Scoutfish

Based on my experience with my pack, and the few tag-a-longs I have been to with our sister troop..... NO! Our pack has a handfull who will regularly go to parent/son weekend at Council camp. WE have a handfull each year who go to resident camp or WEbeloree The cost for one parent and one scouts varies between $75.00 to $110.00 depending on wether Resident or parent'son. The program is basic and not any better than what we put on at our pack campouts. The food is eatable and portions are based on 3 year old's diets. At pack camping, we order food that both parents and scouts will eat, we are more enthused and energetic with leaders who lead each activity station and we also figure in more free time. It helps we know scouts personally instead of "another scout". The only downside is not doing bb guns or archery, but it's not that much of a downside since over half of our cubs own hunting rifles and shotguns already. The other half have air rifles as opposed to bbg uns. In case you don't know, air rifles are way more powerful and do not operate by spring/air like the council guns do. We started rotation through a set of 5 different camping areas about the time I tookover as CubMaster ( cough cough... ) so that it's not the same old thing over and over again. So from my viewpoint: NOPE! WE don't NEED them. Having them is a great idea, but we don't need them. Incidentally, as Cub Scout camp promoter for my district, I do propmotre our council camp. I truely believe every scout and parent should go to at least 1 parent son weekend and 1 resident camp. One area that we can quite compete with council camps is when they do skits at campfire ceremonmies. But you can also argue that - that is the people, not the camp.

Yeah, I with acco - I can ignore the phone, and as far as the caller knows, I am out of the reception area, in the shower, asleep, too busy to answer, etc..... Somebody walks up to me, they are right there. The only other option is writing a letter , But if I mail my next door neighbor a letter, it will be two days before he gets it depending on what time I mail it. I suppose I could tie a notes to a rocks and start taking out windows on houses!

"If you're making Catholic taxpayers fund government hospitals that provide abortion and contraception, can't you at least be courteous enough to allow the opposite?" Great question! NO! Because the government isn't taxing "Catholic taxpayers" , They are taxing US taxpayers of a wide variety of different beliefs. Why should a Hindu US citizen Pay taxes that pay for Bibles that are used in court for swe3aring in purposes? They don't! But as US taxpaying citizens, they contribute their share of taxes that support government ...well, let's say stuff since alot of it will arguably not be real needs! Maybe my own personal beliefs do not support any Mars missions as we will not be living on, traveling to, or gain any usefull earthly info about Mars. But I am not being taxed as an "Let's don't waste money on Mars" citizen. I am being taxed as a US citizen. FRankly, you will never find any total agreement by all US citizens when it comes to what taxes are used on. Somebody somewhere will find a plenty of things that they do not think the US government should be buying, funding, supporting or subsidizing. Personally, I am generally against abortion, but I am even more against taking the right to to make that choice from other people based on my own choices. It's not my place to limit your right to make your own choices and vice versa. But I am also not asking the government to fund me fully for a less that full product.

Well, let's clarify a bit: Are we talking mass communication or one or two people or individual? Individual I prefer face to face, then phone call if face to face is not feasable. With my leaders,if I can't do face to face, I will try to call all and will leave messages , and also e-mail them. For pack wide, we announce at meetings, and I also post on facebook and pack website. It has capability to mass e-mail on demand. I'm not even gonna try to call everybody in the pack . Thinking of setting up a phone tree now, but in the past, we had one, but we barely ever used it at all, if ever per year.

I never thought to completely ban them, as they can come in handy. Matter of fact, I know plenty of people who do not own watches or alarm clocks because they use their phones instead. I do hate to see scouts who cannot walk 5 feet inany direction without having to text or call somebody or check an update first. Making use of the phones could be along the lines of a spy themed campout. Get the numbers of X number of scouts phones -maybe pl's and spl's - and send them their secret messages to start their objectives. Similar to geocatching, but using text and such instead of lat and long. Maybe purposely send them to "dead zones" to see if they can come up with alterior means of communication . Send partial texts that must be combined with other texts to understand what the "mission" will be Of course, now all I can think of is Ralphie decoding the "Drink your ovaltine" message!

Yeah, the thing with the Catholic Hospitals is that they want all the benefits of government, but not the obligations. Sounds like my son: He wants his room, meals, toys, allowance and the right to watch tv , etc...but he doesn't feel I should make him do work around the house, get good grades, stick to curfew or bedtime. Or I could describe some employees where I work: They want all the bgreaksm, all the perks, bonuses, paid vacations, company vehicles, time off, and any other freebies ( hats, t shirts, jackets) but will be the first to whine about doing even the basic amount of work. They want payraises , but constantly complain about having to lift a finger to begiun with, complain about having to be on work on time, etc.. So, while I really do feel that the Catholic Hospitals should be able to refuse to have to perform abortions ( for obvious reasons) they need to realize that they can't have it borth ways: accepting money from non sectarian, genearl population all citizen funding , while restricting performance to reflect a limited scope of belief. Maybe the Catholic Hospital should only reciece money from Catholics...then they can make that decision just. And that would be seperation of church and state from the opposite side of the table.

I just had a random thought pop in my head. Not even 5 minutes ago, I was taking a load of clothes out of the bwashing machine and putting it in the dryer. I have no idea why I thought this, but my thought was : "Wow! If this really was a cold winter and we used a clothes line, I wonder how long it would take for clothes to dry - if they didn't freeze first? " Now, in case you were wondering, If this really was a cold winter refers to the fact that all of last week reached a daytime high of 70 degrees. Either Tues or Weds set a record of 76 degrees. Right noiw, my front door is open and it's 42 outside. So anyways, I started thinking about that clothes line and wondered - Isn't it my responcibility to use a clothesline whenever practical? Why waste the electricty when it isn't raining or freezing outsdie? Save electricity, save the earth? What about showers? Maybe in the summer or any time the temps are above 75, I should just use cold water only ( I have a well, so water comes out of the ground at a year round constant 57 degrees ) to keep electric use down. Sure, on the surface, it would save on my electric bill. But in the bigger picture, do I have a responsibility as a scouter to do this? I have no doubt you guys can come up with at least 100 other examples.

Well, wwe know trhat numbers are not the best judge4 of how great your program is. Truth be told, even though I feel our pack has an awesome program, and I feel we really work it hard...it is not outside of reason that some parents may have chosen our pack only due to location, the night we meet on, because "X" goes there too. Know what I mean? I know we do have a pretty good reputation in our area, but reputations really only go as far who is already somewhat involved with scouting. Then of course, we might have only 15 scouts next year due to boys loosing interest in that kinda thing, parents deciding they aren't interested anymore, some finding out the pack isn't there soley to accommidate their specific child, etc.... Boy are funny that way too: The program may be working just fine, but if your child is a die hard video game playing computer IT geek....scouting may not hold his interest even in Baden Powell himself were running the pack. Then you have soccer, football, basketball, single parents with multiple kids where the oldest son may have to babysit due to mom or dad being at work, etc.... I look at it this way: If your pack only has 4 kids, and they are having a blast and enjoying it - then you have a great program!

Just wondering about how big your unit is. We just tallied up and double checked that all our I's were dotted and T's crossed( for the 4th time) for recharter and we have 86 scouts. Now, when my son and I first joined, there was maybe something like around 55 scouts . The next year that number jumped to about 120 scouts. Last year it was around 70ish scouts or so. ( conflicting numbers between sign ups, transfers, drop outs, etc..... So now we have 86 scouts. Originally, I thought that was a normal amount of scouts. Then I saw that alot of packs might have 20 scouts total in all ranks combined. Never realized we were a big pack. Of course, size does not equate to having the right to puff out our chests and brag. I really do see the comfort and closeness in having a smaller pack. So, just out of curiousity, how many scouts do you have? Do you wish you had more? How about less?

So far, the best way I know is a direct phone call. My CC and myself probably talk to each other at least once a day if not 2 or 3 times. Of course, we are also great friends that were brought together trhrough scouting. Granted, I can't do that with every member of the pack or I'd spend all day calling everyone, so the next best thing is to rely on leaders to call or e mail when necessary.

Very typical, very commom. We send ouit e-mails for everything! EVERYTHING!!! We also put it on our web site, our facebook page, and announce ity at den and pack meetings...repeatedly ...months and weeks ahead of time. And somebody will always say" Nobody told me!" or "I didn't know/ hear about that!" "When did you decide that?" This includes all the people who volunteer too.

Every year, our DE and RT commisioner ask us what types of things we would like to have as RT topics. They write them all down, and manage to blend that with other stuff we have to have like advice on recharter or any other offic type stuff that ...sigh....has to be done. During the course of the year, they ask various people to make presentations on what they are good at. I gave a presentation on recruiting for Cub Scout parent/son weekenf and Resident camps. I also assist in presenting things to get kids psyched up before PWD . WE had a local pediatriction come by and go over dealing with shock, disabilities, ADHD ADD and Autism while Cub Scout camping. That was a great RT that dispelled MANY myths and false ideas. Sop ity needs to be a mix of what they want, what they need, and what can be improved on.

I guess all of you are more parent PC than I am, because I would have said one of the two following things: 1) " The unannounced change of plans are the direct result of and completely related to the unannounced change of plans that happened at the campout. You do understand the concept of cause & effect don't you? " 2) "This was a simple but effective leson in responcibility. Quite a few of the scouts shirked their responcibility this past weekend, and left the troop in a very tight spot. This shirking of responcibility also affects the entire troop and troop equipment. It is akin to having to pay the piper after having played." So what's the worst thing that happens? The "But the rules do not apply to my son" parent gets bent out of shape and pulls his/her son from thew troop? So what's the worst part of that>.you get a another scout to step up and assume QM posituon? Again, I admit I might not have the most tact in this situation, but I see an apology as an invitation for this parent ( and scout(s) ) to keep on showing up late, leaving early, neglecting duty...and the worst part - other scouts are staring to follow that lead.

It's funny how easy we forget things! I am te father of a Webelos scout who is about to cross over to a troop. I am also the CubMaster of our pack. So during den meeting nights, I have a lot of free time. I walk from den to den to see if they need anything or if I can be of assistance>> One night, I see the Tiger Cubs making puppets out of brown paper sandwich bags and decorating them with wiggly eyes, yarn for hair and drawing lips, noses, ears, etc...on the puppets. I so would have looked at it as too young an activity....but the Tigers were loving it> I guess what I am getting at is that even as things get stale, old or just to "been there - done that"...to somebody else...it is a brand new fresh idea!

Stole this from Scouting magazine as you no doubt know, but would be insterested in what you have to say. We used to do them, but stopped mid way through my son's Wold year. Used to take tuyrns bringing snack and water, but it got to be a pain as w had to keep switching the schedule last minute if somebody called to say they wouldn't make the meeting - usually 15 minutes before the meeting, ort forgot it was their turn or just didn't show that night. Then you always had those one or two scouts who were a little attention deficiet anyways, keep asking if it was snack time yet. All meeting long. Our dens meet at 6pm til 7pm...ish so most of our scouts have already had an after school snack that will hold them til dinner. Matter of fact, most of them have already eaten dinner anuyways. Plus it took up too much time. So how about you? What does your den/ pack do?

"Of greater concern is the government at any level trying to force religious acceptance of same sex marriage. Rabbis, ministers, imams and priests, and their affiliated religious establishments should have the right to refuse to perform such marriages. " Yeah, that's what I was trying to say...I just used 20,000 more words to do it! But I would also add: That same concern also goes to those who would be prevented from getting married due to the personal religious beliefs of those same Rabbis, ministers, imams and priests, and their affiliated religious establishments . Religion belongs in the church and in the heart. not in Government or laws governing the general population. (This message has been edited by scoutfish)

One of the very basic reasons I thoroughly believe in seperation of church and state is based on this hypothetical situation: Suppose that due to increasing violence in..um...Iraq ( or wherever you like) there is a sudden mass influx of immigrants that come to our country and apply for sanctuary ( I am so suddenly going blank on the proper term ) or ...Asylum? Nah, that's not it...but maybe you get what I am trying to say. So anyways, they come here seeking reliefe against persecutuon and I am not talking 300 or 400 people, but rather 1,000,000 or 2,000,000 people. They get btheir visas and after living here legally for 5, 10, or even 15 years - decide to get their citizenship . Soon enough they are legal law abiding productive citizens of the United States of America> And that is awesome too! That's what America is all about ( "Give me your tired, your poor, Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free, The wretched refuse of your teeming shore. Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me: I lift my lamp beside the golden door" ) But what if they themselves - due to the overwhelming number of legal citizens- successfuly get an amendment that says women must cover their faces, or that no music is allowed anymore, or tv? Maybe due to the Islamic ( or any other religion - you pick) citizens, there is a couple new laws that apply to EVERYBODY based on what may one day be the new religious majority in America? Yeah, I would not want that...and in that same light, I pass that same respect to those who are not of the current majority's views.

Been on the news I watch, but it very well could be just a state thing and not a national thing> I tried to find it, but the closest i could find is this: http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h0IhyLW8JW1txCX1NfmR-ceCiILw?docId=328b4de69c2e4cf78cec0a0a6f50e6c7 Which as I look at it, seems to be more of a compilation of various state amendments instead of National .

While I am not trying to tell anybody how they should choose to run their buisness...there is a difference between supporting a lifestyle and just selling to it. I am not into the whole militia type of lifestyle, but if they need a garage door, I am installing it in order to make a paycheck so I can support my family. That's all. I am not into Goth either. Do not care for polygamous lifestyle either, but selling them a cake, a bottle of wine, tires, 10 pack of hyamburger or whatever else the want does not equate supporting it with all your being. As far as a religious wedding goes, I do side with the offival in that they should be able to refuse based on religious beliefs. And in this case, it is because as the officiating person, you are putting your god or dietie's stamp of approval on the marrage. Of course, I have no doubt that there is somebody within that religion in an officiating capacity that will perform. Then there is justice of the peace who will perform civil ceremonies. Not trying to change course or hijack the thread, but this is so close to and on track with the movement to create an amendment to the constitution to ban gay marrage. I am so opposed to that amendment! No, it's not that I suuport gay marrage, nor am I against it. I really don't care either way. But I do not like the idea of ANY group wanting to make Constitutional amendments to solidify their religious beliefs on the country as a whole. Religious beliefs do not belong in the ruling laws of our country. What if...in 5 years..those same people rally to have a Constitutional amendment to ban all alcohol ( not a big drinker myself, so I guess it wouldn't matter to except on principale) or any shopping at all on SunDay. Maybe Constitutionally outlaw music that doesn't suit their particular taste. Maybe they become super homophobic and just assume that any guy who is willing to be a leader of a group of boys must be homosexual? It's simple: You do not believe in a gay lifestyle - do not live one. If you do not like alcohol - do not drink it If you do not like wrestling - do not watch it!

Sounds like a Chuck Norris kinda thing: Basement's pack is so good, they do not even fill out JTE sheets - the sheets fill themselves out!" NOw, just imagine how great your scoure would be if you did fil one out! I'd call the SE and say : "JUst imagine how awesome our score would be if we actually had activities in our council/ district? We'd be a triple gold pack!"

" Why do we have to change to accept everyone else's ideals/customs? " So,please explain to me exactly which ideals and customs we are talking about that are "ours" and not somebody elses. Religious beliefs? Offical language? Family dynamic? Heritage? Economic status? Race? Geographic location?

It is for scouts from Mexico who are VISITING while attending Jambo as guests. It's a courtesy thing. Ever watch Hockey or NASCAR? When we have a game against a foriengn country, we play theiur anthem first. No, we are not trying to change our own citezens, but do it as a courtesy to our guests. Same thing in NASCAR, at the pre race ceremonies, they will play the Mexican or Canadian anthem first as we are holding a joint activity , but in a way that they are our guests. Now, you have to rememebr, even though we are Boy Scouts of America, we ( meaning BSA ) are also a member of something else: World Organization of the Scout Movement. You know .....that purple patch with the fleur de lis on it that is sewn over your left shirt pocket? This is the whole idea behind world jambos, and joint activities where scouts from other countries are invited to be with us just like we get invited to join them. Nobody is taking a regular WB class and changing it to spanish. They are simply offering it in spanish for our Hispanic scout friends. It's a coutesy thing. Not a ravamping or change to the WB program.

"Um. Because we speak English in this country....." (1) Well...actually, no. We speak english as well as many other languages. English just happens to be the most common or popular. Matter of fact, we speak many dialetcs of english. Go down to New Orleans grag a person and carry them with you to Main, grab another person and carry them with you to Utah, grab another and carry them with you to Fargo, ND. Then go to Atlanta, Ga - grab another person and carry them with you LA , grab another person and carry the whole group to Ocracoke, NC and try to have a real engaging conversation amongst all of you. Let me know which one of you speaks english. There is no official language in America. But what youy call english is actually a big ole blend of so many different languages and cultures. You want to speak real english, go to the UK. "....and those that want to be a part of it should speak it as well." Who said they wanted to be a part of it? It's just a jamboree that they are visiting. Short term thing. By that logic, if you go to Mexico for spring break, you should speak spanish or stay home. Germany for Oktoberfest? Better speak German or get out! Right? Offerening WB is spanish is a great idea to extend a courtesy for our visitors. It's a "Hey, this is what we do" kinda thing. Kinda just like swapping ideas, sharing adventures and comparing everything from program to patches. But if BSA was to offere kit full time for spanish speaking scouters, and it helps them deliver a better program to the scouts who are very likely to be bilingual, then that's awesome too! (2)

"What is different about "ice" from "black ice". The difference is this: Ice is on the road as a whitish color. You see it, you slow way down ( if you have any sense) and driver very, very cautiously. Black ice is when you are driving down the road and woder why you are suddenly sliding sideways, spinning around in circles, or find yourself parked in ditch. Black ice is when the ice freezes so clear, that you cannot see it on the roadway. Thus, all you see is the "black" pavement beneath it.

Now that i go back and read my own posts, It does sound like I am saying that it's no big deal to say "God". What I meant was this: Just like each scout saying his own name at the beginning of the promise, I do not have any issue with, nor do I see a problem with each scout substituting hiw own word in place of God wether it be God, a god or any other entity or diety of his beliefs . And I mean this in the sense of BSA does not define what constitutes belief in God or the practice of religion. My point was only that while my son may say "...Duty to God..." I see no problem with the scout beside him saying "...duty to My Dahma..." or the scout beside him saying "...my duty to Allah..." And in my posts, I tried not to list other peoples gods as "gods" , while listing mine as God. I tried to use a few examples of their god's proper names.