Trevorum

People tell me I'm wrong all the time. It doesn't unsettle me any more.

"Dallas, Texas April 23rd, 2008 Dallas Mayor Tom Leppert signed a proclamation this week declaring Friday as the Day of Silence ... intended to shine a spotlight on the issue of anti-gay harassment, bullying and violence in schools." http://www.dallasvoice.com/instant-tea/2008/04/23/day-of-silence-proclamation/

Barry, I did not see the statement as off-thread because the original poster asked about BSA rules affecting "image". Nonetheless, this is admittedly getting into Issues and Politics and so I'll defer from further comment in this forum.

Yes, we all know that BSA membership policies are decided by high paid executives in Irving and not by the volunteers who actually work with youth. "Image" is a slippery concept and probably means something different to you than it means to the next person. And certainly, BSA's image to the public is complex and multi-faceted. Nonetheless, one portion of that image that has loomed ever larger in the public eye in recent decades has been a direct result of BSA's discriminatory membership policies. Whether or not one agrees with those policies, it is a fact that they have created an image problem to the extent that many traditional funding sources have dried up, many traditional chartering partners have been forbidden to charter units, and many parents will not even consider having their school age sons becoming Scouts. And that's a shame because Scouting has so much to offer to those boys.

Q: What BSA Rules get in the way of a Good Program/Image? I can't think of any rules that actually interfere with Good Program, although I tend to agree with Barry that we are becoming increasingly protective of our youth. I'm not sure if this is a reaction to fear of lawsuits, or merely exaggerated assessments of risk. OTOH, I can think of several rules that get in the way of a Good Image. At the top of the list are those rules that restrict membership.

We do the same as John and hotdesk. Also, a nice idea would be to take this opportunity to invest in your troop's first perpetual plaque with the new Eagle's name nicely engraved on the topmost plate.

Inconcievable!

I was lucky enough to meet the author of We are Americans, We are Scouts, David C. Scott, at a recent Scouting activity. I have always been impressed by Mr. Scott's scholarship, depth of knowledge about Scouting's history, and clear writing, and I wholeheartedly recommend this book to all my Scouting colleagues.

Today, I recieved this email from our council. [snip] Weekend Service Opportunity The organizers of this weekend's *** music concert contacted the council office today, looking for any Scout units that would be willing to help. This is a benefit concert with a portion of proceeds going to the *** chapter of **** Against Cancer. They are looking for units who would help clean up *** Park on Sunday morning, after the concert. Cleaning supplies and tools will be provided. The work will start at 8:00am and will continue until it's done. The promoters of the event have agreed to make a financial donation to the units that participate. [snip] Am I wrong to see a problem here? In my mind, something can't be a "service opportunity" if your unit is recieving a "financial donation."

Thanks for the link, Ed. I hadn't heard about this. From the info on the website, the idea is not to "promote homosexuality among school age children" (as eisely puts it), but to "bring attention to the name-calling, bullying and harassment ... experienced by LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender) students and their allies." Since bullying is always a bad thing, I guess this attempt to raise consciousness among people is a good thing.

I guessed I missed the "Margaret Affair". After review (plus the several spun threads), I think I agree with FScouter: no one was discourteous or unScoutlike. Carry on.

Ed's right. In some churches I've been to, the right thing to do is talk loudly, clap your hands and stomp your feet. In other churches the right thing to do is talk softly, sit quietly, and kneel every now and then. At some funerals I've been to, wearing black is a sign of respect. At other funerals, wearing white is a sign of respect. At some meals I've been to, folks are expected to use their hands and lick their fingers. At other meals, folks are expected to use knives and forks and linen napkins. As Ed notes, the "right" behavior in one context may not be the right behavior in another context.

Picture this scenario: Your boss calls you in for a conference. He has lots of experience and is very knowledgable and is sorta intimidating to you. You're up for a raise and really want to impress him. He looks at your file soberly, and asks you some questions. You handle these questions easily. But then, he asks you who you'll be voting for in the election! You don't see what this has to do with your raise, but you know you must give him an answer because he's your boss. You have no idea what his politics are and you certainly don't want to offend him if he is prickly about these things. You don't know for sure that he'll deny your raise if you like a candidate whom he can't stand, but you really don't want to take the chance. What do you say? Dang! Why did he have to ask you a question about politics! OK, now substitute "Scoutmaster" for "boss" and "Eagle" for "raise".

Depending on context, the question could well be both rude and/or coercive. A much better approach to the topic would be along the lines of, "Have you considered how you will vote this November?" In general however, I feel that politics is not an appropriate topic for a BoR. While the topic is closely interlinked to civic duty and patriotism (which are great topics for any BoR), with politics there's too much room for subtle power issues by the adults in the room. This is very close to how I feel about the religion vs. reverence issue we discussed in a recent thread. It's fine for an adult to ask a fellow how he shows reverence, but the direct question, "Do you believe in God" should be avoided because it has too much room for unanticipated misunderstanding.

[in my Ronald Reagan voice:] Well now, this started as an interesting thread by Beavah, but - there you go again - heh, heh, heh. Ahem; back to the point. Beav, when I was on committee, I saw the recess used twice to get around a delicate issue. One was when a board member (who should have known better) did not realize that a scout could advance to 2nd Class and 1st Class simultaneously and nearly called the Scout on fraud. In that case, your other tacks (humble; wait; humor; support the adult; let it go) would not have worked. We needed to correct this erroneous information in order to allow the BoR to proceed. However, I can see those strategies working in other, less formal, situations.

I agree with BW regarding the uniform on Eagle projects and also about projects being community based and not Scouting based. However, I disagree with the notion that us lay-folk can understand insurance, or libility, or other legal mumbo. I've said it before - laywers: can't live without 'em, can't shoot 'em.

Dan, congratulations to you son! I think I have written here before about the young fellow in our troop with Aspergers. He passed his Eagle Board in February! We are all very proud of him.

I don't think there was anything seriously wrong with the way the 12 year old was addressed. However, the slang does have a slightly insulting connotation to some (perhaps overly sensitive) young people. Just the way I might be slightly insulted if that same 12 year old called me "Gramps". I try to use the generic (and more congenial) term "fellow" when referring to youth. As in, "Sam, ask the fellows what time we should leave on next weekend's campout."

I have never heard of any flat-out prohibition of a Scout holding two jobs in the troop. There are some combinations which would not make sense (eg., PL & APL; SPL & QM) but others could be easily combined, especially in a small troop. I see nothing objectionable to a fellow being a PL and a Den Chief at the same time. Or even SPL and Bugler. Of course, only one patch can be worn at a time.

John, do you really want to get into High School fight songs? Go Monroe Vikings !

On top of Mount Phillips, my oldest son remarked, "This would be a great place for an Eagle Court of Honor!" He knew the logistics would be ridiculous, but when it came time to plan his own ECoH, he decided he definitely wanted it outdoors, under the open sky. "After all, that's where Scouting happens," he said. He chose the top of the highest peak in our own county. Not quite as high as Mount Phillips, but it was still a hike up to the top for the guests. It was an impressive view and a great ceremony. (Here's a peek.) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Mount-Bonnell.jpg (This message has been edited by Trevorum)

At a council sponsored training activity this last weekend, I was informed that a youth may be simultaneously registered in a Sea Scout Ship, in a Venturing Crew, and in a Boy Scout Troop. Moreover, we were told that because different Venturing Crews have different emphases, a youth may be dual registered in multiple Crews at the same time. Is this correct???

Beav, As always, your level-headed practicality is pursuasive. However, even you allow for the "occasional twit". And I gotta tell you, those folks can do a LOT of damage before they are stopped by us level-headed folks. I've seen it. I have confronted well-meaning Scouters who are passionately but mistakenly convinced that BSA is a Judeo-Christian organization (and, grudgingly on the "Judeo-" part) and that Scouts MUST accept their version of God in order to pass a Board of Review. It wasn't pretty. I believe that education and training can prevent these situations.

In another thread, we were discussing the relative importance of the 12 points of the Scout Law. The question arose as to whether all 12 points are of equal importance in the development of character, or if some are more important than others. TRUSTWORTHY LOYAL HELPFUL FRIENDLY COURTEOUS KIND OBEDIENT CHEERFUL THRIFTY BRAVE CLEAN REVERENT Are some more important? (This message has been edited by Trevorum)

Over the last several years, sometimes we've had a Chaplain's Aide, sometimes we haven't. Sorta like the Bugler. If there is a fellow who is interested in the position, the SPL will appoint him; otherwise it goes unfilled. On the other hand, we have two adult Chaplains.