mk9750

Ed, Sometimes I agree with you, sometimes I don't but the one thing I will always envy is your ability to keep it short! Mark

Allow me to do a bit of bragging. I think I'll get to a point that is on topic near the end... Last night, my youngest son, the Patrol Leader of one of the regular Patrols, was asked by the SPL to have his Patrol be responsible for demonstrating rescue carries and coming up with an activity that includes them. This was in response to an injury one of our Scouts sustained on a repelling campout. The SPL thought it a good idea to bone up on the skill. My son accepted the request (Score point one), and sat down to determine who best in his Patrol to ask. As I have mentioned before, our

Our Troop has three months every year that have no Troop events, to allow the Patrols to camp on their own. Our older guys (the Venture Patrol) do almost no camping on their own, given the conflicts other parts of their life present. They do participate in the all of the high venture stuff (climbing, rapelling, kayaking, hiking the AT), but these events are open to a select group of other boys, also. The two younger Patrols almost alsways have a weekend campout during the "free" months. In addition, my son's Patrol has started getting together every month for some Patrol activity. Sometim

We had an incident while rapelling and climbing this weekend that resulted in a broken wrist to one of our Scouts. It seems the cause of the injury, according to those who know rapelling and climbing, is the guideline in G2SS and the climbing "Topping Out" literature that requires rapellers to use two ropes. I don't understand all of the physics involved, but as I do understand, the additional friction caused by two ropes going through a figure eight is too much for many smaller guys to overcome by their weight. My point is not to debate the guideline. I don't know if it is valid or not.

River2K, Congratulations on the upcoming new position! Let's dispense with one aspect of your post quickly: Even if it makes sense, we don't have the authority to change the requirements, and there is no requirement to finish in any specific time frame. But more to the point, I think whether it is a good idea to have a time limit depends on the purposes of the Merit Badge Program. If its main purpose is to make responsible Boy Scouts, then maybe a time limit would have value. But my understanding of the purpose of the Merit Badge program is to give boys a chance to expose themse

I am worried when someone uses the phrase like "given a position of responsibility" (not an exact quote) when it refers to rank advancement. A boy should earn the right to be considered for a position of responsiblity as it relates to advancement, not be handed it. He earns this right to be considered (voted in by his peers for some positions, selected by his PL or SPL for others) by showing evidence of the willingness to try to learn and do the job well (not necesarily that he will do it well, but there should be some evidence he will try). A Scout SHOULD NOT be "given" a POR just because he

JimmyD, I suspect that how you phrased your Council's practice was not exactly how things are. I'm guessing that in your experience, most of your friends finished all of the requirments for Eagle right at the deadline - Their 18th birthday. That being the case, then a BOR obviously cannot be completed before a Scout turns 18. However, I am certain that if the boy finished his requirements enough before his 18th birthday to allow the Council to do all of the things they do in the process of arranging a BOR, it can happen before a Scout turns 18. Heck, even my Council wouldn't drag the

As both of my sons got older, they took over more and more of the making of their cars, with me moving from doing @ 70% to me doing about 5%. The less I did, the better the car finished. Can't agree with Twocubdad more. Although one has to be very cognizant of the fine line between doing with and doing for, there are few oppurtunities as precious in my memory as working with my guys on their cars. One of the picture I have in my office is of my 2nd year Webelo, my Wolf Scout, and I holding all our cars at the top of the PWD track. You'd have to pry that picture out of my dead hands to get

Our Council utilizes the same method as OGE's (verify the badges and dates from the bottom of the Eagle Application). The blue cards have no official use in our Council. Scouts turn them into me (Troop Advancment Chair), I record them in Troopmaster, and send an Advancement Report to Council. The blue cards are never checked. We've joked that from the Council's perspective, anyone could pretend they are a MB Counselor and sign the blue cards. Of course, we check to make sure everything is on the up and up, but who's checking us? The only problem we've run into is when Council went to the

Rooster: You needn't worry about your ability to communicate. You do fine. Packsaddle and others don't understand you because they start from a position of disagreeing with you. They have the same problem. They don't communicate well enough to make you understand either, because your position is almost diametricly opposed to theirs. Packsaddle made a comment exactly on this point. He said "Rooster, I and others in this forum have some understanding of your feelings on this subject. But your view, like the views of the rest of us, is just that - your own personal view. And an attempt

Scoutdad, The one absolute in this is in the comment you made "If he had been firmly interested in going the money problem could be solved." As long as that's true (and I believe it's ALWAYS true), then it becomes a matter of judging the politics of the situation. And it sounds like your right - there isn't enough interest to justify the spitting contest you'd have on your hands if you made issues about this. Now, why you have a SM with whom your boys don't want to take a great trip is another issue... Mark

Fog, your risking raising the ire of a couple of Air Force guys in these forums. A bit of disdain, eh? And by the way, I am not one. I didn't think serving my country was the honor that I believe it is now. Sure wish I had been smarter then. Thank you to whoever did. Even the Air Force guys. Mark

Yes, congratulations! If it means anything, it must be a great job. Our SM and two ASMs both stayed on after their sons graduated out of the Troop. The program must have something to offer back! Best of luck. Look forward to hearing about your fun (OK, and maybe a problem or two, if you have them). Mark

Dave, Adventure is one thing. What you describe is peril. Seems like you're leaning the way I know I would... Mark

Laura, you make many good points here, but I do disagree with one of them. You are right that a youth has no standing to make a legal commitment, that that is the parents right and responsiblity alone. but I don't see a cimmitment to attend a Scout event, even one as arduous as Philmont, as a legal commitment. And if it isn't, then we are sabotaging our efforts to allow boys to be responsible for themselves if we don't hold them responsible for their actions. As I suggested before, I am not saying make him pay the whole thing, but he did make the commitment, apparently, and people co

When a group of our boys decide they are doing a high venture trip, they elect an crew leader. One of his responsibilites is to plan and lead a crew meeting that includes the parents of potential crew members. At the meeting all of the expectations of each member of the crew is discussed, including payment schedules. We've kicked around requiring at least the initial down payment being made in real money (cash or check instead of out of a Scout account), but we've never been stung yet, so that hasn't been initiated, but it might be a good idea. We've never done the alternate idea before,

Sorry I don't have the details as to which editions I am speaking of, but here's what I can add: My oldest son (now 18) had the handbook that was in use immediately prior to the major requirements change (requiring Personal Fitness for Eagle, etc.). My youngest son (14) has the handbook that was issued right after that change. My older son looked through the entire new book when he heard our SM complain that it wasn't as good as the previous. My son said he was shocked by the amount of Scout Skill info they had taken out, although most of it was available in the Fieldbook. Once he sa

I too would allow the Counselor to make the determination for himself, as long as he is consistent with his expectation. But remember, the requirement is optional. a scout only has to do this requirement (just like any requirement for any MB) if he decides he wants to pursue Camping MB. If he sets a goal to become an Eagle Scout, then he must choose to meet this requirement. But until that becomes HIS goal, camping 20 nights is not required. Mark

KS, We have a trailer now but are considering selling it and finding a box truck. Here are the reasons: 1) 8' x 12' has become a tad too small 2) We only bought a single axle, and we now believe a tatem axle trailer would be better. 3) For a number of reasons, including above, we almost had a disaster going to summer camp last year. As we started down a pretty good size hill on the interstate not 10 minutes from home, the trailer started swerving terribly. At one point it was close to 45 degrees off center, until a tire blew and caused it to start tracking again. We had two adult

We use Scout accounts, and we use Troopmaster, although we don't use Troopmaster for Scout accounts. We had a policy a few years back that all money in Scout accounts reverted back to the Troop if a boy left the Troop. that was fine at the time, as all monies in the accounts were earned doing Troop fundraising activities. A few years ago, a number of us, including our Quartermaster, began purchasing needed items with money from our own pocket, and trying to make things easier on everyone by turning in the receipt and asking that the money be credited to our (or our son's) Scout accou

Eagledad has the right idea, I think. We did the auto mechanics theme two years ago (man, it's been THAT long?). The SPL assigned a boy to contact a car dealership and got us a mechanic who volunteered to bring us into the shop, where he went over all of the basic maintenance needs of a car and how to do them, and a real nice presentatation on what to watch for to identify potential problems. The next few weeks, boys rotated tires, changed oil, replaced headlamps, and about 10 other things on mom's and dad's cars. the guys who had their own cars really got a lot out of this. The PLC tried

Mike, Let me see- 9 days hiking 105 miles on the Appalachian Trail 4 weekend kayaking trips 1 week at Tinnerman Canoe Base in Canada One weekend at Climbing instructor training for 4 of our older Scouts to be Junior instructors One four day weekend of climbing and repelling coming up in October A weekend kayaking trip in PA scheduled for October Trying to count everything up, I think guys in our Troop will have spent 432 days doing high venture stuff. That doesn't include the approximately 140 days adults in our Troop will spend with these guys, nor does

Eamonn, I don't know about pedantic, but in this case, you were certainly redundant! Mark

Mike, Your description is almost exactly how our venture activities work. When the older guys get together and decide they want to do something, one guy is elected (although I suspect that the "election" is a very informal activity) as crew chief for that event. If not already trained, that boy is responsible for becoming the expert in whatever they decide to do. For instance, when our guys wanted to do more extreme kayaking, one guy arranged for 5 of the boys and 4 of the adults to go through the complete American Red Cross Kayaking program. With the confidence that comes from "becoming

FOG, Sorry, but I've got to disagree with your last point. I don't think the the BSA requires that we live by their rules outside of Scouting. We certainly should be living by the Scout Oath and Law, and I also think we are expected to be a role model to the boys in our units even outside of Scouting. But I don't think it is Scouting's position to regulate our actions outside of Scouting. Some examples (I know some of these have been debated before, and few have been agreed on. But I think you'll get my point): 1) We are not permitted to smoke in front of Scouts. But there is no