scoutldr

I also remember these from the 60's/70's...I think they were called "Scoreboards". I still have mine in a drawer somewhere. It's all we used. When I visited the coucil shop at National Capital Area Council in Bethesda, MD a few years ago, they were still had some on the shelves.

Anarchist said,"give them little jobs like long range planning, summer camp research, trek possiblity research,..." Just make sure they don't fall into the pattern of doing the PLC's work for them. We have this same issue with OA chapter meetings. Frequently we have just as many adults show up as youth, and they sit around the back of the room socializing. I find it distracting and a bit rude while the Chief is trying to conduct a meeting. The key is, if they are going to show up, make sure they have something constructive to accomplish....if they want to socialize and chit-chat, they need to be somewhere else.

Since I found the same program (and patches) independently in two different councils, I thought maybe it was one of those programs that was recognized nationally but not adopted universally, (such as Mic-O-Say...which I had never heard of until reading this forum).

How about staying for the fun and making lifelong friends? More than 35 years later, I still keep in touch with some of my Scout buddies...and it's comforting to know that I can go anywhere in the world and flash the scout sign and have a friend and brother Scout respond.

Contrary to popular belief, life does not end at 52. I will be 52 in Sept and I'm just thankful that I don't have a 7 year old like one of my co-workers the same age. My sons are 27 and 24, have full time jobs and are done with college. Just when I thought life was going to get easier and I would finally have some disposable income, my mother in law moved in with us. I still do scouting as a troop CC and district committee, but am seriously considering pulling back and devoting some time to me. Can't get past the guilt feelings that if I quit the troop, so will the SM and ASM...two buddies who started the troop with me and both of whose sons are also grown and gone and have no reason to stay. I've been searching for successors, but no one wants to step up to the plate. If we leave, the troop will probably fold.

Being home sick for 2 days (bad back), I have been surfing a lot. I have come across this program in two different Councils (Texas and Utah), using the same requirements and "Quality Leader" emblems (worn in place of or in addition to the "Trained" strip). It appears to be administered by the Commissioner Corps. Since this is in more than one council, is it a National program? I'm just amazed I've never seen nor heard of it before...it is not used in my Council, but I just may suggest it. Is anyone else familiar with this program? The requirements seem pretty rigorous. http://www.longhorndistrict.org/training/qualityleader.htm (This message has been edited by scoutldr)

Our camp also restricts vehicle traffic in camp. Upon check=in, one "gear vehicle" is allowed to unload at the site. Then it must be returned to the parking lot. This is for a)safety and b) to reduce wear and tear on the dirt roads, especially in wet weather. Invariably, there are one or two who feel that they can leave their vehicle in the site and they need to be told to move them. The roads are primarily for emergency vehicle access, deliveries to the dining hall, and for the Ranger to make his rounds for maintenance and trash pickup.

Having just re-read the description of BALOO training, the two operative words that stand out are "Outdoor" and "Overnight". Indeed the term BALOO is an acronym that stands for "Basic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation". It is designed for cub scout camping. I don't think that a "field trip" to the aquarium qualifies as "camping" and therefore requiring BALOO and a council site inspection. I am on the Council camping committee...we do not inspect the site every time a unit wants to do a "lock in" or other such event. We do publish a list of approved sites for Cub Camping....they are all campgrounds. The more important and apropos training that ALL adults should have for an event like this would be YP. Just my opinion.

Once the rank is awarded (BOR passed), there is no looking back. It's not the scout's fault, as you said, and we never penalize a scout for the ignorance or incompetence of the adults. There is a need for some retraining (or initial training?) of the unit leadership so that it doesn't happen again.

"Judging" is such a hard word. Indirectly, the professionals are evaluated on the program end. To make Quality District, 60% of the units need to make Quality Unit. Those requirements involve delivery of the program as well as recruiting. A DE who consistently fails to lead his district to the QD award will face a closed door session with his boss. So, a DE's career is dependent on his/her ability to encourage, cajole, persuade and coerce volunteers to do the many and sundry jobs that need doing, without any real hammer or power to do so. Not an enviable position. Most of them earn far less than the job's worth when you consider the hours, hard work and frustration involved with working with old curmudgeon scouters who were Silver Beavers before he was born.

A charter is a contract between the CO and the BSA. I don't know if a third party can enter into that contract, especially if they are in different districts. As I said before, you need to have your DE(s) involved.

I have also observed what you are observing. There seems to be a certain cadre of Scouters who are "chosen" and seem to be involved in everything. They are "STAFF" at every camporee, district dinner, summer camp, ordeal, work day, fall fellowship, roundtable, chapter meeting, district meeting, etc, etc. They are the ones who go to Jambo EVERY time, to the exclusion of others. They are the ones who go to Philmont training sessions, Nat'l camp school, Wood Badge, etc. THey have received every award possible and have rows of square knots. Am I jealous? Sort of. OTOH, I have a full time, year-round non-scouting career and a home life. I have a limited amount of vacation time I can dedicate to scouting (about 2 weeks a year avg), especially now that both sons have aged out. So, I don't hope to become part of the "in-crowd", even though I've been in this Council since 1963. Some of them are teachers who have summers off...or are retired and are up at Camp working 3 days a week. So they have a lot more "free" time than I. They are more visible, and quite frankly they do a lot more for the Council than I am able to do. They are the "go-to" people who get things done. Most of them have no ties to a Unit any more and therefore aren't burdened by having to run BORs, or attend weekend campouts, and indeed, unit scouters should be focused on serving their units first. I was at a Council Camping committee meeting the other night, and at age 51, I was the youngest in the room by at least 10 years. The oldest was 84 and he can still work circles around me. They are in it for them...it is their social life...for some it's all they have, and Scouting benefits as a byproduct, so it's not a bad thing. I have found a pattern in Scouting...the more you do, the more you will be asked to do...and the 80/20 rule is alive and well. The new rules about course staffing may ease your concerns. As I understand it, you can only staff or direct a WB course once. So, once you get the third and fourth beads, you're done.

Ditto here. App and background check required. No fee. YP online strongly encouraged, but not sure if it's enforced. MBC training offered, but not required.

Welcome to the forums, Douglass. Let me try to be more "helpful" and provide an answer. The short answer to your question is NO. Repeat, NO! Advancement requirements may NOT be waived or modified by a troop committee. There is a process for requesting alternative advancement requirements for medical reasons, but there must be medical documentation and the alternative plan MUST be approved by the District/Council Advancement committees and/or the Council Scout Executive. Contact your District Advancement Committee chairman for more information. One of the cardinal rules of the BSA is that we may neither add nor subtract from the requirements.

Might I suggest that you get a copy of the training manual and see what it is you're supposed to be teaching? As I recall, everything is pretty well scripted, and there is an exercise where the students are asked to properly place insignia on a paper shirt.

When I became a DL in the 80's, I proudly paid my lodge dues and sewed on the flap (pre FDL) that I was issued at my Ordeal in 1968. I wore it until a collector explained to me what it was worth! Now I wear the current flap, worth about 5 bucks retail.

If you have DEs who do not do their jobs, then go for it. Too bad they will get the credit for forming new units when it comes time for a raise! To paraphrase dsteele, "what the pros won't do, the volunteers must!" I agree, a $400 membership fee is a non-starter.

Sounds like you are doing your DE's job for him. You should at least ensure he is aware and is offered the opportunity to meet with them. He is the one who is trained and charged with meeting with prospective COs and "selling" them the program. Perhaps he would like to visit both and start 2 units???(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

NESA is already an association of Eagle Scouts, and I think they grant scholarships. Although I am a member, they are not real active in this council as a separate organization, in spite of several attempts to start.

You need at least three MC to hold a proper BOR. You need a CC to have a charter. I would say the answer depends on the size of the troop. As to the training issue, it's unrealistic. Are you to tell all parents that they are no longer welcome on overnights because they haven't been trained? According to BSA policy, any parent can attend and observe (but not necessarily lead) any scout function.

I have over 250 transactions on ebay without a problem. There are many bargains to be had, including brand new items with tags still attached. If you are wary about credit card security, use Pay Pal, which is a third party payment system. The seller never sees your credit card number. I have tried selling on ebay, but it is time intensive, tracking your items and then packing and shipping. Sometimes the shipping and handling fees sound high, but properly packing and shipping a coffee mug cost me over $5 in actual cost. Most patches can be sent for the price of a postage stamp.

When I die, one of my regrets will be that I can't have a flag on my casket, because I am not a veteran. The funeral director will probably not go along with that. I would suggest that perhaps a scout or two could read a scriptural passage (make sure the scout is a good reader) that is appropriate to scouting. How about finding a verse from the Bible that illustrates each point of the Scout Law (or Girl Scout law)? Or, more simply, round up all the scouts you can find (Boy, Girl and Venturers) and just show up in uniform and sit together. Your mere presence will speak volumes.

For Scouting to work, it requires family volunteer involvement. Moms and Dads working to deliver the program. Recent CDC statistics show that 68% of black babies are born out of wedlock, compared to 27% of white babies. I can only conclude that Scouting's values are simply not important to this sector of the community, which is failing to provide the most basic parental supervision to its children. A significant percentage of these "parents" are children themselves, with zero parenting skills. It has nothing to do with funding or poverty. It has to do with keeping your pants zipped because it's the morally straight and mentally awake thing to do. If there is no solid foundation of family values, including a 2 parent family unit, why would Scouting be a priority? Also not meaning to come across as racist...but the statistics don't lie. Money can't fix everything.

The camping requirement also includes a long term camp of at least 6 days/5 nights as part of the 15. Sounds like the scout maybe did not meet the camping requirement, but all he heard was "2 years".

The last requirement listed is important. Any modification of requirements must be approved by the Council Advancement Committee with proper medical documentation. It's not enough for the SM to decide, "he did his best".