desertrat77

It must be challenging to keep the camps viable. More so than in the past. It's been many a moon ago, but I am thinking of the small council camp in Alaska where I staffed as a scout. We'd make the journey to the camp several times a year, but only for outdoor-oriented activities. Summer camp, winter camp out with the troop, OA conclave, ordeal, etc. All of the sedentary stuff took place in town. Even after 4 years as a scout in that council, I always enjoyed driving through the front gate of the camp.

Very true. Folks know when they've been fenced in. And yes indeed, camps can get lazy. An additional drawback to the "let's all gather at Camp ABC yet again" is the burnout factor. Years ago when I was stationed in the deep South, the small council I was in held every event they could at the council camp. Monthly district meetings and roundtables, WB, other training courses, conferences, you name it. The camp wasn't very special after a certain point. Instead of "hurrah I'm back" it was "here we go again." I concur, building bridges is just what the BSA needs right now. More than

Me too. Sometimes I think of all of the challenges the BSA is facing. It would seem that this would be the very moment in our organization's history where councils and National would make a concerted effort to embrace the ideas of the volunteer scouters. At least entertain suggestions and even if disapproved, provide some sort of meaningful dialogue. After all, we're the ones in the field, sticking by the BSA through thick and thin. But no. With a couple of hiatuses, I've been a scouter since '85, and I've never seen an era in the BSA where council and National staffs have been more

We have some wonderful state parks that are far better than our council camps, by every measure. But by having the council-approved list limited to council camps, the packs don't have much of a choice officially. They'd love to camp at state camps but they gotta obey the rules. And I've tried to engage our council to add more non-BSA camps that more than meet BSA's criteria, but I have not gained one bit of traction.

@Eagle94-A1, maybe it's all strategy. Put more restrictions on autonomous pack camping, open up council-run cub camping opportunities. The council doesn't make any money or get any recognition via PPT data to National when a pack camps on its own. Plus I've noticed that at least in my council, the "cub approved" camping locations are pretty much restricted to council owned camps. And council staff doesn't entertain discussion about adding other locations to the approved list, even if they meet the requirements. So funnel everyone to council camps, and walk through the council

@qwazse, excellent points all. I have one "however"--when it comes to risk management and to potential legal/civil action, I think clear cut rules are vital, whether we agree with said rules or not. @RichardB alluded to this his previous post, " Please do not put yourself or youth at risk."

@Jackdaws, I believe they read the surveys. But that's all they do. Councils and National work to their own complete satisfaction. Anything other than praise is ignored.

@RichardB, there's two ways to take your offer of defining "overnight." 1. Humor. 2. Acknowledgement that G2SS is vague enough to allow packs some leeway, and formally defining "overnight" would close the door on whatever freedom presently exists. Which is it?

It's challenging enough to get everyone's schedule lined up to go camping. On that rare occasion when the planets/work schedules/school commitments align, we may as well camp for 2 nights. At least that used to be the thought process. Plus there is something more substantial about camping for 2 nights versus 1. These points aside, I think the larger issue is that National either cannot or will not communicate clearly, be it with the field or within its own headquarters. And when it comes to publishing coherent, consistent policy, they are marginal at best.

Every time National tightens the rules on camping, they make it easier for non-camping units to stay home and more difficult for camping units to actually camp. And if you aren't in the great outdoors, you really aren't scouting.

National seems to be working around the clock to turn the BSA into a big Tiger Cub Den.

@Girlscoutmaster, welcome to scouter.com!

A club at our high school sells Country Meats products, cases and cases of them. As @yastreb said, the things sell themselves. Very popular, reasonably priced, a product that people actually want.

@Liz, camping on your property seems like a great option. As the girls are new to scouting, it will still be an adventure and at the same time allow them to work on basic outdoor skills. The fire pit is great! Too many scouts progress through the program today with rare opportunities to sit next to a real campfire, let alone cook on coals, use an axe, etc. Re the broken leg: I'd recommend a dining fly in the campsite, and then let the scouts take it from there. They'll rally to help the girl, and develop their own solutions to keeping the cast dry. Many moons ago, when I wa

Do scouts even read BL any more? The youth are the intended audience but I don't hear the scouts speak of it. Ever. My Venturer would never look at it, and she's a certified bookworm and outdoorsy type.

Popcorn is lousy product, and selling it is the second-lowest form of fundraising (the lowest being car washes). I still remember the day in the '80s when it was announced that popcorn would be "the" official product. What? At what prices? You are kidding me? For popcorn? So even then, National's strategic decision making was questionable.

Anything above $50....

If wearing the pin would in any way encourage my child, I'd wear it. The insignia guide is precisely that--a guide. Not holy writ.

I think that's the way it's all heading, unfortunately.

True. And when they stand before an Eagle board of review and are asked what they learned as a grubmaster, PL, SPL, etc., they'll give the same blank looks that I've seen on the last several Eagle boards I've sat on. These duties are designed to challenge scouts.

Alas, as much as I agree with you, @RememberSchiff, I foresee more poorly written, unnecessary publications and bundles of red tape promulgating from Irving in the coming months....

I've heard 23 October and 1 November for possible announcement dates. I too have heard that the fee jump will be significant, not just a couple bucks.

@skeptic, excellent post. I joined in June 2002. Hard to believe it's been that long. I agree, there were rousing debates back in the day. Weeks and months long bare knuckle brawls. Religion, politics, you name it. It got heated at times. Some members were put in the penalty box for a month or two. Overall, very interesting dynamics as well as entertaining. Some of those threads were not for the faint of heart. But many, many more threads were great discussions about scouting. I too look at an old thread and see a dozen or so old timers' handles and wonder how they are do

Alas, nowadays it's only about numbers and designing lodge flaps.

Those are the ones they brag about, especially afterwards....