scoutldr

Buy more binders.

Just received my 2005 Scout Catalog in the mail yesterday. Some observations: In order to be "properly uniformed", a Cub scout parent will have to buy 4 neckerchiefs, 3 slides, 4 caps, 3 belt buckles, 3 socks, at least two different uniforms (blue and khaki), by the time a tiger cub bridges over to a scout troop. The red wool jac-shirt is now $152-$157 ... well out of reach of most scouts and scouters. Adult BSA shorts are $40-$45. Venturing shorts are $48. Venturing trousers are $66. If you think the uniform is "uncool", you can buy an "Aloha" shirt. It must be official, 'cause it's in the catalog, right? Now for you who like "Class B" uniforms, you can choose between an "Activity shirt" or a "Boy Scout Action Shirt". All of our dutch ovens are now obsolete. We need to throw them out and buy "official BSA" dutch ovens with the FDL cast into the lid (at about twice the price, it appears). My point to this rant is this...the BSA suppply division should concentrate on providing high quality uniforms and specialized progam items at an affordable price. All other stuff we can get from WalMart or the retailer of our choice.

Just received my new 2005 catalog yesterday. It appears the Tiger Cub belt is the same as the Cub Scout belt, except for the logo stamped on it. (military style web belt with brass buckle)

Why would anyone want to do this? Because that's what their parents subconsciously teach them. Their view of "achievement" is to make sure their little "Johnnie" gets more merit badges and makes Eagle as early as possible. Then they can move on to the next goal...soccer, football, drama, Tae Kwon Do, etc. From their earliest days, kids today are on a schedule. Both parents work, so the "after school" hours need to be tightly structured in order to "get it all in". Kids have no time to just be kids and "go outside and play". They don't have time to smell the roses along the scouting trail...they need to participate in too many different activities before they go off to college. The parents bring them to meetings on Monday night - that's our window of opportunity. Don't expect them to think Scouting on Tuesday or Thursday too...don't have time. IMHO, this leads to the mentality that "I just need the badge, I don't have time to work at it. I don't have time to do it over. I don't have time to meet with a counsellor on Saturday because that's soccer practice." So, I'll show up one hour a week and stay awake ... and at the end I expect a badge. If I don't get it the first time, forget it. I'm already on to the next "achievement."

I was having my feelings hurt...I posted this 24 hrs ago and it says "Read 0 times". Don't people like me??? Then I noticed that ALL the threads now say "Read 0 times"...even the ones with a whole string of replies. Anyway, here it is for another 24 hrs.

Any unit that would "die" if one person leaves is in serious trouble. It is the Unit Commissioner's job to anticipate and diagnose problems like this and work with the Committee to implement change. Call your District Commissioner and get him/her involved....soon.

The difference between Candid Camera and camp hazing is that the "victims" on CC have to sign a release agreeing to their humiliation being made public. That's not to say that I consider snipe hunts, smoke shifters and bacon stretchers to be "hazing". In my mind, they are cherished Scouting memories of a good time.

Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat training now are available online. I have not taken them both to completion, but allegedly a course completion certificate will print out at the end. Both are accessible from the same link. See at: http://www.scouting.org/pubs/aquatics

I serve on the District Committee and frequently sit on Eagle Boards as the District Rep. While we do review the candidate's records (application, blue cards, project write up, reference letters, etc), that is not the primary reason we are there. Presumably, the District Advancement Committee, Troop Committee chairman, and Scoutmaster have already verified that all of the requirements have been met. The Eagle BOR is not the time nor the place to question that, nor do we. Instead, it is an enjoyable (at least on this side of the table) conversation with the candidate which explores what is in his heart and how the Scouting program has treated him along the way. The only time I had a reservation about a candidate (and I have related this in a previous thread) was when a candidate obviously had no religious component to his home life and could not answer what "A Scout is Reverent" means. My conclusion was that the "program" failed...not the Scout. Someone who had totally missed the "Duty to God" thing should never have been recommended for our highest rank.

If I may join y'all on the Group W bench, I have to say this is one of the best discussions we have had here...and nails a point that has been in my craw for years. Today's average 12 year old has been raised to think that his self-esteem is sacrosanct and woe be unto anyone who hurts his feelings by "requiring" him to do something at which he may not succeed, or doesn't want to do because it may require some discomfort or sweat. I fear for the future as these young people, used to doing just enough to "get by" rise into positions of power and responsibility.

The first thing you need to do is catalog, date and value the collection. A good reference to use is "Guide to US Scouting Collectibles" by George Cuhaj. You can get this on Amazon.com, or on Ebay. Scouting collectibles by themselves are relatively inexpensive, which is good for collectors, but bad for you. Depending on what you have, an item could be worth 5 bucks, or a thousand. Some first edition OA flaps go for $1ooo or more. Most go for $5-10. Other items can be grouped to bring a higher price, e.g. if you have a complete set of items from a World Jamboree, or a complete uniform from the 1930s. As with anything else, the key to value is rarity and condition. Preferred patches will be "mint and unsewn". If you have questions on specific items, feel free to send me a Private message, and I'll be glad to look it up for you. Just a caution...most antique dealers have no idea what scouting items are or what they are worth...I have seen a wide range of prices in shops, most of them way too high.

Bad back, bad knees, CPAP machine for sleep apnea...so I don't do "backpacking" any more, although I earned three 50 miler awards as a youth. I let the younger dads handle that now. It's good to know that it's something I need to ask about when (if) I "request to be invited" to take WB. Thanks for the info.

What does the "Outpost Hike" entail? Now that I'm too old and decrepit to go to Philmont, I hate to think that WB is now off=limits, too.

We all post here under a "nom de plume". So did other famous writers, such as O. Henry, Mark Twain, Franklin W. Dixon, Carolyn Keene, and Victor Appleton (the last three were all the same person, as I recall.) Nothing "untrustworthy" about it, but it does not give one license to be rude. I chose not to post a personal profile, because I wish to remain anonymous. If I decide to call my DE a "twit", as someone else did once, I prefer he not know it was him and who said it. Pro-vol relations are hard enough without calling each other names in public. I also prefer to ask questions and make comments without being seen as putting my Council "on report".

As a Dist Training Chairman, I did the majority of my training on weeknights, simply because all the other districts were doing all day Saturdays. The weeknight courses were very popular, and I ended up training more people from other districts than I did my own. If you need training at other times, contact your DTC...it's within his/her discretion to schedule training whenever needed. I agree with a lot of the comments above, and I hope National is lurking. It is very frustrating to Units, Scouters and training chairmen to get all these Cubbers trained, only to have them move up in the program and become "Untrained" again. Couple that with a highly transient military community, and I could not get my training stats above 35% at any given time, even with a throughput of hundreds. 100% trained leadership is a nice goal, but it's not reality any more. I like the idea of annual updates...perhaps on-line a la Youth Protection training, where the Scouter can get the information at his/her own leisure and automatically update the training record at Council. Character Connection??? Never heard of it. You'd think as trainers and District Committee people, we would be the first to get information on new program changes. I just purchased some old copies of "Scouting Magazine" from 1967-68. For several months, there was a program insert detailing the new "Webelos" program (when the Lion rank was discontinued and the Webelos Badge, "colors" and activity pins were introduced). Perhaps this new info is in Scouting and Boys' Life, and we just don't pay close attention to it? I'm guilty, too ...

Let me guess...Won Ton Ton is a Shar Pei?

It's been snowing all day (rare for this area), so I just finished watching my new DVD, "Follow Me, Boys". ::sniff, sniff:: Anyone got a Kleenex?

I will also add my thanks for this forum. It reflects a lot of hard work and devotion of time, not only by the forum owner, but to those who post in an effort to make the Scouting program stronger and more effective for the youth whom we all serve. Countless more users are reading and searching, also taking their time for a better understanding of the Scouting Movement. I only ask that the "Rules" be enforced fairly across the board, regardless of how "knowledgeable" the offender is. Rudeness and name-calling is never becoming of a Scouter or Scout and has no place here. Merry Christmas to all, and to all, a good night.

Great web site! It might be easier if you group all "event patches" in one category. Keeping these up to date will be a constant challenge as new patches are earned. You could just say "patches earned for participation in events are considered 'Temporary Patches' and are worn centered on the right pocket. Only one patch may be worn on the uniform at a time, but the choice of patch worn is up to the wearer. Those patches not worn on the uniform may be worn on a patch vest or blanket." I would also add a link to the BSA Uniform Inspection sheets, which show proper placement of uniform insignia. These can be found in .pdf format at http://www.scouting.org/forms/

We don't have an argument. It's included in their annual recharter fee and is not optional. Our troop has been chartered for 12 years and has been 100% BL every year. Never had anyone object. I read once that there are several versions of BL, based on age. The Tiger Cub will get a different version than the Venturer will.

Just some random thoughts: - Perhaps training should have an expiration date (like 5 years), a la CPR training. If you don't have a current card, you're not "TRAINED". Would apply to WB, SM specific, etc. This would ensure that the "old timers" stay current. Probably would not be a problem for Cubbers, since most don't stay in the program that long. BSA comes out with new training, new program changes, new uniforms on a periodic basis, and we all need to be updated with the new info. The downside is that BSA will have to bite the bullet and keep the training materials current, which they don't do very well now. - If the Boy Scouting program is supposed to be "boy-led", why are we focusing all those training hours on adults? Shouldn't it be reversed? How many councils and districts still do JLTC in an organized, well-prepared manner with the same attention, fervor and enthusiasm that they put into a Wood Badge course? What is the "mountain-top" training experience for the average youth (who does not happen to be Lodge Chief)? Heck, if we're good enough at it, we could even look into getting academic credit for it. - When I do training, one of the first things I tell them is "this is not your Father's BSA"...disarm the Eagles right off the bat (I am one), and let them know that we are all starting from the same point...learning the 2004 version of the BSA program. - The BSA program will theoretically work well if everyone does their jobs as they are trained. If there is a weak link, the program will be weak. One of the biggest "broken links" in the program is the Commissioner Corps. Units are allowed to run amuck because there aren't enough Unit Commissioners and most of the ones we have don't do anything except strut around with a coffee cup. Hence, when one does show up, they are looked at as "the spy from Council." If problems are found with the way the unit leaders are operating, do they send a report to the CO? After all, it's "their program" and they are the ones who signed the charter, not the unit leaders. THey need to know that "their" unit leader selection process needs improvement. - BSA charters the program to COs who agree to follow the BSA program. Who's out there training the COs and CORs so that they have a fighting chance of knowing what a "good" program is supposed to look like? How many CORs attend District Meetings and vote on District matters affecting "their" units, which is one of their primary responsibilities. Are we too quick to condemn "those stupid CORs who won't attend District meetings", or are we pointing the finger at those who are too anxious to get new units on the books without letting the COs know what is expected of them? How many CORs get a phone call saying "we missed you last night, is everything OK?", which is what we expect the youth leaders to do when a Scout doesn't show up?

The "VX" merit badge was Hiking. The V and X were roman numerals signifying 5 and 10 miles. There is a black shoe in the middle with an "XX" on it, signifying 20 miles. The rectangular patch with the harp is "Musician", which was used by some troops who had bands or drum and bugle corps...I've seen it worn on the right sleeve, left sleeve and there is a 1930s uniform shirt on eBay right now with one sewn on the right pocket. It is relatively rare. You are correct on the SM and SA badges. The ones with mylar borders signified "Trained" leaders. I don't know of a web site of historical insignia. Best bet is to get an Insignia Guide or other literature of that era.

I'm all for guidelines. But let's apply them equally across the board to all.

The BW Admiration Society thread.

I recently resigned as training chair after two years. My observations: -Most Scouters do not do Fast Start and have no idea it is available on line -Cub training is hard to present, and hard to keep people trained. The "specific" courses have huge overlaps of information and there is little "specific" that would justify 5 different sessions. -SM specific is excellent, but should be required for all Boy Scouters. The Troop Committee needs to know this stuff, too. -The most important people in the organization are the CORs and they get NO training. -Trainer Development Conference is a waste of a day. MOst come away very disappointed. -Pack Trainers are nonexistent. They should be doing the majority of Cub training. -The main deterrent from taking WB is the cost. Do we really need custom made T-shirts, hats, mugs and jackets for each course? It's training...not an exclusive country club. WHy did I resign? I was teaching solo every course that was sponsored by the district...when I did get "help" from people recruited by the DE, they were the "old timers" who liked to ramble about how they did it 25 years ago and didn't have a clue what was in the syllabus. Then the Executive Board decided that training should be "mandatory" and to meet the demand, any warm body in the Council Service Center was told to "go do training". Some of these new "trainers" (new DEs and even clerical staff) wouldn't know a cub scout if one bit him on the knee, but hey, just go read the syllabus to them and play the videos. How hard can it be? At least we get "TRAINED" strips on everyone and make Quality Council. Another observation...training is probably the ONLY opportunity we have to present and market the program, motivate leaders, and inspire them on to other positions. If it is done poorly, by inexperienced trainers, or with material that is irrelevant, redundant or condescending (ditto about the bridge thing), we fail and they won't be back. Fool me once... Put me in the camp that thinks a major training overhaul is needed, and soon! If for no other reason than to fix things to correspond to program changes over the past 5 years. It got embarrassing to be told by a new Tiger DL.."we don't do it that way any more"...