Eagle94-A1

I agree. What's sad is that he doesn't see any problems with adults jumping in. In fact he said I should butt out and not work with the to do things on their own.

That is correct.

Wow, it's getting really interesting. Apparently tents have been ordered and the Scouts had no input in the decision. BUT the SM will tell the SPL and PLC to do research new tents, limiting them to two companies to look at. And yes, it's Gunship doing all this.

While adults can hammock, Scouts cannot. Don't ask as I am against the policy. As for your own tents, that is allowed. It's interesting to note that those who bring their own, usually have hte most rules for those who sleep in the tent with them. Sadly we are in the middle of nowhere, and it would take an hour in either direction to get to a decent outfitter. The thing is, the Scouts do know what to look for in a tent. Especially the older ones who have their own tents, which are usually better quality than the Scout ones. And because they bought them, they take better care of them.

Really frustrating chat with one of the ASMs. He wants to go out an buy a bunch of tents without any input from the Scouts. He says that the Scouts don't have any idea what to look for, including those who have been in the troop a while and/or having camping MB. They will only pick "what looks cool." Futher he commented on how if they are asked to do something, they will do a poor job of doing the research, and it will take 6 months to get the stuff ordered. This is based upon one Scout's research into stoves, and after 6 months we are now getting them. I could not reply as I had to get back to work. But A) the Scout was limited to one company's models and he came up with 2 for the troop to pick, and B) the reason I was told we waited for the stoves is because the SM wanted a troop debit card, and with the death of the primary on the checking account, everything is on hold until things get cleared. The ASM bought the stoves on his CC and got reinbursed, which is how things had been done in the past. But just the lack of faith in the Scouts is disturbing. I admit the Scouts are not doing things like my peers back in the day did. But we also didn't have adults jumping in and taking over when things are not going the way the adults expect them.

Then why doesn't Sea Scout and Venturing YPT allow for 2 females if a ship or crew is coed?

What Ronnie Holmes did was NOT (emphasis) uncommon. I know of several councils that had issues like that.

I guess someone didn't get the memo that flipping Cubs is no longer allowed. Glad she enjoyed being flipped when receiving Bobcat.

Don't know what the bylaws say, but I know the pros DO influence who is on such things as the district and council committees. My SE wanted me to replace members of the district committee because they were thorns in his side. He was even telling me who to replace them with. Of course he was trying to use the nominating committee to get his selections approved. He used the nominating committee process the same way to get rid of council committee members too. I can assume the CSE has the same type of influence for the regional and national committees too.

I'm a WIlderness and Remote First Aid instructor for ECSI. BSA got together with several agencies, they are listed in the ECSI manual which the wife has at the moment. One name I remember is Buck Tilton being on the BSA's task force. BSA is the agency mandating a 16 hour course and getting this going. Agencies that are listed in the ARC manual are Jewish Community Center Association, American Camping Association, American Canoeing Association, and National Park and Recreation Association. As to whether it will be worth it or not, I do not know as I am not an EMT. But I do know that a friend who is an EMT went to Philmont and he didn't need the WFRA certification. Here is a link to the 2014 manual. I know ECSI came out with some changes in 2016 since CPR had some changes in 2015. https://www.redcross.org/images/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m49440095_WRFA_ERG_9781584806295.pdf EDITED: BSA has partnerships with ECSI and ARC to teach it.

Sometimes words have different meanings based upon the setting. In some places, and "Eagle Scout Candidate" is a Life Scout who has completed everything except his BOR. In other places it is someone who has passed his EBOR and is waiting on national approval. And still in others, probably old school troops like my old growing up, an Eagle Candidate is a Life Scout who passed his BOR and confirmed by National, and is awaiting his Eagle Court of Honor. I still mess around with one of my Eagles, and call him an 'Eagle Canidate" because he never had his COH due to his Uncle Sam.

I hate to say it, but I worked with professionals who were not Trustworthy. Thank goodness I have copies of my records I turned into the council office.

I would not split. I remember the pack I was in, when it was a 3 year program and Tiger Cubs was optional, was 3 Wolf dens, 3 Bear dens, and 3 Webelos dens. That is approximately 75-90 Cubs, not including the 8-10 Tiger Cubs who showed up 1/2 the time.

Regarding the deposit, gotcha. Yes I have heard of someone who agreed to work camp, went to NCS, then backed out after NCS, putting camp in a pickle. Reimbursement is good. Regarding NCS patches, I stil don't think so. If the training is like camp medical officers, online, then no patch.

IF they went to NCS, then they are entitled to wear it. If not, then no. What I'm interested in is why they are charging you to attend NCS for the resident camp? Normally that is something budgeted by council and paid for by them.

Nothing official, but my opinion based upon talking to long-time Scouters, Professionals, and my own personal experience as a former pro 20 years ago. The divorcing of Scouting principles from the executives started around the early 1970s when membership started dropping. When membership drops, so do the donations. And both are key factors in an professional's performance. DEs at that time did all kind of things to keep their numbers up. Some were caught and dismissed. But alot survived and moved higher and higher within the organization. As they did so, they covered up their tracks pretty well, and "encouraged" their subordinates to do the same in order to keep their jobs. Remember a lot of DEs are fresh out of college, are heavy in debt, and may be facing other challenges in their lives. They may feel they cannot afford to lose their job. Some bust butt to try and fix the problem. Only to face increased pressure since doing things right takes a lot longer than the "shortcuts," stressed out because they are working 2 and 3 times harder than their peers, get health issues, burn out, or in my case given an ultimatum by my wife: her or the job. And some fo the higher level pros enjoy "breaking" folks trying to fix the problem. My DFS gleefully announced my resignation after it was tendered. And he commented on friends' resignations after they left. I was lucky. My wife saw what the job was doing to me, didn't like it one bit, and was willing to drop her dreams of grad school to support me while I searched for a new job. Thankfully, she was only delayed in grad school a semester. But I have had friends suffer nervous breakdowns over the job. I and other started having physical health issues over the job. And I have had too many friends get divorced over the job. And all of that could have been solved if they didn't do the right thing and try to fix the problem. Not all pros are like the above. But too many are IMHO. part of that is they are not in the field dealing with those of us actually workign with youth.

For those who have not seen the new Youth Protection slide in the presentations, it's below. I agree. You need a female with you with a group of girls. There have been cases where the male has been prosecuted and exonerated, but the males have lost. Duke Lacrosse Team is but one example. BUT I also know that with Scouting, National will take the word of a Scout, even if known as a liar to keep out of trouble, over a respected female Scouter. And they won't reinstate them either after an investigation proves the accusation false, and the "Scout" is a peeping Tom.

Nope. Some of the comments not online were, "It's not a big deal." and 'I don't think parents would go for 2 guys being leaders for their daughter." Online it's been " let's talk about society in general. According to this -- Child sex abusers are "overwhelmingly male, ranging from adolescents to the elderly." http://victimsofcrime.org/media/reporting-on-child-sexual-abuse/statistics-on-perpetrators-of-csa So, if the goal is risk mitigation, I can understand it. " and " a female Den Leader working with boys, I have never really been alone with boys. There are always parents around, " And I forgot to add Stosh recognized the irony too. and "Parents of girls will be protective of them, and a cautious parent will not let a male leader be alone with a group of 6 year old girls, whether its in the policies or not. They'll show up. "

Yep, I commented on the double standard with 2 females can lead an all male den, but a female MUST be present for an all girl den a few weeks ago when the early adapter program info came out to execs. Sad thing is that NO ONE except @Back Pack and I seem to have a problem with it.

WHY? Seriously why shortchange the Cubs? 3 den meetings a month is not that hard. Been there, done that.

Don't you mean December/January 2018, the earliest the 4th grade female Webelos who are "early adopters" can cross over?

It was in one of the reports regarding the survey and was in the fine print. I need to be more specific though as not all LDS scouters were excluded. WESTERN REGION'S results excluded LDS folks, and that region has the bulk of the LDS membership.

In regards to coed troops with segregated PATROLS ( emphasis, sorry about the confusion earlier) that is from Mike Walton. I can't find the quote, but it is on Facebook. And considering how well connected he is, he tends to know more than the average Scouter. He is one of the top volunteers who attend the annual meetings. As for not trusting national, how can we when they go back on what they say. They take polls and either don't show any or all of the data, or ignore the results. When they polled about changing the youth membership policy, they excluded results from LDS Scouters. They didn't even poll on changing adult membership policy, they just did it. Instapalms had something like 75+ % Strongly against and 10+% against, totaling 94% , doing away with 3 month tenure requirements. Then there is changing the Cub Scout requirements on the spur of the moment, While I was not involved in June 2015 Cub Scout Program, I know folks who were. They spent a long time talking to folks in the field about improving the program. I though the new program was a major improvement. Then without any warning, or giving packs the opportunity to work out the kinks of the first year, they up and change the program. And then they did it again with the camping requirements for Second and First Class. How can folks trust national?

Project had meaning and wasn't because it was easy effort. Heard some Christmas horror stories about poor kids, in the hospital, for Christmas. That got the idea going. Good bit of work advertising, collecting, and especially cleaning ( was collecting new and "gently used" toys and had to be cleaned to hospital standards, and even then, I think they took them somewhere to be sterilized) the toys. Then distributing them. That was heartwrenching.

Regarding the surveys and policy changes, I think it is safe to say national doesn't care what we in the field think. The homosexual membership policies had slim majorities against the change, and they did it anyway. And let's not forget the Instapalm survey in 2015. 94% agreed or strongly agreed with keeping the 3 months tenure for palms, and national created instapalms anyway. And if the surveys, which were IMHO deliberately limited to avoid a good sample AND had such biased questions that it was ridiculous, truly reflected the majority of members, Scouters, and family members supports girls joining the program, then why don't they publish the results? Again the decision was made by national, and it was made prior to July 2017 as the newest membership applications remove the words boys when describing Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts.