighbors, is that service? If I feed and cloth my wife and children, is that service? A wise former district advancement chair defined service as something one did that was "not usually expected" so a boy from a devout Catholic family serves as an altar boy - he did not count that time served as service. It was an expected behavior from his family and church. A protestant boy who happened to live next door to the same Catholic church, volunteers to assist the local priest with certain things - that he would count as service. Not such a bad determination in my book. Keep in mind the purpose of "service" and what we are trying to teach the boys.

Vol_Scouter, may I suggest to you what I suggest to my teenage children, the fountain of all knowledge, acco40, aka "me", can be used to check the accuracy of Wikipedia.

When I picked up my son after his seven weeks at summer camp, as dining hall manager, I noticed that the port-a-johns were being emptied by a truck that had the following slogan on emblazoned on - We're #1 at #2!

Keep in mind that "intelligentsia" references the arts, social sciences and culture and rarely those involved with the natural sciences, applied science/engineering, mathematics, medicine, etc. As such, your claims are vacuous.

Yes, but that then makes the BSA claim of nonsectarian false. We don't claim those that eat lobster unacceptable role models. We don't claim those that cut their hair unacceptable role models. We don't claim those that drive automobiles as unacceptable role models. All of those behaviors are "frowned upon" by certain "sectarian" religions.

It is entirely up to the leaders involved (Scouting and school). Can a Scout count the same camping trips for both OA membership, the camping merit badge and for rank advancement requirements? Of course they can. Keep in mind that any service that is being requested for "credit" in Scouting should get the okay for that "credit" in advance by the Scoutmaster - not after the fact. When I was a Scoutmaster, I reviewed service time on an individual basis.

Unfortunately, both sides of the equation will use the BSA position for political gain. As a program that claims to be absolutely nonsectarian, I find their stance on homosexuality troubling. Keep in mind that the Supreme Court case was only secondarily concerned with homosexual behavior - the primary issue debated was if the BSA was a private or public institution. The supreme court decided that he BSA was a private institution and as such, could set their own admission standards. I think that was the correct call but the fact that the BSA is chartered by the USG, received funds from the USG, etc. complicates things immensely. Now, the BSA does happen to state that, an avowed homosexual is not a role model for the values espoused in the Scout Oath and Law. I think that is repugnant. Someone please tell me what part of the Scout Oath and Law one may not be a role model for if one is an avowed homosexual? The BSA claims that the values declared by "morally straight" and "clean" are not represented by homosexual behavior. That is the crux of the issue and I can see why a large portion of society has a beef with that reasoning. The BSA feels that if it endorsed an avowed homosexual as a Scout leader that they would not be a desirable role model. What the BSA does not state is what exactly is "unclean" or "morally crooked" about being an avowed homosexual. I challenge them to do so. Lay the cards on the table!

At most camporees, patrols compete with other patrols - both intra and inter to the unit. National is very conscience of not having Webelos patrols compete with patrols. However, they may attend the same event. I suggest that Webelos use such an event to check out prospective troops and instead of attending as a Cub Scout patrol, have individual Webelos attend as guests of troops and participate and camp with them. Alternatively, one could attend as a Webelos den and compete against other dens only.

The worst thing to do is to have an "adults only" facility. Why exacerbate the problem for the boys who do not cause issues? When an adult, or youth leader or anyone for that matter, finds an outhouse in need of cleaning, the unit should be alerted and then the outhouse should be cleaned. Have the SPL set up a cleaning schedule - have the boys and adults keep it clean in pairs. When we go to summer camp, I make sure the SPL assigns a pair of scouts for every 12 hour period we are in camp. I also, as Scoutmaster, assign two adults to the first shift and last shift of the outing - and usually include myself in the first shift. Leave the "bathroom" cleaner than when we arrived is a good habit to have.

Advice would vary greatly if the "brand new leader" was a Tiger Den Leader or Troop Committee member or Unit Commissioner. If you want generic "brand new leader" advice - learn what the responsibilities of the leader are, socialize with like leaders (roundtable, training, etc.). Don't set your expectation sky high - those with many years of experience are just as fallible as newbies.(This message has been edited by acco40)

Many parents look to the BSA to provide their son with the "Eagle Scout" BSA "Good Housekeeping" seal of approval in the belief that it will help with college entrance or future employment opportunities. What the BSA will find out is that if they water down the requirements for Eagle, it will hurt membership in the long run. There is a struggle for members right now and the BSA is changing to try and fix that issue. Not all are happy with the changes made and some proposed changes.

No. Some will say that giving spare change to beggars helps them. Others feel that this just exacerbates their problem. Some are just cheap! I feel a Scout should feel they should help other people at all times but exactly how that help is rendered is a personal decision.(This message has been edited by acco40)

"When children come to camp they and you (parents) are making a leap of faith, transferring their primary care from you as their parents to us and their counselors," he wrote. "As children learn to trust other caring adults, they grow and learn, little by little, to solve some of their own challenges. We believe this emerging independence is one of the greatest benefits of camp." "Sending a cellphone to camp is like saying to your child that you as the parent haven't truly come to peace with the notion of them being in our care." Amen to the above.

A lost art that is very helpful - cards and letters mailed to the Scout. I couldn't stress this enough to the parents of the Scouts. Cards and letters are tangible, physical things that can be revisited. I this day of facebook, text messaging, mobile phones, email, etc. the art of letter writing has been lost.

Given the fact that all medications are held by the camp health officer who usually bunks with a myriad of 18-21 year old college kids. My guess is that particular prescription would "get lost" very quickly.

If the camps were forced to compete in the marketplace, we would have exactly the number of camps we need or want. Pack - I'm interested to know why you feel they do not compete in the marketplace. Don't troops have the opportunity to vote with their feet/pocketbook? Same, to a lesser extent with Cub Scouts.

An "ignore" feature on an anonymous forum is like the proverbial teats on a boar. A real-life "ignore" capability would be a God send.