SSScout

"Remember, you are just an extra in everyone else's play". = = Stewart Emery = =

Bobcat, wolf, bear, lion, webelos. Long time ago, been there done that. The progression almost made sense. Size and impression. Even made sense from the Jungle Book viewpoint. But like I mentioned in the earlier thread, how can you justify the Lion as the first step and the Bear as the last? Now, we have Tiger Cub, Bobcat, Wolf, Bear, Web. You're putting Lion in front of Tiger Cub ? Even a 1st grader is going to see a problem with that, I'd guess. I'm not familiar with the Learning for Life program, but I've detected a certain, er, stress among the posters here about it. Is there, perhaps, a section in National Council that must justify its existance by creating new programs whether the old programs are in need of revision or not?

Never been to Philmont. Always thought it would be neat to go sometime. In my far distant youth, my Troop went to Phil more than once (less crowded then, I guess. I opted for other adventures. The older Scouts that went the first time brought back all the excellent tips for equipment (M4 surplus plywood pack boards, aluminum canteens, folding cook kits, all purpose plastic home-made tarp tents, nylon parachute cord rope,etc.) and methods (bolt your Yucca pack to the packboard thereby avoiding having to use the Diamond Hitch, multi use hiking staffs, foam pads instead of heavy airmattress) that we all immediately emulated. The Troop became known as the black plastic tarp tent Troop. Hey, infinitely adaptable, super light weight, when they have outlived their purpose, use 'em for ground cloth! 10' by 10',special duct tape around the edges and grommets set in the edges and corner and a reinforced center hole. I found out (as my son has) that that big 5 D cell flash light is sure bright, but on the trail you can carry TWO AA lights (a spare is nice) or a headlight and a hand hold for much less weight and space. Make sure he considers not what he'd like to have along, but what he really might need. If he's the fellow with the small roll of duct tape or extra shoe lace to help his buddy with, he could be a very popular fellow. My sons Troop is # umpty ump on the Phil wait list, so they are considering a self outfitted trip to the Boundary Waters area. Canoes paddle blisters instead of heels? Have Fun! YiS

Neckerchiefs... Not too many Scouters around here wear'em. Some Troops opt to NOT wear'em. Troop of my youth had a custom design ("Always on the Go!"), and it was the BIG version. I agree that the SMALL version looks less appropriate on an adult or a large Scout. And one really can't do too many of the assumed uses too easily with the SMALL version. Signaling? You folks do Signaling? No longer a REQUIREMENT on any but the Signaling merit badge. You teach a non-requirement? Do the boys enjoy it? omygod.....

Neckerchiefs... Not too many Scouters around here wear'em. Some Troops opt to NOT wear'em. Troop of my youth had a custom design ("Always on the Go!"), and it was the BIG version. I agree that the SMALL version looks less appropriate on an adult or a large Scout. And one really can't do too many of the assumed uses too easily with the SMALL version. Signaling? You folks do Signaling? No longer a REQUIREMENT on any but the Signaling merit badge. You teach a non-requirement? Do the boys enjoy it? omygod.....

Pine wood derby... Our District has a couple of Troops that keep really fine, "professional" tracks , timers, stands, posters and flags etc which they "rent" out to the Packs as a service. The "starter" of one is really good, lots of patter, talks up the quality of the car and the Cub. "START YOUR ROUTERS!!!" etc. We always had a "Cub" league ('On Your Honor', the Cub did MOST of the work...)and an "Adult-Unlimited" league, and an "EE" league (everybody else. Siblings, guests, etc). The District enforced the Package rules, and the various Packs knew it in advance. Good recruitment tool.... Our Pack had a roughed out wood track that we brought to PTA picnics, and verily the draw of boys was great... A lot of fun. Google for lots of hints and tips. YiS

The original question here concerned the physical fitness requirement of Webelos being acceptable also for the TF rank. The discussion has (as is often the case here, ain't it wonderful?) roiled into subbing one earned requirement for the next ranks requirement. #1. The Webelos who crosses over into Boy Scouts, by present requirements, must first EARN the Scout badge. If his Web leaders were worth their salt, this should be a breeze. One SM conference should do it. Then, ... #2. After two months, if they are sharp, the nascent BS can be awarded the TF badge, if he has EARNED it. Again, if his Web leaders were on the ball, this should also be a breeze. His Troop leaders (SM, ASMs, PL,etc. ) should have all the opportunities available to make it possible. But the Web pins should not be used as evidence that the TF requirements HAVE been done. Frinstance, the physical fitness reqmnt asks that the Scout "show improvement" over a 30 day period. This CANNOT be the same 30 day period that was done back when he was a Web. (didn't we discuss rank requirement "adjustments" before?) How can a BS who has a TF badge that was "expressed" thru the rank be compared to one that has not? The same arguments are made elsewhere in these forums. #3. I know of a Troop that , when the boy has his TF (and to my knowledge, there are no shortcuts here with them), they then teach the First Aid Merit Badge ( the instructor is an emergency room physician) to them and use THAT certification for the Second Class requirement also. Comes First Class, the requirements are reviewed, but since the boy already has the FA MB, he is expected to be ready for the review. It is not automatic. Is a 12 year old SC Scout an authority in First Aid? #4. Back when I was a fledgling Scout, one was not allowed to earn MBs until one had the FC badge. So it was a cumulative thing. Fexample, The SC first aid led to the FC first aid and the FA MB built on the knowledge (neckerchief tourniquets?) garnered in the time spent practicing for the first three ranks. There was also a time restriction. You HAD to wait three months for each of your ranks. One could not do ALL the requirements and be awarded the first three ranks at the first CoH that came along. (I've seen this happen of late. Is it right? I'm not sure I like the idea.) #5. So over all, I am NOT in favor of expressing a Scout thru his ranks. The practice, the teaching of skills to younger Scouts, are all part of the METHOD. It is good for SC Scouts to teach TF candidates. Let the nascent AoL Scout show his proficiency to his SM for the Scout badge, and then move on... YiS

Tandems are a serious sub culture in the World of Cycling. There are races, clubs, time trials, magazines devoted to Tandems. Just as with single seats, one can be as frugal or as profligate as one wishes. $300 or $30,000 ("nicely equipped", as the auto ads say). Unfortunately I am far removed from my bicycling days, rich and varied as they were. I'll not bore you with those details. But after reviewing the Cycling MB requirements, I see no reason why a Tandem could not be used to fulfill it. Certainly a pair of adult leaders could participate in a Scout ride on one. Perhaps it would be appropriate to require the two Scouts on a Tandem to trade positions so they could demonstrate their skill both as "stoker" (rear) and as "captain" (front). And believe me, the two positions do need different skills. Maintenance requirements are the same, perhaps even more rigorous for the slightly more complex mechanism. Trip planning requirements would be the same. So go for it! YiS Willy Nelson* and Gene Autry** *on the road again... ** back in the saddle again(This message has been edited by SSScout)

Wow, the luxury of having a seperate RT Commish for Cubs and Boys (note the distinction: I feel all of them younguns are SCOUTS. We have Cubs and Boys)> We have ONE RTCm and then we divide up as possible for our seperate discussions. Our District is in the throes of reorganizing and rebuilding the interconnection between units. I would counsel the following: Make sure you have an accurate District Roster of Units and Leaders. This should include the District Leadership at the front, for all to contact as desired. Then include Unit number, CO, where they meet and when, CCh, CM, SM,phone numbers, addresses, (shudder) emails?. If this information is not collected, you can't use it. If you have it, you have no excuse not to use it. Introduce yourself to as many of your constituency as you can. Call and INVITE folks to come to RT. This roster should be in the hands of all the District folks, and (why not?) every Cub, Boy and Ventuer leader. Encourage cooperation, inter-unit activities (esp. small units). Find out what they might like to see/hear at RT. Make the time fun, useful and worthwhile (or mirthwhile, as one RT commish once said to me). (don't forget the ribs and slaw). Programs::: Make a calender and ask folks to sign up to lead a night. Could be about the monthly theme, or not. Once upon a time, the Cub theme was "Circus of the Stars". Fellow signed up for it, and instead of Circus acts, he taught Astronomy! Marvelous! KIS MIF YiS K-ingIS&F(This message has been edited by SSScout)

Robvio:::Hey, and add my welcome to all the rest. What they said, and here's my nickles worth (inflation): Don't just say to the TC: "hey, I need..." but say to SOMEONE:: "Jack, could you help me with..." or "Betty, would you know how to..." I find asking PEOPLE will gain the help, but just ASKING often doesn't. Good Scouting to you. YiS asking away

Howdy Boothil, greetings from the right coast. 50degrees here, soon to be 20 this weekend, sez the tv weatherman. You have four main tasks ahead of you (personal exp.) 1) Get together with some likeminded boys and adults and plan out one or two easy trips as examples.Check with local parks people. Local trails, parks, etc. Ask the local District DE or Camp chair for suggestions. One or two miles in, camp, one or two miles out. 2) Convince the Troop Committee (I hope you already have the agreement of the SM!!) that your rut is getting uncomfortable. Too much car camping can make a Troop sick if not lead to a slow death. 3) Your SM takes the plans to the PLC and gains their agreement. Schedule a trip in the spring, another a month later, a little longer perhaps.. Here, the "older boys" get the chance to teach camp skills. Troop meetings can be planned around First Class skills (all of which are camp related, yes? ) and the Patrols encouraged to work together to camp, cook, share the load as a PATROL. 4) The SM and you must give the SPL the responsibility and back him up in all this. Communication is the key. Nothing happens with out calling, asking, assigning, following up. Your SPL and his ASPLs and PLC will rise to the occasion, given the chance. Good Scouting to you! YiS

Yep, what they said. The boy is father to the man. He will be what he has been. He is a Scout, to be sure, but he is not only a Scout. Let him proudly show what he has accomplished, even as a boy. As your boy looks over his shoulder to see where he's come from, remind him to not get a kink in his neck from dwelling on the past and not paying attention to his next possibilities. Congratulations, Scout. You done good. Congratulations, mom. You done good, too. YiS

I wouldn't call it 'reatricting', necessarily. Put unofficially, my take on Scout badges (Tiger on up...) is that their earning is intended to 1)encourage the trying of new activities 2) reinforce good, healthy behavior 3) encourage the attainment of life enhancing (even survival) skills and 4) help boost the boys self-esteem. Especially in Cubs (but also in BS) often one is encouraging the adult in the above categories, too. The parent often learns along with the boy. If one learns how to ride the Public Transit System, all of the above categories have been fulfilled. If you then ride the PTS everyday (to work, to school, etc.), yeah, you can say you are fulfilling those categories again and again, but not for the first time. We don't award the First Class badge every time a boy cooks over a campfire and comes home safe from a 7 mile hike in the woods, just when he shows the first time that he can do it safely. Perhaps the "Gold Star" on the fridge routine could be suggested for safely coming home each day on the school bus or sitting down with dad to hear a story. I know some younguns that enjoyed that sort of positive reinforcement to help them to concentrate on what needed to be done. A gold star earned for one occasion, so many (?7?10?20?) earns a movie night or some other reward, just not another bead! Lordy, how you gonna walk with all those beads dragging on the floor? Trips up a fellas feet, it does. YiS Beads and all.

"It's what we do" Yes. I like that.

Boy, these forums do bring jog the memory. (Theres a topic... forms of exercise... memory jogging, down alist running, but I digress) I remember when my folks and I were filling out the Eagle applications that there was a request for "letters of reference" from a number (3?) of non-Scout people that could vouch for the applicants "character, citizenship and worth" as I remember. This reference stuff was new to me. Perhaps it was only Council required, I don't know. But there was included a form letter to send to the requested referencers. Who to ask? School counselor? Teacher? Camp counselor from a non scout camp? Clergyman? Family friend? Coach? Past employer? I think one of them was Mr. Vonessen, my school Counselor. I really don't remember who we asked. I suppose sometime in the not so distant future, I may be asked to serve in some capacity about an Eagle applicants application (TBOR? DBOR? Advisor? DAC? My sons application? Hasn't happened yet...) so then I'll have to think about whether Reference Letters are "required" or not NOW. I can only testify to some dimly remembered past... Perhaps once upon a time, there was a "requirement", but it has been TWEAKED to a phone call, or a email, or a suggestion...

"OOOH NO MR. BILL!" "Spoonerism: a transposition usually initial sounds of two or more words, thus: '...he quoted a white horse souse...' for 'white house source'. hoobert heever... ?sister mouse matter?

I think it great that you are working for your boy(s) to have the Scouting experience, whereever you might be. Waaay back when, my Scout Troop had a SM that had a cousin who had a brother in law who knew someone who owned some wooded property not too far away (something like that). The Troop fathers got together and organized our own summer camp. In the seasons before we held it, weekends were spent building a Quartermaster's cabin with telephone company donated poles. We cleared tent sites, dammed the creek for a swimmin' hole, dug and built a privy, cleared out and capped the spring on the property. And so "Camp Freedom" was created. Our Troop not only attended the Council camp, but always held our own weeklong summer camp there. Each Patrol also had the option of a weekend campout there if we couldn't come up with a new Park to visit. "Camp Freedom" was our camp, long after I ceased to be a Scout. "The Property" as it was called, eventually became a religious retreat center, so it didn't lose all its purpose. What I'm trying to say is that, I think with a little prayer and planning your group will find the place to develope your own camp? Somebody near you may have a bit of forest they wouldn't mind loaning. Good luck.... YiS on the property... (This message has been edited by SSScout)

Greetings, Ryan: Welcome to our electronic crackerbarrel and/or roundtable. (Trev: I've told you, microprocessors just don't get along well with CAMPFIRES. They tend to melt!) I've seen many Troops that conduct most if not all of the religious ceremony. When I earned my G&C way back when, my class arranged and led easily about 50 minutes of the whole UMC service. The CO pastor just sat back and smiled. We chose the hymns, the readings, we wrote the responsive reading(all about the Scout Law). I still have the program from it among my souvenirs. The Troop I belonged to attended services of the faiths to which many of our boys belonged, both during "Scout Sunday" (or saturday) and other occasions . I remember attending Jewish synagogues, Catholic sevices, Baptist churches among others. Everybody eventually has to find their own "place in the choir". If the boys faith does not permit them to attend another faiths service (there's a religious word...service), for whatever reason, well, that's the way that is. He's still a Scout. The Troop I presently am attached to is sponsored by a UMC, and I happen to be a Quaker (as is my son), but I would never think of limiting my sons choice of worship, should he ask to "try out" another faith. At Meeting, his First Day School (read sunday school) class does 'comparative religions' every so often, trading classes with other local churches and temples. And he brings home some interesting discussions, to be sure. The Troop and the CO UMC have no present plans to 'take over' the Scout Sunday worship, but that could change as the new pastor gets educated to the way of the Scout. (Scout Tao? Trev?) Ryan : Listen to your folks and faith leaders. Learn their truths and as you discern your "duty to God", make the Scout Sunday service your own. YiS and Christ.

Where is there any disagreement here? For a boy or girl to take pride in being a Scout, how wonderful is that? At a friends wedding, another friends son wore his Cub Scout Uniform to the ceremony. The boy considered the uniform HIS formal wear. I would certainly wear my adult uniform to a Girl Scout Court of Honor. I would expect any brother of a Girl Scout being awarded the "Gold " would wear his full uniform in her honor. Of course its appropriate. At the funeral of a man who was the Cubmaster of my sons pack before I was Cubmaster, I went to work that morning and then changed out of my work uniform and into my Scout uni before I entered the church. The man was (among other things) a Doctor in the Navy, and the Naval folks all attended in uniform, in his honor. When is there a bad time to wear the uni? YiS dressed...(This message has been edited by SSScout)

evmori: Mega congrats! I hope someone was awarded a "translator" strip for ASL?

What Beavah said AND... It may be more a 'you can't make me' thing developing with the parents. Any observation of the dynamics between boy and dad? The boy may not want to admit he'd like to be more Scoutish because that would be admitting that his dad is right about something... Make the opportunities available, keep your interest in him open, give him 'attaboys' when you can. He may be missing the dad factor somewhere. Praise him when you can IN FRONT OF THE PARENTS. Let them see the good you see and listen to and watch their reaction. YiS

Paranoia.... "The chances of being eaten by a tiger in the middle of Main St. may be a million to one, but once is enough." back to the topic... So it seems we have a LOSS of membership, both absolute and relative to the pool of possible members. And we seem to have an INCREASE in Eagle awards, both absolute and relative to possible award earners and relative to past years... Does this equate to an easing of the requirements and/or a greater desire on the part of the possible earners and/or a greasing of the ways (JohninKC: more E MBs for S & L)(MB mills), and/or more competitive parents pressure and/or ....?

Now, as a 'temporarily able' person, I would guess that OGEs Scout was required to meet some "officially" adjusted requirements (which means they are "official program") from the "normal" requirements for otherwise "able" Scouts. ? I think such ideas are fascinating. When I see a FC badge on a Scout, I would expect that that Scout would have the same skills and basic knowledge as any other FC Scout. Now, tactilly, I would not expect a blind Scout to be required to identify Poison Ivy in HIS way (touch!), but how would he identify it MY way (visual description?) ? Does one just say "it can't be done" and pass on? Perhaps rubber gloves? FC Scouts of my era needed knowledge of Morse Code and Wig Wag signalling (dot to left= patrol patch, dash to right= troop patch). Not so today. Is this "official adjustment" a bad thing?

"Aye, the Pirates Code...We been thinkin', it's more like 'guidelines' anyway... arrrgh!" So we install windows in all the church classroom doors... we hold SM conferences on the bench in the hallway and passerbyes just know to ignore them...we make it a point to never be in PRIVATE conversation with only ONE Scout... If the young Scout is having a nightmare in his tent, we make sure the tent flaps are wide open and we sit at the tent door to comfort him...most important, we show and discuss "It happened to me" and remind the parents to discuss the pamphlet that comes in the front of all Scout handbooks... and then we get back to the original topic... Question: If the "adjusting" of the "program" can be "good" or "bad", can anyone tell me about any "impaired" Scouts (pick an impairment: visual, wheelchair, mental/emotional, MD, Polio, etc.) who were awarded their Eagle and how the "program" was tweaked for them? Was this appropriate? or (shiver) wrong?

Perhaps 'cops' is too strong a term. Sounds like a punisher. I watched the show 'Cops' last night in between new years music shows and steamed shrimp with the family ( good new years eve party, small and intimate, ya know?). One of the 'cops' said he saw his job as keeping the streets open and safe, and reminding people what they ought to do. Catching and punishing bad guys was the last thing he WANTED to do. Perhaps 'Program Uncle'? I kinda remember my uncle Melvin as a fellow who was just sort of there when I needed to be reminded about what I 'ought' to do. Isn't that the promise? "On my honor, I promise to do my best, to do what I ought to do..." YiS some more