AvidSM

I agree that most districts are always in need of good volunteers. The key word here is "good". If I hear a scouter is looking to help out at the district level, the first things I ask is, "Who is the person? What is their experience? What can they do? Wanting to help is a good thing. Giving specific ways in which you can help is better. If you don't know how the district operates and what it does, join it's committee and attend some meetings. Talk to some of the key volunteers and see what is going on. Find out what you can do to help, then offer your services in a specific way. Don't worry about getting a whole lot of responsibilty dumped on you all at once - that won't happen until they get to know you and see that you can perform as a volunteer.

I always tell the new parents when joining the troop, that we don't expect their son to make all the meetings. But, if they miss too many, they will not benefit as much from the program - that they get out of it what they put it. I've got so many different kinds of scouts in my troop that it would be hard to expect them all to show up 100% of the time. There are one's who really love scouting and seem to make it to every meeting - this is the group that the Eagle scouts come from. Then there are the seasonal scouts who play baseball, football, etc. Then there are the scouts who's parents only allow them to attend their meeting if there homework is done! All are welcome in my troop. We keep the one's who miss meetings informed through emails and our web site. Scouts that miss a few meetings in a row get a call from their patrol leader (or SPL) to find out why.

Just recently, my troop committee nominated an adult for the OA. There were two adults eligible and we were all very open and honest in debating who should get the nomination. Since both were equally deserving, we chose the adult who's son was just elected as an ordeal candidate. This made sense to us, since the father and son can do their ordeal toghether. Also, the father can now drive his son and the other youth candidates to the ordeal and back.

Evmori posted, "An Eagle project can't be done at or for the BSA, but service projects for all other ranks can." Ed, can you please cite where this is written as BSA policy? My troop's policy is that no service project can be done at or for the benefit of the BSA. How could you call it "community" service if it is not done for the community? There are many examples of suggested service projects given in the Scoutmaster's Handbook, none of which list the BSA a benefactor. As for helping a Sunday School teacher with her preschool class, that may be a "good turn" but does not qualify as a service project.

Good post by Eagledad - especially when he says, "The boys brains are trained to respect adults when they speak, and we adults trained ourselves through parenting that when we speak, youth better listen, or else. It is not an equal relationship and the boys know it." A good scoutmaster knows to watch very carefully what he/she says at a PLC meeting because of the way boys are trained. It's not natural to keep your mouth shut and you really have to learn when it is a good time add your words of wisdom. I don't agree with msnowman's statement, "The boys do the planning. The SM/ASM approves/disapproves what they are doing. The SPL presents to the Troop Committee as necessary." The SM/ASM guide, advise and mentor the PLC in order that they make the right decision. They do not have approval authority over the PLC. This would mean that they have the final say in the decision process and not the boys. It that is the case, the boys are not really making the descision, the adults are. The SPL should not have to report to the Troop Committee, that is the Scoutmaster's job. The SPL reports to the Scoutmaster, who acts as a buffer between the youth and the adults in the troop. You cannot expect a youth to deal with the adults in the Troop committee with respect to all the program issues. Let the SPL deal with the boys - let the Scoutmaster deal with the adults.

In my District, the job mostly entails promoting our Council's summer camp. You also work with the OA Lodge in putting together a information booklet of all the campsites in your area.

My answer to your question is, "it depends". It depends on your level of maturity. You will most likely be in a patrol with people your parent's age. You will have to work as a team with these scouters. You will have the most current view of scouting from having just been a youth. This is your advantage over them. Their advantage over you would be their age and experience as adult leaders. It also depends on the support you will need from your troop. You will write your ticket based on your current position in scouting, Assistant Scoutmaster. To accomplish your ticket, you will need the cooperation of the leaders in your troop, both adult and youth. Talk to the Scoutmaster and SPL before you attend Wood Badge and get their commitment. Also, see if the Troop would be willing to pay for all or half of your course fee.

Having chaired many camporees and klondikes, I have seen a lot of these temporary patrols. They make sense when a troop is not big enough to have patrols that can compete at a camporee under their own flag. I don't mind these patrols competing - at least they are trying to follow the patrol method, if only for the term of event. And the scout's don't mind telling you that their patrol is only temporary if you ask them. Accepting this as being normal to scouting bothers me also. District leaders should try as much as possible to encourge the patrol method, especially at camporees. Instead of accepting it as the norm, they should be working on increasing attendance at these events. It bothers me also that the unit leaders at a roundtable were able to vote on camporee policy decisions. That should be done by the district activity or program chair - the person with the experience and training in such matters.

Scoutingagain hit upon an important point, that this type of thing could happen when religion is not discussed at the Troop level. I make it a point to bring up a scout's religous duties and responsibilities at every Scoutmaster's conference. Belief in God is a vital part of scouting. A scout who was not asked about his belief in God until his EBOR, was not properly prepared for it. The Scoutmaster who sent that Scout into his EBOR did not fully know his character. What if the scout at his EBOR said, "I don't belive in God"? What if the board members then find out no one in his troop ever asked him if he believed in God? He would fail his EBOR because of this and the fault would be with his Troop for never asking. An EBOR should not be the first time a scout is asked about his belief in God.

Eagle!

Last year, my lodge became very strict when it comes to an adult being nominated by the troop committee. They make it very clear in their nomination form that it should not be for the purpose of adult recognition. They want adults nominated that through their scouting job, make the OA more meaningful for the in the lives of the youth. We are also limited to one adult per year. And, yes, he or she must meet all camping requirement that the youth must meet. My troop committee did nominate on adult last year and he did complete his ordeal. I had to write a letter of recommendation for him, listing his qualification as a role model for the youth of the troop.

I haven't seen anything posted yet on BSA's national web site or my local council's web site about the 2010 Jamboree. GNX Guy - Where is your information coming from?

It's all on the honor system. The BSA make everything look offical enough and hopes that people will follow it. The problem is there are some that stay in the program long enough to begin to see faults in the BSA's rules and regulations. They think to themselves, "if the BSA is wrong here, perhaps they are wrong over there too". There is nothing wrong with using one's experience to make sensible changes to the program. There is a limit to how far you SHOULD go, but there is no limit to how far you CAN go.

Of course the BSA wants scouts to wear uniforms - its the most obvious and outward sign of what we are. It just doesn't want a lack of money to prevent a scout from joining - which would be the case if uniforms were manditory. Further along in second paragraph of page 152 of the SM Handbook, where is states uniforms are not required, the issue of money is addressed and how a scout can "take on projects and find part-time jobs..." to pay for his uniform. The other methods are, by default, required since nowhere is it written that they are not. You can argue about whether you choose to apply them or not. Throw them all out and still call yourself a boy scout troop? For what pupose? If you had any understanding of why boy scouting exists you whould know that the methods are all interconnected and all needed. And, for those with this understanding, I'll ask and answer questions.

As far as I can tell, the uniform is the only method that is not required. Nowhere is it written that any of the other methods are not. If fact, it written that "A Scout troop functions best when all eight methods are employed". I think the reason that we all ask questions in the forum is because we are all as volunteers motivated to do our best and are seeking ways in which we can employ all eight methods successfully. As volunteers we have no profit motive, so we seek personal satisfaction through our own success and hopefully the success of others. It is obvious from the many posts here in this forum that there are troops that do not use all eight methods; that there are scout leaders who choose to modify the program to meet their own standard of success. But there is a limit to how far you can go - a point at which you can no longer be recognized as conducting a Scouting program, as required by your charter. Having no prior knowledge, if you walked into a meeting room, or an outdoor campsite, and saw a group of people involved in an activity, how could you tell they were boy scouts? What would you look for? The most obvious thing would be uniforms - funny that its the one method not required.

I have a problem with one item on your list - the winter coat. Proper layering would include: a wicking layer, several insulative layers and a outer shell to protect the other two layers from the weather. A hooded nylon outer shell would work as long as it's not going to rain. Otherwise you need a material that is waterproof and breaths, like gortex. A hood plus a knit hat (or even better a baclava), helps keep the body heat better - 1/3 of which you lose from the neck up. I've been in bitter cold weather and felt my neck getting cold with just a hood and knit hat on. By having more than one insulative layer, you can make adjustments depending on how cold you feel or how much heat you are producing from activity. One thick winter coat does not allow you for much ajustment - it's either on, zipped open or off. The more options you have to make adjustments, the more comfortable you will be as the weather or your activity level changes. Being comfortable means you are not too hot - which could lead to sweating, or not too cold, which could lead to hypothermia. Too much sweat and your wicking layer and insulation gets wet and you will be too cold.

One scout in my troop has already worn out the knees on his pair of switchbacks. This makes sense to me since they are made of thinner material than the other pants. The material is also pilling - which is what you call those little balls of stuff on the inner leg, as ccjj mentioned. Seems to me they could make the material a little thicker in order to hold up against wear and tear.

I agree that you have to know the boy and make your own determination - Star and 14 years old is a rule-of-thumb. I would also be good if the boy was SPL/ASPL or was looking to become one soon. That way, his training can be applied to his position and will most benefit the troop. The feedback that I got from my current SPL and ASPL, who attended the course last year, was very good. My SPL helps me out with TLT and is able to bring in his NYLT prespective on things.

Welcome to the forum! I'm a Scoutmaster in New Jersey also. I will have 10th years with my Troop come March and three years as SM come June. I was an ASM for six years. My son made Eagle four years ago. Sounds like you have a very strong program in your unit. Looking forward to reading your posts.

About overprotective parents, I agree that it's getting worse. I don't blame them for being overprotective. Look at all that's going on, with child abductions and internet stalkers. I let these parents go on campouts - because otherwise, they would not let their sons go. Like Knight mentioned, at a campout when they can't find something or didn't know how to do this or that - they go right to their parent - not a fellow scout or adult leader. This kind of defeats the whole pupose of them being there in the first place. So, what's the point of them being a boy scout? Over the years, I have seen more and more Webelos II's who were not ready to be boys scouts yet. They needed time to mature and build self confidence. Some stay with the troop with the help of their overprotective parents - it's a tradeoff that a Scoutmaster has to accept. Yes, it's like a "Webelos III" transition period. Yes, these parents are a pain in the butt to keep in-line at campouts. But, I have seen scouts go through this transition and are now really into scouting and developing rapidly into fine young adults.

Every summer camp I've been to it's hats off in the dining hall. No formal reason for it is given. I have heard it's "out of respect" for "scouts that have given their all". Did this rule originate in the military service? I know that in the Navy/USMC, you remove your cover (hat) when indoors. I think it's a matter of practicality - your cover protects your head from the elements when outdoors and is not needed and so should be removed when indoors. As a male catholic, I know about our hats-off-in-church rule. Don't know for sure about the other religions - I think males keep their hats on in a jewish temple. I believe you should respect the rules of the place you are in. If it's hats off in a LDS church, then that's the rule that should be followed. Just point to the fellow's head with the hat on and make the universal "take your hat off" jesture.

I also question the idea of the second place boy serving the second six months. In theory, the second place boy was not elected SPL - he lost the election to the boy who came in first place. Perhaps you can use this logic to reverse your decision and allow for new elections when the SPL's term expires? Perhaps you could ask the PLC what they want to do in this situation, since they are the one's who are supposed to be making the decisions in a boy-run troop? I find that a year long term for SPL works well. Because it's mostly on-the-job-training, it takes about six months before a new SPL is performing adequately. Why remove him from the position just when he starts getting good at it? Rangersteve - I wish you well in your new position as scoutmaster. Don't be afraid of letting the boys make the decisions. They are going to make mistakes and it's your job to make sure they learn from them. And, they won't learn anything if you are the one making the mistakes.

Having a PLC meeting before summer camp is a great idea. We had one last year and went over the what was expected from all the youth leaders. We also discussed plans for what the troop was and wasn't going to participate in camp-wide. We also have a PLC meeting every night while at summer camp, so this pre-meeting made the Sunday night meeting a lot easier. Don't worry about what the former SM thinks. You are the SM now and you should do what you feel is right. If he's a good person, he should know this. By the way, are you going to change your Username to SM162? ;>) Go Giants!!!!

CNYScouter - I am confused by your question. Unless your Troop Guide (TG) is your Ticket Councelor (TC), you contacted the wrong person. Your TC is the only person who determines that your ticket is complete and signs your paperwork, not your TG. The TC then sends the paperwork to your SM for the course and he/she signs it and then submits it to council for processing. Then your SM will get your WB beads, woggle, necker and certificate and then contact you for scheduling the ceremony. Best of luck and keep on scouting. Eagles soar above all other critters!

I have taught both the old JLT and the new TLT and can say from experience that TLT is the way to go. JLT had outdated videos and spent too much time on team building and other games. TLT tells the boys how a troop should be organized, who they should report to, what their job is, what sucess looks like in that job and to set a goal. I always say, "If you don't tell them, they don't know." JLT did not focus enough on what it is they are supposed to be doing as youth leaders in a Troop. I agree that the TLT publication from the BSA is only an outline and does not provide a novice Scoutmaster with the details. But, with a little common sense and perhaps talking to some more experienced Scouters at a roundtable, a Scoutmaster can fill in the details and put together a training course which follows the outline. If a Scoutmaster can't teach, there is no reason why he/she shouldn't get help from someone who can. As others have posted, the old JLT and Green Bar Bill's stuff does not fall in line with the new council level NYLT or national level NAYLE. Scouting is always changing and moving forward. Teaching the old JLT and sticking to the old methods does not serve the youth leaders in your troop or scouting well.