Fuzzy Bear

Hi, LO, FB

We didn't have Eagle Projects when I was a Scout. We had Good Turn Projects as part of our advancement. I have always liked the change. It is positive and brings recognition to our Slogan. It gives credence to the work and elevates it to a level of worth. Many outside of Scouting are aware that Scouts really are helpful because of that change. FB

Jeremy's Dad and I had been friends and had worked on many events together. When Jeremy was a Wolf Cub, he brought him to a campout. That evening I told him that I had been observing the moon and I noticed movement, probably Moon People. He believed me and got scared but his Dad told him that there really wasn't any movement or Moon People, so we all had a good laugh. A few short years later, Jeremy and I canoed down the river together for the last time. Neither of us knew it was the last time so that was never a thought. He took the lead in the bow and did an adequate job for a beginner. He wore his high top socks and sun burned his legs to the shorts line which he displayed to everybody that afternoon while standing on the table. (*He called it a Scout tan.) He was a short Scout with a funny grin and a good sense of humor. The next day we hit the rapids and over we went right into the drink. It was just fine for both of us because we were not worried about getting wet. We had just enjoyed the speed, the water and the excitement of it all. On the last day, we decided that we would race everyone so off we went to the destination point at full throttle. We paddled like wild people. We finally pulled into the bank and both of us jumped out and were laughing and hollering at all of the stragglers. In November after the canoe trip in August, Jeremy developed Juvenile onset Diabetes but the doctors could not figure it out in time. We buried Jeremy a few weeks later. That has been over ten years ago. I am still amazed that the world could produce such a wonderful Scout and then promptly lose him to the ages. His parents will never understand it or any of us that knew him. Life provides us with extremes that are absolutely real. It is allot like going down the river for the last time with Jeremy. I was truly privileged to be a small part of such a wonderful life as I know you were with Willie. FB

Good story. Being prepared is also knowing when the wind will blow before the storm comes on the horizon, even at night. FB

Starwolfmom, Tell your husband that the secret to a full life does not revolve arond that one missed opportunity. In Scouting, there are bucket fulls of opportunities that are availble to him. They generally involve only one hour a week. We are glad to have you out from the shawdows. Fuzzy Bear

Welcome Eric, We welcome you here. I hope you find something that you are looking for and you are able to help a few of us find what we lost. Fuzzy Bear

I have been a Unit Commissioner. Generally speaking, a person must be accepted within the group before changes are welcome. FB

Good Luck on your search. I hope you find what you are looking for. Sorry I can't point you in the right direction. FB

SWScouter, welcome. Thanks for sharing part of your story. I think you will find some interesting people and discussions right here among us. Sometimes we even share our emotions, deep, shallow and fervent. A better time was never had around such a campfire as ours. Fuzzy Bear

If a person was removed for good reasons or for bad reasons, it appears that some importance should be given to open understanding or to hear what occurred. In most areas of the United States and in many businesses, some form of due process is an accepted method of showing fairness. The "good use of power" applies balance to its' judgments because it is considered not just bad manners but an abuse to do otherwise. I would hope that if the BSA considers being part of the 21st century is important then listening to those in the opposition would find a place in the organization. Likewise, volunteers need to act in accordance with Scouting principles in all of their actions even when they feel that they have been wrongly treated. If the volunteers knew that they could be listened to and responded to fairly, then the rules of decorum would be easier to engage. Nonetheless, Scouters need to follow reasonable guidelines of response even if the organization does not support a doctrine of fairness. To do otherwise would be a violation of the Scout Oath and Law, a doctrine held high by most of us. FB

OAHB 89/89 page 121 4. Select an Indian name...from the Lenni Lenape word list. The OAHB 89/98 does not have any information in it regarding naming. Since your Advisors manual is after the 89/89 version, then you are correct and I am wrong. I will need a new and improved OAHB. FB (This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)

To elaborate a little more on Eamonn's post in reply to Mrs. Smith, children, both sexes, bought BP's book. They read it and acted it out. There was a war and he was their hero. When he returned from the war, he felt compelled to do something with what he saw. The children responded for many reasons. It did not happen overnight and he did not think it out quickly. There was an industrial revolution that changed things and there was war that changed things, as it always does. There was an economy in transition. Education was being changed as well as science and math. There was a vast upheaval and then after a few short years it was back to a world war. Children wanted and needed security and Scouting could give it to them. Scouting has always struggled between the military and Outdoors. Seton was cast out because of that very issue. Dan Beard was kept because of it. Was there adolescence before the 20th century? If there was, it was not what we know as adolescence. It may have been more subdued or done in such a way that sublimation was the correct term to explain what was happening. We do know that people have been the same or similar in many respects over the centuries. We also know that there are many cultures and many ways of bringing a youth into adulthood. How do we compare 16th century adolescence to 18th century adolescence? I guess it depends on the nation and all of the aspects of that culture to develop a baseline of comparison. We try simplifying it so that we can bring it into focus and understand it but I am not sure that we will. It is like trying to understand that there was a Rome that was vast, wealthy, and strong militarily. It had an educational system and religions and law. It stood for centuries yet, somehow it disappeared. We try to grasp with straws the complexities of the universe for the shear fun of it not to find the truth. FB

Green Bar Bill has been left out(side) before in the 70's when Scouting decided to go to the big city. Scouting then recanted and took him back for another round of outdoorsmanship when the numbers fell to an all time low. It just so happens Scouts like to go outdoors. It is one of the methods of Scouting and for a good reason. It may be that GBB was left out because he was considered one of the contributors of Scouting and not one of the Founders. I personally believe that he filled the gap from BP and Uncle Dan and became more than a contributor. Some may not agree or feel that somehow he was just one of the pack but when a person looks at the history of Scouting his name keeps coming up for allot of good reasons. For many of us, he became a symbol just like the Founders. I believe that his rightful place is to be among those of the legend. It is short sighted on the part of those that have rewrote or edited out his place. History has a way of not letting us forget what is the closest to our hearts no matter how hard people try. FB

We are not in any of those places and you can worship as you please, where you please. We are only limited by affording others their right to worship as they please. Whenever the majority decides that their way is the only way, then we will have the type of government that you speak about in China. I hope we don't go there. FB

The other side of the coin: Dad was not a member of the BSA. He had not been trained. He had not been informed. He believed it was "camp". Son obviously had not been trained. He had not been informed. He did not know what to expect and he acted in accordance with the idea of "camp". Both had been given their camp registration by well meaning adults that should have known that a Scout pays his own way. The idea being that if a person works, then they can do. If they do not work, they cannot do. If the well meaning adults expected the Scout to act responsibly, then they would have given him work to do to earn the money, same goes for Dad. In the Scout program, a person must get up and walk on their own. We do not walk for them and we do not magically heal wounds of irresponsibility. Camp is work and it is educational and it is fun but it is not just fun. FB (This message has been edited by Fuzzy Bear)

I would discourage anyone from using any other language than the Lenni Lenape as requested by the BSA. It is not a choice that is presented but if a change is needed, I would suggest writing the Natioanl Office for permission. FB

School prayer as an issue should be intellectually challenging to any person that believes in God. It appears that people are simply mad about not "doing" or being told to not do. If prayer works, if God is real, if there is any power whatsoever from an outside Source, then silent prayer from one within the school, a prayer spoken quietly from across the street, a prayer said from a family from down the street, prayers said in church loaded with believers on a Sunday before Monday morning would work what ever miracles that believers seek. Once again, God is not hard of hearing and His memory works quite well. God works in spite of no school prayer or no loud speakers or the day of the week the request is made on. Nobody can stop God, not even the Supreme Court. FB

Wojauwe The Indian name and the English translation have been registered but the definition of the acts is not registered. It has to do with who you are and what you do and how you act. The struggle was with the meaning and the lack of knowledge of the language. They got close and in most cases that is enough. The name will carry the rest of us over the edge of understanding. It was not hard to figure out from your name and a little prompting for those of us at a distance. The first clue is that the VH committee meant to find a name to honor a person of great worth. The system of naming is not for the reverse in the OA. FB

Wojauwe, I would recommend the secondary definition of Anguished Chief, same words. It implies the deeper emotion of a high aim missed from one that is generally on the mark. This does not indicate that you were Nundajelensin or Schwilawe and that you are not Tawonnalogewagan. FB

Waujawe, Thanks for you kind response. Picking up and answering a post is tricky, especially if it is not prefaced with the person's name. I am guilty of doing it. I must admit when a post is lengthy, I may read too fast and not comprehend the total content. Guilty again. Politics, as I see it, is difficult to reduce or eliminate but you may have found an answer to curb the problem. I did return and reread yours. Also scoutldr, What happened or how do you interpret from what has been said in regard to your situation with the DE? FB

Disclaimer: the question has been posed and answered and the action taken for a successful outcome. This is a personal note: As an adult, I still have my Wolf book. It has my Mother's signature where she signed me off on the requirements as I completed them. There are a few of the items that I have long been thinking about doing again. The wood projects especially are of interest. Of course, I have gained a few skills since then to add to the basic construction and most likely nobody will recognize that it came from the Wolf requirements after completion but that will be the origin. I joined Cub Scouting in May and received my Wolf in December of 1957. I guess somebody was watching out for me too. FB

Wojauwe, I am not sure you directed a statement or a question in my direction until your last post. If you meant for me to respond to your previous posts by making a judgment on how you conduct business, I am not sure that would count for much. Since I have not posted how business is done in the lodges I have been associated with, I am not sure your assessment about something being seriously wrong has validity. If you are referring to my personal observation about politics being part of the process, then you have already agreed with that part from your own post. The original question had to do with a D.E, being elected to the Vigil after two years of service. My posts were directed at assisting with that answer. I am glad that you are satisfied with the way business is run in your lodge. It sounds like you do not have the kind of problem that was originally posted. Is there another issue that I have missed? If so, I apologize for the oversight. FB

I do not agree with the loud speaker kind of prayer because God can hear quite well and it may or it may not support the God of your choice or the elements of the prayer that agrees with the individual. (*even Christians disagree with each other and with each others approach) I recommend that before each and every game, all sports included, every person stands up at the beginning of the game and gets 2 uninterrupted minutes of any kind of screaming, silent, rolling around, chanting prayer to whatever God, god, gods that they believe in. They can pray for faith, healing, winning the football game, a safe ride home or whatever. The atheists can stand silently in awe of the whole demonstration or get a coke. All religions and non-religions would be covered and nobody would be left out including the football teams and coaches which would feel free to come out of the field house for their part of the episode. FB

Proud Eagle, I guess you are responding to my post. If you are, then what I posted was from the Order of the Arrow Handbook. There is not another method prescribed that I know of in the literature. There are not choices given on how to elect a person other than a few guidelines that have some variance within each item. "As for using the lodge's executive committee as the Vigil Honor nomination committee, I would not personally favor that approach. For one there are far too many ways for such a process to become political, when the committee members are all holders of elected offices." Proud Eagle The lodge's executive committee is not asked to also be the selection committee. OAHB, 89/89, pages 120-123. Once per year, the Lodge Chief appoints a VH nominating committee (*about 5 to 10) composed of youth (*who can be VH) who are approved by the Lodge Advisor and Scout Executive. Then an adult Advisor Consultant is selected by the Lodge Chief and the Staff Advisor. It does not mention the Lodge Executive Committee. As for political action or politics, I have always known the OA to be the hotbed of political action on all levels. I am not sure that one can arrange for it not to happen. FB

(My first perspective is from the Boy Scout Program.) Trying to figure out the reason for boys leaving the program or trying to organize their reasons into categories of early departure for some kind of resolution is to fall into the mistaken assumption that the BSA is the only or the best program. Here is my reasoning and approach: 1. It is not my program. I am part of a support system for the Scouts in their program. 2. I believe that there are other valuable programs that can be more fun, interesting, and exciting. I have personally chosen the BSA because I have found those elements and more. 3. I ask the Scouts (PLC) what they want to do each year for the next year. We vote on the elements and then we take those to the Troop Committee. Our support comes from them and if they cannot for some reason(s) or they don't have the resources, then we consider Plan B or a scaled down version, etc. But the program is basically what the Scouts decided to do. 4. After each event, we sit down as a group with three sheets of paper. One sheet has a smiley face, the second has a sad face and the third has eyes looking forward. What do you like?, What do you not like?, and What can we do better?. It is their program and they get to vent, change things, and learn things. 5. If they still quit and some do, we have an exit conference to inquire about their reason(s), to wish them luck, and to let them know the door remains open. 6. If they leave a program that they helped create and mold, then I don't have any reservations about them leaving. I trust each Scout to make good decisions and if they don't, then the responsibility for change has been set aside for other opportunities. 7. I personally love Scouting. I have found a lifetime of adventure and friendship here but then that is just me. Secondly, Cub Scouting: My good friend SS was the CM of a fairly large pack. I visited on several occasions as a UC. I told him that on the third visit that I would take pictures (slides) of what I saw. The film was developed and we sat down and looked at them. What was evident was that he was leading the program and the Cubs were watching. He agreed to let me help as an ACM for a period of time. I asked that we simply follow the Program Helps. The next meeting was Knights of the Roundtable. We ALL showed up in cardboard gear and horses and swords. Each Den had their part of the program and SS had his part. It was wild, fun and exciting. It was the most outstanding Pack meeting that I had attended for some time. Results: the Pack expanded and the kids joined in. Three years later, I resigned as ACM. I figured that SS could read the Program Helps as good as I could, since he was a college professor and all. Did we have Scouts that left, sure, most of them when they bridged into Boy Scouting. I strongly believe in and rely on the program of the BSA, why, because I have evidence that it works and it retains a majority that has engaged in the best of it. FB