Eamonn

Welcome! Ea.

Attending a conference at Philmont is really great! In part because it can be a wonderful family vacation. However if you are interested don't worry the invite is not really an invite!! They want to fill all the spaces available!! Invites are send to people who have been named by people at the local level, normally the District and Council Training Chairs. I went while my son was a Webelos Scout, he had a fantastic time. Her Who Must Be Obeyed is the kind of person who thinks any hotel that has less than a 3 star rating is roughing it!! Went with us -OK - To be really honest it wasn't her cup of tea!! But she didn't hate it!! I kinda made it up to her by taking her to the Grand Canyon on the way home (We drove from not far from you!!) If I were you I'd wait a year or two. Look at what position you think you are going to serve in long term (I'd love to take the Strictly for Scoutmasters Conference)Pick the conference that is the best fit. Put he dog in a kennel for a couple of weeks, drive to Philmont with the kids and your Lady wife, plan to do something that she will really enjoy while you are in that part of the world. You all will have the best time!! I'm 100% sure. Eamonn. (You can apply to go at any time, but you will need the SE to sign off saying that he or she thinks that you will get something out from your attendance.)

funscout In my book, doing what is right has nothing to do with political affiliation. While I could be very wrong? Looking at the USA,it seems that it is only here that the term "Conservative Christian church members" is used. I think (I don't claim to know!) That this "Conservative Christian" movement has its roots thanks to deals made by Ronald Reagan with people like Jerry Falwell and Albert Mohler. I wonder if while Nancy was consulting with her astrologers, Southern Baptist Jimmy Carter, was teaching his Sunday school class at Maranatha Baptist Church in Plains, Ga? When it comes government waste and pork barrel spending both sides of the house seem guilty to me. Eamonn.

mmmmontano, From what you have posted it seems to me that someone somewhere has got it wrong. There is no required amount of hours and I have yet to see where it states that only Scouts can help in the project. The person who is saying this needs to be given the right information, not only for the sake of your son, but for the Scouts who will one day follow. If you have a Unit Commissioner? He or she might be able to inform this person of what the requirements really are, failing that I'd try the District or Council Advancement Chairman. If your DE has a Scouting background maybe he or she might be able to help, but if he or she is doing their job right? Don't be surprised if you get sent back to the District Advancement Chairman. Do be sure to tell your son to not get frustrated!! Scouter's are human and at times do make mistakes. I feel sure once this person is given the correct information and has a chance to digest it, everything will be fine. Ea.

Talking with a fellow the other day, he said that he has a little girl who is about 3 years old. It seems that she is a handful who very much likes to have her own way. He said that his wife is into the "Parenting Books" One of these books had stated that you never ever smack a kid, instead you crouch down till you are eye to eye with the child and explain what the child has done wrong and if need be follow up with a time out. It seems this worked well until one day the mother must have forgot what the book said! She did give the child a smack on her rear end. The little girl looked at her and said "Mummy you didn't look in mine eyes". I'm not in favor of corporal punishment. But at times think that maybe we have allowed ourselves to get caught up in a sea of politically correct mambo-jumbo. While of course corporal punishment is never allowed in Scouting, and in all the years I have served as an adult leader, I have never felt the need to lay my hands on a child. I do however wonder if at times we try a little bit too hard to find reasons or try to justify people who are out of line? I have never sat through any Anger Management classes or victim awareness sessions. (At least not yet!!) So maybe it's unfair for me to comment on how effective these are. Talking with the Scouts in the Ship, it seems that if the schools hear a word about a student who in any way mutters a word about harming someone or himself, they pack him off to a local hospital to see the mental health professionals. In the light of shootings at schools this might be a good thing. The school district has a special class room where disruptive students are sent, again from talking with the Scouts in the Ship it seems that the main activity in this "Sin Bin" is sleeping. If a student decides that he no longer wants to participate in a class he does what is needed to get sent to this room, where he can take a nap!! The school district where I live now sends students to the local Justice of the Peace to be dealt with for all sorts of things that back when I was a student and a teacher were dealt with in house. A student caught with cigarettes or two students fighting are packed of to see the JP. The punishment is normally a fine of some sort, time away from school for the student and time off work for the parent while they attend the hearing. If the fine isn't paid, the parent is held responsible. I'm not sure what this teaches the student? I'm sure at times when a Scout gets out of line, my telling him or her not to act like an idiot or just quit it! Is seen by some as not being the correct way of managing the situation and maybe I'm guilty of causing untold harm to their id and have knocked their aura out of place? Maybe I have violated their constitutional rights? Maybe they know this? But then again I'm not sure what else to do! Eamonn.

funscout I'm not willing to help you pay your taxes. I am however willing to swap tax bills with you. You pay mine and I'll pay your's. To be very honest, I don't spend a lot of time worrying about taxes. I'm happy to trust that my accountants do their job and ensure that I'm not paying more than I should and that I don't end up in the big house. As a resident alien, I don't vote. I'm very grateful to the USA for the opportunities that have been given to me to not only make a living, but make a very good living. Along the way I have managed to save a few bucks and invest a few dollars in different areas that interest me. The cash I have put into the market and different funds is there for the long term, I have to be really bored before I even bother to see how its doing. Like most people I don't like to see or hear that the money I pay in taxes is being wasted or not being spent wisely. I do however hold the opinion that we as a civilized society do need to do what we can to look after the less fortunate and the needy. How we look after needy people says a lot about how civilized we really are. If my paying a little extra in taxes will help better educate our young people, look after our elderly, prevent people from becoming homeless and get people who can't afford the medicines that they need. I have no problem paying the tax-man. I really don't know but it seems to me that I was better off in the years that Bill Clinton was president! Not just because of my tax bill, but the cost of living seemed to be more stable and even allowing for adjustments I wasn't spending as much on necessities. Milk wasn't four dollars a gal. Heating oil wasn't $2.90 a gal. Even dog food was about half what it now costs!! At some stage the government is going to have to face the fact that there just isn't enough money coming in to pay all the Baby Boomers who are retiring and find a way of making up for the shortfall. So far I haven't heard much from the candidates running for President about what they intend doing about this? Seems to me that right now they are all hoping that if they say nothing about this it will fix itself. Sadly as we all know it isn't going to go away. Eamonn.

I tend to do most of my thinking when I'm out walking the dogs or mowing grass. Investing in a couple of cows and the odd goat might cut down on the time I spend? Sometimes I ask myself "Why they do that?". Sometimes I ask why "Why don't they do that?" When it comes to me.I can either talk myself into doing something or argue with myself and find reasons for not doing it. Sometimes the reasons and the arguments don't make sense to anyone other than me! Sometimes I convince myself that something is what I want to do and should do, but end up not doing it anyway! Sometimes I tell myself that I'm not going to do something and end up doing it. When I first took WB, I had no real interest in taking the course. In fact I only took it because it was required for me to take it in order that I could attend the 1975 World Jamboree as an Assistant Scout Leader. (I was Scouting in the UK.) When I was first asked to serve as a staff member for a course, I was very much focused on me having that third bead!! It wasn't until I attended the first development weekend that I seen that there was real meaning to what I was about to do. Back when I first got my first set of beads I was a very cocky little fellow!! I wanted to show everyone, especially all the old timers that I too was a member of that "Wood Badge Club" I have staffed courses where it seemed to me that the Scoutmaster /Cubmaster hasn't really understood what we were about? I have staffed courses where the add ons seemed to overshadow the course. Me being me, and being as egotistical as I am, knew that if given the opportunity to direct a course that I'd do a far better job. When the opportunity did come I like to think I did a good job. I'm not sure why the all the people who signed up and participated in the course did so? Sure we can sit back and spout all the good reasons why they should but these might not be why? Some attended because someone else was attending. Some maybe just wanted to find out what all the fuss was about. Some were the "Training Junkies" who attend anything!! Hard as it might be to find out why the people who did attend went? Finding out why others opted not to attend is even harder. One older Scouter informed me that he wasn't going to attend because of the females! I'm sure some people choose not to attend because they just didn't like me or maybe some-other staff member. Some of these people will maybe attend at some other time, some will use this as their reason for never attending. At this time here in the USA attending WB is not mandatory. (It was AND maybe still is in the UK?). I don't look down my nose at people who don't have a set of beads hanging from their neck. In fact most times I don't take any notice. Different people have their own reasons and their own excuses for doing and not doing what they do. I do get a little upset when people judge others for attending or not attending. Most times we don't have enough information to be form a fair judgments and it really is none of anyones business. I think it's fair to say that nearly all of the people I know who have taken WB seem to have had a good time and have came away saying that they have learned something. Many might be on a "Training High"? How much they take back and use in the units or other places where they serve? Is of course unknown. Back when I was serving as a Council Training Chairman, I did spend a lot of time trying to improve the number of trained leaders that we had in the council. Part of this was a numbers game, but I also whole heartedly believed that adults who had been through the BSA training's were more than lightly to do a better job than those who hadn't. At this moment in time I would like to take Sea Badge, but have in my opinion no real need to take Powder Horn. Friends of mine have taken the Powder Horn and speak very highly of it. But as yet I have talked myself into not needing it. Other have said that Sea Badge isn't that great, but I want to take it anyway!! Ea.

Boy Scout Course in the UK = 10 Cub Scout Trainer Course USA = 9 Staff Member (Old Boy Scout, old Cub Scout and 21st Century)= 10 Course Director = 9. I never took the 21st Century course as a participant. The first 21st Century course I staffed was the "Week long" (6 Day) course. The syllabus doesn't seem to work as well when it's not broken down over the 2 X 3 days. All the other courses were week long courses. I do think bringing a group together for an entire week does help the group bond better. The ticket for the Cub Scout Trainer course was a really tough ticket to write and work. The ticket for the old UK course was a lot of writing, more of a report of what you had done with the specific skills you learned from the course. Some of the tickets that came from the old Boy Scout course that dealt with self-improvement, seemed very weak to me! But of course it / they weren't my ticket! I was invited back this year to help out on a course that our Council was hosting. The CD wanted me to help out as a QM. I declined. With the rules as they are now, my WB days are behind me. If and when I ever get the time I think I'd like to put something together that would help improve the skills of new Boy Scout leaders coming into the program? Something along the lines of a more advanced outdoor skills course. Ea.

A long time back, one of the points of the Scout Law in the UK was "A Scout smiles and whistles through all difficulties". I never mastered the art of smiling and whistling at the same time! Maybe because of this I have at times tended to think that "A Scout is cheerful" is one of the least important points of the Scout Law. (A case can be made that they are all of equal importance, but in my book "A Scout is kind" comes out on top! This of course is my own personal preference.) For the past few months I have had the privilege to work along side Mr. Grey. Mr. Grey is the most cheerful person I have ever met. Everyday he greets me with "Hello my friend, how are you? He informs me that it is going to be a "Great day!!" At the end of his shift he informs me that "It was a good day". He drives 100 miles a day round trip to get to work. He is good at what he does and gets on well with everyone. A few weeks back he came to work and couldn't wait to tell me that his son had made Eagle Scout and he is the first Eagle Scout ever in the Troop.(The Troop is chartered by a Baptist church and all the Scouts are African-American) Mr. Grey is raising a little Lad, his wife's sister's son, who was severally abused by the Lad's father. The Lad is ten years old but has brain damage and needs constant care. The poor kid is in and out of the hospital a lot. He is re-learning how to walk. Mr. Grey and his wife have served as Webelos Scout Den Leaders. I'm sure the Webelos Scouts had a great time working with Mr.Grey. Thanks to the example he sets by just being himself, I'm now starting to see that "A Scout is cheerful" is a very important point of the Scout Law. His glass is indeed always half full,his outlook is always positive. He is by no means a grinning fool!! In fact he is well known for being firm, fair and consistent. I'll bet if he tried he could smile and whistle at the same time. We could all learn a lot from Mr.Grey. Eamonn.

Hi and Welcome to the forum. This is a for the Scout chance to tell us what he plans to do with your life. What his interests are, what he might want to study, what profession he may wish to pursue, what hobbies he thinks you will continue, and so forth? When my son did this he said he wanted to be a teacher, mentioned what colleges he was going to attend and mentioned that he was interested in computers and Scouting. He added that he wanted one day to get married and have a family. Be careful that you allow the Scout to say what he wants to say and not what might be expected for him to say!! Eamonn.

Mike, I think I know what a good Troop might look like! But if I were a parent who had no Scouting experience. My first big concern would be about me!! Not my son!! The "When" and the "Where" would come into play. I'd be looking for a Troop that met at a time when it was convenient for me. I have a pal who is deeply involved in Scouting, has served as District Chair and Council Vice President. - But don't ask him to do anything on a Tuesday night!! That's his bowling night. Looking at the District I'm in and where I live, a lot of the best or better Troops are at the other end of the District, hard to get too when it snows and not in the same school district. Not all schools follow the same schedule!! I'm not sure I want to drive more than half an hour each way to take my son to a Boy Scout meeting. If the Troop is in another school district? Chances are that his friends will be in the school he attends. Sometimes I think we over think all of this!! OJ choose the Troop he wanted to go too, mainly because he really liked the SM. Sadly within months of him joining the SM quit!! Troops change, sometimes for the better and sometimes for the worse. Parents have different reasons why they send their son's to different Troops! Sometime back our District was recognizing a great old time SM. We invited people to come up and talk about Pete, one mother of twins got up and said how grateful she was to Pete as he took her two boys away once a month and her and her husband were happy to have the house to themselves. Some parents don't want to hear about High Adventure!! Heck if I'd known how much OJ's Scouting experiences were going to end up costing me. -Maybe back then I'd have had second thoughts!! (No not really!) When OJ was looking where to go. He looked for a Troop where he knew the other Scouts. Where he thought he'd have fun and participate in new adventures. (At age 11 everything is a new adventure!) And a place where he could get away from me!! The Troop you join this year might not be the same Troop in six months time. The Troop down the road might start specializing in something that your son wants to do and isn't doing in the Troop you join. I'm all for playing this by ear and remembering that it is his youth, his Scouting experience, his time and while maybe right now he is at an age where he wants to do his best to please you? In time this will change and he will want to do what pleases him. Eamonn.

Have just talked with HWMBO. She informs me. That in cases of dire emergency the Doctors will do what is needed to be done. They do make every effort to contact the parents and do prefer to talk with and have permission from the parents before doing anything. However if the parents can't be reached they will treat a Scout with a signed permission slip. Depending on how serious the ailment is?? For example a Lad who needs a couple of stitches in a finger? The Doctor might see this as not being a big deal and go ahead. A Lad having chest problems might be labeled "Dire" But a surgery that can be delayed will be delayed till the parent is reached or the situation becomes serious. Have to admit that when it comes to making the determination if the Lad goes to the ER, I'm far happier making the decision and not leaving it to the camp staff. I might ask for their opinion, but the final decision would be mine. As a rule in our area the EMT on site would be the one to determine if a life-flight was needed. Eamonn

I agree with scoutldr. Call the parents, report what is going on and have them tell you what they want done. If the parents can't be contacted? I see nothing wrong with talking with and asking the Lad. HWMBO works in our local ER and unless it's something big, the staff there don't do anything till they have spoken with the parent. Even with all the Medical forms and permission slips signed they will keep the child comfortable and wait till the parent has been contacted. Eamonn.

ScoutNut, Is 100% on the money, when he says about asking the family what they want. I also think the parents of the Den need to be asked what they feel should be done? If anything? If and when the time comes, I think leaving it to the families of the Den is what I'd do. They know the level of understanding that their son has. Back when OJ was seven, we had a bad year. His rabbit died, the cat died, his goldfish died and my father passed on. After all this he looked at me as only a young Lad can and said "Daddy, doesn't Heaven ever get full?" I'm sure I would not want to be the adult leader taking a group of Cub Scouts to a funeral, I feel they are just too young to grasp and understand everything that might be going on. The little Lad with the mother who has cancer needs all the love and support that you can give him now. When we found out that Her Who Must Be Obeyed had cancer, I was mad. Mad at just about everything and everyone, I was even mad at God. I was even mad at her. The idea that she would go and leave me, made me mad. I was so upset and mad along with feeling sorry for myself, that in some ways I shut OJ out. Deep down I knew how much he needed me and all the love I could give him, but I was just too busy being mad. In time I got over it. But it's very hard taking care of someone else, when you can't take care of yourself. Since then I have been part of the Cancer Support Team at the clinic where HWMBO had her chemo. I have explained how I felt and it seems that a lot of other people go through the same feelings. The husband and father is going through a rough time. Having the Den say a little prayer for the family even when the son is at the meeting would seem to me to be a good thing to do. A very good friend of mine (The wife of OJ's SM) lost her battle with cancer a few months back. She had fought it for about seven years. When it got to the time when she just wasn't able to do anything we got together with her Church Family and provided cooked meals for her and her husband. When she went to the hospital for the last time, I looked in and walked their dog. Not a big deal, but I felt I was doing something to help. I will add this family to my prayers. Eamonn.(This message has been edited by Eamonn)

Hops, As far as I know there have not been any real studies done that prove that food handlers who smoke pose any greater threat than non-smokers. The dangers smokers can do are caused by their hands coming into contact with their mouths and by contaminating food with matches, butts and ash (Ash is of course sterile) You need to be more concerned about people eating and drinking in food prep areas. Ea.

The new? (I'm not sure if there ever was an old!) Web site is up and running. It can be found at: http://nerventuring-bsa.org/index.htm Ea.

" Some have told me to give him his SMC" Hate to sound dumb!! What is "SMC"? Ea.

I'm not and never have been in favor of treating adults like youth members, so I don't see any need for a group of adults to play act being Boy Scouts. As far as paying for things? Just divide the cost by the number of people. In the past if we have had someone who for some reason can't afford the full cost (Maybe a person attending college?) We might ask the other adults to pay a little extra. As a rule the menu is no big deal, most of the adults I know really don't care if the weekend costs a couple of extra dollars. But we tend not to garnish the plates with white truffles and only serve warm pt de foie gras,on special occasions. Eamonn.

I'm not saying we need to go overboard. But ... If something as easy as proper hand washing and not eating food that we know has been contaminated will prevent a Scout from becoming sick, surely it's worth that little effort? Ea.

To the best of my knowledge, I have never met Mr.Evans and I don't know him. I don't know if he is guilty of what he is charged with or not. I'm happy to allow the courts to sort that out. When people who we place trust in let us down, we feel angry and upset. When children are hurt or harmed by the very people who are supposed to be looking after them and setting a good example, many of us feel that the person or people who do this sort of thing have in many ways betrayed all of us and what we stand for. Unfortunately sometimes it takes something going wrong for us to see what can be done to prevent this sort of thing happening again. Have mistakes been made in the past? Sadly the answer is yes. But I do believe that steps have been taken to improve the safety and well being of the youth we serve. Even looking at this case it would seem that one of the things we teach our youth has happened. Someone did Report what had happened and the report was taken seriously. I know I'm not qualified to say what makes or turns people into molesters. However in my un-qualified view they are sick and do need a lot of help. It's all too easy to point fingers and blame one group of people as being more lightly than some other group for being more lightly to molest children. It does only make sense that people who want to do this sort of thing will go to groups where there are children. If the material that is on the Youth Protection videos is to be believed? It would seem that the FBI and groups like them think that the BSA is not only trying to prevent children from being abused, but is also doing a good job. This of course means that we all need to be aware of what is going on and that there is no room for complacency. While the training's and educational material offered by National will help, as will checking out the people we select to serve as youth leaders. Still at the end of the day a lot of the burden falls on us the everyday volunteers. We are the people who need to make the Buddy System happen starting at an early age, we are the people who can never turn a blind eye to activities that we think are not right. Eamonn.

"We've always gone by the 5 second rule. If ya drop it & pick it up in 5 seconds, it's still edible!" If you could see the bacteria that is on the item of food that has been dropped, the five second rule would be done away with!! Think of all the places your shoes/boots have been and is saving that piece of food worth getting sick over? Ea.

SSScout, I of course agree whole heartedly with us going out and telling everyone about the good stuff we do. Part of my reason for starting the other thread was because, a few years back I was trying to help raise a large amount of money for our council. I met with people and foundations who have lots of money!! (My mother didn't raise a fool!) I was shocked at how little people who weren't involved and who hadn't been involved in Scouting knew about what we did and what we are trying to do. I was talking to someone about this and they said something that has stayed with me. They said "What do you expect when you meet in the basement and camp in the woods?" Ea.

Sadly here in PA the inspection of places that serve food is left up to the PA Department of Agriculture. Some counties do have first class inspectors who are employed by the county and some towns also have their own inspectors. The county where I live is happy to leave inspections up to the Department of Agriculture. There really isn't enough inspectors and trying to get them to visit a camp, while the kitchen is in full operation can be very difficult. Not so many years back the role of the inspector was seeing that kitchens were clean, today ensuring that food is cooked throughly and kept at the correct temperatures is the big thing. Finding and paying qualified people to work in Summer Camp Kitchens is not an easy task. The Allegheny County Health Department has a really good fact sheet on MRSA. http://www.achd.net/mrsa/MRSAMain.html Proper hand washing with soap and water and drying with a single use towel is the best way of preventing the spread of a lot of the infections that kids can get at summer camp. This is something that needs to be explained to all the Scouts and leaders as part of the pre-camp information. Ea.

While I don't ever want to become an old "Mother Hen"!! I do accept that kids involved in Scouting do face certain risks. If we were to remove all the risk, what we were able to offer would be a very lame program. Of course we do our best to make Scouting as safe as we can and remove any unnecessary risks. This past summer a lot of scouts at our council summer camp got sick. The camp was visited by a lot of different State Departments (Health, Agriculture..) They tested the water and looked around the kitchen. Sadly the kitchen had never had a visit from the Health Inspector and had never been inspected. The kitchen itself is not dirty, but a lot of things that would be done in a normal commercial kitchen were not being done. No real records of cooking temps and serving temps. Some of the refrigeration is not that great. As far as I'm aware none of the staff are ServSafe trained. No "Sample Trays" of food are kept, which could be tested in an event where it seems like the Scouts are coming down with an outbreak of food-borne illness. We need to do what we can to ensure that the food being served to our Scouts is safe. Not just at summer camp but at all camps. Hand washing goes a long way to prevent spreading infection. Bathrooms at camps need to have adequate hand washing facilities and we need to stress to our Scouts how very important it is for them to wash their hands after using the bathroom. We need to ensure bathrooms have the supplies. People will go and request more TP, but fail to mention that there is no soap or disposable hand towels!! I know every Mom in the world teaches their son this!! But at times kids at camp seem to think that home rules don't apply at camp!! Scouts cooking need to wash their hands a lot and be taught about cross contamination, while wearing hand protection (gloves) might seem a little over the top! Maybe it's not such a bad idea. Here in our end of PA. We have had a lot of kids get MRSA. (Mt. Lebanon High School in Pennsylvania has been hit hard: 13 members of its football team, the Blue Devils, came down with MRSA infections this year.) "Everyone agrees that this an epidemic. And not only is it an epidemic. But, it's an epidemic of our times. It's here in huge numbers," says Dr. Robert Daum, an infectious disease pediatrician at the University of Chicago Medical Center." It would be foolhardy for us to ignore it. A Scout is Clean!! We need to talk with them and explain why being clean is so very important and why they should not share towels and clothing that has been worn by others. There is nothing in the world that tears my heart out like seeing a sick kid! I in no way want to come off as sounding that we are "Sissyfying" (Not a real word??) Scouting, but we do need to do what we can to prevent Scouts from becoming sick. Eamonn.

Can't help thinking that it's a little strange that no one brought up Friendships? I'm not sure if anyone who is not involved with Scouting; youth or adult knows or really cares about "Leadership Development"? It might be that other groups do some of the same activities that we do. Some might even do a better job? Having better facilities or professional leaders? If we look at these other organizations as competitors, we need to find a selling point that makes our organization seem better than their's. Maybe stressing that we offer a year round program? Strange that no one mentioned Service to others. There have been a lot of reports that say young people really like doing things to help others. Eamonn