qwazse

Hey, I thought I was a RA RA scouter! I cheer scouts when they look at the inspection sheet (the same one I used many decades ago) and make their own decisions. I reserve flowers and imported chocolate for moms who care for our boys (whose hips the chumps on Fashion Star would never dare put in any BSA uni). I make the best coffee in the world for guys who forgo that much-needed overtime to haul gear and boys and camp us. (And I pack some Earl Grey for the weak-stomached.) I revere the woman who will gently teach females youth about backpacking hygiene so they get the courage to set aside all those H&BA for a few days to discover the Beautiful, so that the next time they are in church, those songs actually have the grand meaning they deserve. I respect anyone with the stones to say, "We don't need to waste National's ink for this. Let's use what's already written, and work the program from there." Pardon me, if I don't join in helping the log-eyed pull motes.

You misunderstand. Designated campsites in the same acre do not exist in middle of wilderness recreation areas. You might find a campground on the periphery, but once you hike in, even 20 folks moving and camping in the vicinity of one another can be profoundly destructive. At high altitudes (or deserts, or coral reefs) like Brew describes, contingents of 10 leave an indelible mark.

The separate-but-equal argument is as noble and time-proven as BP's "partial participation" argument is linear.

Maybe I'm looking at the world all wrong. Leader stays at the rear. Gives guidance as to the next landmark and has scouts take turns advancing to the fore and reporting back their observations. At decision points, the leader has the contingent circle-up around the map and compass and develops a plan for the next few waypoints.

Don't remember it, and probably wouldn't countenance it if I heard it. Can't imagine our course director saying anything of the sort.

Different itineraries. Since I work from the venturing side of things, I call them contingents rather than patrols. But, same principle. I did one where a boy planned an outing for 40 people. (Four contingents of ten.) We actually had slightly less than that, but that's what we planned for. Morning of insertion, each contingent's navigator(s) reported to me with their itinerary, described their target camp for the night, indicated their intended direction. (This was very important because we drove up the night before and were all camped 1/4 mile of the trailhead(s). It even took me a while to get my head around the fact that our position didn't jib with where I thought I was in my head.) They also confirmed their return time for the next day. Next year, same boy planned one with contingents inserting from different ends of the same trail and crossing at some point. Drivers would exchange keys for vehicles. We had lower attendance than expected, so we never implemented it. But seemed like a good plan to me.

Advancement has a different meaning in Boy Scouts and Cub Scouts. If you want to really see different, check out Venturing's awards and recognition system (the term "advancement" is only used by folks outside of the program), which most Venturers across the country completely ignore -- so much so, that BSA is attempting to completely re-vamp it.

This warms my heart on so many levels! Let me point out that our Czech counterparts would have zero adults (maybe one SM, but unlikely) on such a hike. The 17-19 y.o. den leaders (at least one young man and one young lady -- remember the organization is co-ed from grade-school up) would be guiding the cubs. They will have submitted their plan to their SPL equivalent, who in turn would have asked the SM to review it. The SM may suggest other scouts be at key points on the trail and/or contact him if anyone misses check-in times. At least that's what I've inferred from the description of a couple of boys (expat Yanks) who were brought up in that program. Now I'm not entirely sure if the CR has anything comparable to the AT, and a six mile overshoot is on the high side but easy enough to do. (I let our crew do just that at Dolly Sods last year. My avatar is a NASA composite of our location that evening -- our site was one dark 1/2 pixel south of our target dark pixel. ) But, I'm saying that adults' nitpicking is controlled because THEY AREN'T THERE TO COMPLAIN ABOUT EVERY FOIBLE.

This is how I'm solving the problem ... I encourage qualified youth to hike and camp with a small group of buddies independent of adults. That way, from when they are in their twenties, they will have built the confidence they need to lead other youth through serious terrain for days on end. That way, when my flesh diminishes (in just a few decades ) there will be a massive movement of youth to carry on, while I sit back with the BSA perpetual new scout patrols and show them how to use a hatchet to fabricate tent pegs. I might even market the concept (how does "Qwazse contingent" sound?).

We are already down to 2 trout/week due to these streams filled with stock spawned in Mercury laden waters.

A good denner will help you assign duties (who leads pledge, who does color guard, etc ...) No, you don't have to buy the denner's chord. If other dens aren't using them there's no reason for you to. No it's not required for Webelos. Here's the wiki... http://meritbadge.org/wiki/index.php/Denner

It's not so much the weight for an 11 y.o. as it is the comfort with the gear and cohesiveness of the patrol. You don't buy a pack on Monday for a major hike on Friday, unless your team is very good at spotting when that bottle is about to fall out, or a strap is coming undone, etc ... A good backpacking contingent has at least two mechanics, two navigators, two cooks, and two really good story tellers. We tend not to do more than 6 miles with crossovers unless they've been hiking with their gear a mile or so for a couple different weekends. BUT, if we see an exceptional patrol of boys who consistently work well with each other, we may reconsider. (Even then we make sure the patrol has a "plan B" if it looks like their newbie is only good for 4 miles. Older boys have to be prepared to carry extra gear.)

All boys are different, but given the way the COs in your stake have been managing the program, your candidate DC's may not know what to expect in your den. The troop's SM and SPL should recommend the boys who would make good DC's (typically most 1st class scouts -- in the true sense of the word -- who also have demonstrated some ability to nurture younger scouts). They probably already know that DC could be used as a POR, but in all likelihood, there are plenty of other PORs available to them. What a candidate DC needs to know: When and where the den meets, usually. When and where the pack meets. The activities you will be working on. What scout skills the boys really need help with. Dates of weekend outings. Summer camp dates. If his fees will be paid if he goes. (By the way, for resident camp, DCs are definitely worth the investment!) Any religious issues if you are talking to non-LDS troops. (I don't think there should be any, but sometimes folks need to know that your are a mom asking for a little help not a missionary trying to convert -- unless your are .)

I understand what you are saying. I think rather than 1 & 2 I might go with Red Wolves & Grey Wolves. This way they can make a Den Flag, etc. and have something visible to relate to instead of just a number. As for competition causing resentment, I disagree with that. I'm of the belief that competition is healthy for growth. (Just my humble opinion) I like the idea of the den flag. Something the boys can rally around -- especially if they are sharing facilities on the same night. I'd still use the #s so they can put something on their uniforms. Pin the # to the flag just to make it clear which is which. Everything at this age is a balance. Get feedback from the den leaders, and do whatever they're okay with.

Agree with Papaddy below You need to sort out with your CD if he approves of your team distinguishing yourselves on a BSA field uniform AT ALL. Then, if he/she approves that, ask how you could go about doing that given the restriction on camp patches. (Personally, I really like the idea of converting BSA guard patches to slides. But, some camps' staff don't do neckers. ) The other option to consider is a special sticker on your name tag.

I think you just answered your question. Reason with reasonable people. They may appreciate that someone else is not only making up for lost ground, but willing to help their boy succeed.

A rose by any other name, I suppose. In our troop only CC's and MC's sit on BOR's, so that's what you could call our procedure. We simply tell the boys (and parent, if needed), "You'll be taking this up with the committee." SPLs and PLs handle most discipline problems just fine. They come to us when they're stymied. At that point CC might offer us an opinion and, as an ASM, I may offer to implement his suggestion, but we let the SM decide. When a BOR is needed, all of those avenues are past being spent. It's time for the boy to decide if he really wants to be a scout (i.e., not a name on a charter, but someone willing to live up to the Oath and Law). Our committee are pretty smart folk. Some have had kids who were suspended from school -- some deservedly, others not, so they are capable of compassion, where warranted. And the boys take them seriously. They have handled problems just shy of the bloody mess that BD's troop has -- and it's enabled us in the long run to retain some rough kids. But, I have no doubt in my mind that in a case like this, suspension would be the lightest offering, and council HQ will have been informed.

Oh, and by way of our troop's procedure ... as of the night of the infarction this would have been out of the SM's or ASMs' hands. The CC would be contacting the mom and the committee would be explaining the terms of suspension/expulsion (possibly waiting to meet the two at the door the next meeting night). The council's director of field service would have been called in case there were any services that could be tapped for both this family and that of the kids who were harmed. There have been times when things were sort of grey that the CC might ask the SM about if he was willing to work with the boy and would a warning be sufficient -- this would not have been one of those times.

No surprise there. Venturer's are best used for logistics and muscle. Nothing like the "cute factor" of a cub to actually draw the donations. "Please, sir may I have some more?" Our older boys have figured this out, and at our grocery store location, they train the first-years to make the "first contact." Especially to the ladies. The big guys make a better impression on the collection side, when a mom-of-preschoolers might need help getting her shopping to the car!

I'm still siding with BD on this one, and our unit deserved the banner "Troop XXX: we take bad kids." Yes, we've had a few thugs. Some of them had their own "personal adult attendants." I've been one of those at times. But we're not talking an indoor basketball league here. In our game, every boy can carry a knife or axe and every rock and stick can be an instant bludgeon or missile. We're pretty clear to our boys. If you can't instantly apologize when you've heated things up, or say you need to step away so you don't heat things up, if a unit that needs to be constantly "on edge" because of you, ... well it isn't functioning the way it needs to provide the personal growth every one expects from it. The nicest thing a committee can do for a kid who thinks he's above the law, sometimes, is show him the door. Everyone, even the other bullies in the bunch, NEED TO REST ASSURED THAT EXPULSION IS LIKELY if you are having trouble maintaining personal discipline.

I'd vote, but "The poll is expired." Patrols mean more than just groupings, there is a sense/expectation of independence. Unless your den leaders are willing to step back and your den chiefs willing to step up, you have nothing close to a "real patrol." Patrolling is not really competing (although in a troop, patrol leaders should be reporting about their patrols exploits -- and sometimes foibles -- with a little personal pride) but accomplishing the task of exploring our nation with modest supervision. For the sake of mere competitions, different den numbers should do. Then the balance is simply one of figuring out which things the dens need to do separate (typically, the instructional periods), the wolves can do together (typically service projects or outings), which ones can be Den 1 vs. Den 2 (typically skill improvement or sports), and which ones as part of the rest of the pack (songs, skits, etc ...). Also, keep in mind at that age increasing the "competition factor" can make a boy resent being separated from his buddies even more, so step carefully on that one.

Yep, big insecurity issues here. They want their little fiefdom, and you came on strong offering a whole new world. If you are interested in serving elsewhere besides MBC, talk to your DE or District Commissioner. He might have a suggestion or two of troops who need you. If he asks about this troop, just say "personality conflicts, I guess", shrug, and move on.

DC can be used to fulfill the position of responsibility (POR) requirements for Star, Life, or Eagle ranks. In other words, on the trail to Eagle, there are about 16 months of time where a boy is required to hold a POR.

"A scout is kind." Sometimes the best way to help a person is to tell them they don't belong.

Is it worth trying? If you don't like confrontation, it's not worth it. If you like helping a boy (and maybe parent) get the most out of scouting, it's probably worth it. I would ask the cubmaster point blank if there's anything I've done to not be worthy of the privilege of going over the boy's book with him.