RememberSchiff

6 minutes ago, gblotter said:

@LegacyLost  I understand the bitter tone you express, and I'm sorry for it. There are many of us in the same boat who feel disillusioned by these recent changes.

My plans for an earlier departure have changed. I have been asked to remain as Scoutmaster until the LDS exit on 12/31/19. There is much to be done over the next 18 months, with up to 10 of our boys targeting Eagle before the deadline. By hanging on, I will disappoint @RememberSchiff who has declared me unworthy to wear the purple crest because I desire a traditional boy-only summer camp experience for our troop. Or @CalicoPenn who has urged me to quit now because my affinity for traditional Scouting is a poison to the program. Anyone who doesn't embrace these changes is shamed as "unScout-like" or "conditional Scouter". So be it. Ironically, this new "inclusive" Scouting is not inclusive enough for the likes of me.

In your own words on 3/9/2018 in topic Family Scouting Update

"I wouldn't want our boys sharing merit badge classes, evening campfires, flag ceremonies, or dining hall times with girl troops. I seek to continue the same summer camp experience our boys have enjoyed before these announcements. "

As I was taught and teach, A SCOUT IS A FRIEND TO ALL, AND A BROTHER TO EVERY OTHER SCOUT, NO MATTER TO WHAT SOCIAL CLASS THE OTHER BELONGS - Baden Powell.

RS

@LegacyLost welcome to scouter.com.

Good point. It would be interesting to see how much those three groups agree on values. Would scouts seek compromises and lower the bar or accept challenges and raise the bar?

6 minutes ago, David CO said:

I couldn't disagree with you more. 

 

Those two groups are most mentioned by my scouts as valuing Eagle less now. If not them, who should the BSA be talking  or listening to about improving Eagle value?

1 hour ago, JoeBob said:

Multiple forum threads, Meritbadge Schools, and Eagle Mill troops prove that the rank of Eagle is no longer held in the same esteem.  I know of one LIfe scout who used as an excuse to not finish Eagle that he did NOT WANT EAGLE on his college application because it would hurt his chances to get into a liberal arts school.  (I'm sure there were other reasons, but I'd never heard that one.)

The feedback I am getting from our Eagle candidates is the Eagle project is enough...only do not mention your service work on a college application as an Eagle project just let the college assume it was part of service  requirement for graduation! 

We need to get the value of Eagle back and it is not PR stating only 4%,5%,...,%8 earn Eagle, which says what exactly? Make Eagle of unquestioned value again post high school. For example, not E-2 maybe E-3 grade , definite E-3 grade across the service branches. This would mean more physically fit and more real (solo) leadership. Colleges want to see service, let's focus on service and not STEM which schools are better suited.  Maybe pre-college Eagle weeks at colleges during summer?

But mostly, the BSA should be talking to college admissions and military recruiters regarding what would make Eagles more valuable to them. I remember "back in the day" when Eagle and Girl Scout Gold was a checkbox on many college applications, but today?

Recover the value loss, recover the pride.

My $0.02,

7 hours ago, ayates said:

Overall, including Beavers (ages 5-7), ~6% of the kids in Scouts Canada are in LDS groups. The impact to the sections in which the LDS have groups is as follows:

 

Allan.

Could you cite a source? I have not found a recent LDS statement regarding Scouts Canada which became coed 20 years ago

I found from https://globalnews.ca/news/4196815/mormons-severs-ties-boy-scouts-of-america/

The Mormon boys who will be leaving represent about 18.5 per cent of the 2.3 million youth in the organization (BSA).

More than half of the church’s 16 million members live outside the U.S. and Canada.

And from

https://www.heraldextra.com/news/local/faith/lds-church-announces-plan-to-drop-boy-scouts-of-america/article_20ed7ad9-ac1b-5c4f-bab7-5232ab8b8c9d.html

About a year ago, the LDS Church announced that young men ages 14 to 18 in the United States and Canada would no longer be participating in the Varsity and Venturing programs offered by the Boy Scouts of America and Scouts Canada. The change took effect at the beginning of this year (2018).

Happy Mothers' Day!

P.S. I hid the previous post  for 24+ hours as it was in the scouter.com content feed on Mothers' Day. IMO, it seemed discourteous to women in Scouting and Scouting in general.

23 minutes ago, T2Eagle said:

Here's a twist on the question.  What would his answer have been 10-20 years ago --- before the internet and You Tube?

Assuming you would take the same "watchful eye" only approach.  He would have had to first go the library and probably find at least two books, one on plumbing one on electricity.  If the right books weren't immediately available he/you might have had to wait weeks just to take the next step.  Having gotten a hold of the right books he would then have to wade through the material and extrapolate from probably very generic instructions how to apply the material to the specific job he wanted to accomplish.  There would probably not be a chapter in each book with step by step instructions on how to install a dishwasher.  This would have added hours to the learning process at the same time decreasing the chances of success, especially success on the first couple tries, and not only decreased the success rate but increased the chance of catastrophic failure, that is ruining a brand new machine because he got it wrong.

Instead, he was probably able to find in just a matter of minutes a video that showed exactly how to do the thing he wanted to do, maybe even specific to the model of dishwasher.  He could watch this video through a couple times in preparation for the project, and ten stop, start, and replay it as needed to work through the project step by step.  So today it's possible to spend much less time learning this task and have a much better chance of completing it successfully.

Before we get too nostalgic about how much better the old days were we should maybe stop and consider that the old days were just different --- not necessarily better.

As to the question "how do our youngsters measure up" they're mastering the skills they need for today's world in the same way folks before us mastered the skills they needed for their world.  So maybe today's youngsters are a lot better than we sometimes give them credit for. 

He read the instructions (diagrams) that came with the new dishwasher, so no difference other than today's plumbing and electrical connectors are more DIYer friendly. Now for the old clothes dryer repair,  yes he looked at videos on RepairClinic.

P.S. About "watchful eye"... Something to consider is the source of information, years ago the publisher and editors would make sure the authors were experts. Today, any knucklehead can upload video on any subject. 

@andyplaysdrums welcome to scouter.com

Let's keep the thoughtful, scout-like discussion among adults going.

Thanks

@NJCubScouter , @Sentinel947

Update Apr 18, 2018

Enough money has been raised to start sculpting the granite statue while fundraising to complete the project continues.

The monument committee is also optimistic about its chances of landing a pair of grants it has applied for and is continuing to accept online donations at www.scoutingmonument.org. Checks made payable to VFW Mackenzie-Webster Post #709 can be mailed to: Barre Scouting Monument, P.O. Box 321, Barre, Vt. 05641. Reference “scouting monument” in the memo line.

Barring any unforeseen complications, sculptor Giuliano Cecchinelli should start work later this month and be finished some time in October.

“The timing is perfect,” he said, explaining that the hope is to dedicate the monument when the Green Mountain Council holds its 20th Annual Salute to Veterans Parade in Barre on Saturday, Nov. 3.

https://www.timesargus.com/articles/barre-scouting-monument-organizers-meet-their-match/

Nice, we need more uplifting photos and videos of Scouts having fun on this forum.

@wisihalacon welcome to scouter.com

@AZScoutLeader , welcome to scouter.com

18 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

They did / have asked what's the deal with Family Scouting / Camping?  Does this mean Mom and Dad will come on outings?  Isn't one the fun parts of scouting NOT having the parents and siblings along?  As leaders our input is we do not plan any changes and will continue to execute a fun and challenging program. 

IMO, Mom and Dad, as members. will agree to come along at SM's request in order to meet YP and other safety requirements.  At the unit level, many of us are already doing this with our special needs scouts.

Another $0.02,

1 hour ago, Jameson76 said:

So...BSA will need 10,000 NEW Scouts per state to break even from the LDS departure.  With 272 councils each one will need to add 1,838 new BS4G participants.  Also there will be a need for some yet undetermined number to backfill those that age out, normal attrition, and then to replace those who vote with their feet.

Assume there will be an overhead staffing reduction plan at BSA National / Regional to maintain the corporate cost ratios

Looking at all the discussion of Family Scouting, adding girls may be just an intermediate step. IMO, National's long game plan is to switch from recruiting individual scouts to their whole families - all in the family would be on the books as members whether they participate or not, similar to the Y.  Increased headcount and revenue.

My $0.02

P.S. Our leaders may have lost their way but at the unit level, we are doing are best to faithfully delivering the program to the scouts we have.

@NCJscout welcome to scouter.com

@2Concerned welcome to scouter.com

As we were told, the BSA National Executive Board voted unaminously to approve last years membership change. Since only a quorum is needed, did LDS members abstain from attending or attend and vote in favor or...?

In July of 2016 on a 110-degree day, 12-year-old Cody Flom was hiking with his mother's boyfriend on the trail when Cody collapsed. He later died at the hospital.

"We just finished installing it this morning and we're just dedicating it to Cody Flom," said Matthew Harwood, a boy scout and a friend of Cody's, teamed up with the city of Phoenix to install the warning signs.

"We don't want something like that to happen again so this sign is being installed to specifically warn hikers about the dangers. It's not a static sign, it actually changes with the weather to let people know how dangerous it is," Hardwood said.

More at source link. Clever use of thermometer in sign design.

http://www.fox10phoenix.com/news/arizona-news/boy-scouts-family-of-cody-flom-put-up-signs-warning-of-heat-dangers

@casiodave355 , welcome to scouter.com .

Just a reminder for those of us whose invitation has yet to arrive    ...

https://nam.scouting.org/

National Shooting Sport Conference at Summit, Sept 28-30.

See link below for more info regarding conference and well as recent updates to shooting program materials.

https://www.scouting.org/outdoor-programs/shooting-sports/