Softening Scouting in the outdoors

[EagleInKY]

Related to the idea of the "softening of scouting", and to some of the topics regarding the book "The Dangerous Book For Boys". I noticed last week at camp a real fear to doing anything with the boys in moderately bad weather, but that the adults didn't seem to care.

 

The big camp-wide game is held on Tuesday nights. It involves teams running from one section of camp to the other and performing tests of different scout skills. It's one of the highlights of the week for the boys. It's supposed to start at 7:30. The rule was that if it was raining at 7:30, it would be canceled, because they didn't want scouts running around camp on wet ground. Of course, it rained from 7:25-7:35. It was a fairly light rain, but the competition was canceled.

 

Second, the vespers service was canceled because it was raining and they didn't want scouts walking in the storm to the dining hall (where it's held in inclement weather).

 

Finally, the OA Callout was canceled for the same reason. I heard the staff member on the radio say they didn't want boys "walking in the rain" to the ceremony. I couldn't believe that an organization which is based on cheerful service and sacrifice and dedicated to improving our outdoor/camping program would be concerned about scouts getting a little wet. It blew my mind.

 

On the other end of the spectrum, the adults played their annual softball game in a big field during a heavy rain and thunderstorm. Lightening was flashing across the sky, but it wouldn't stop that game for anything. The same goes for the SM's golf tournament (homeaid equipment), horseshoe tournament and other activities.

 

Are you seeing the same thing in your summer camps?

[evmori]

At our summer camp, it has to be raining real hard to flat cancel something.

[Gunny2862]

Rained first 3 days of Camp.

Swimming was held unless lightning was detectable - at any distance. Watercraft - Canoes, Sailing, etc. same. All other classes except Rope/Tower work went as normal.

 

If it ain't rainin', it ain't trainin'.

[OldGreyEagle]

here at Northeast,PA. we still remember the scout who was killed at Goose Pond scout reservation by lightning and perhaps the reticence of the staff had more to do with liabilities with rain and lightning strikes. This was discussed at the forum and I beleive while we couldnt tell what would happen, perhaps canceling things when its raining out of concern for lightning safety is one of them.

 

 

[Beavah]

OGE beat me to it.

 

EagleinKY, my bet is that the camp you went to recently had some boy slip and hurt himself on a muddy trail in the rain. That seems to be the theme, anyway... not wanting boys to be walking in the rain on muddy trails.

 

Their rules probably reflect the amount of grief they got over some sort of incident like that.

 

B

 

[John-in-KC]

Beavah,

 

Kids used to play in the rain until the thunder got about 10 seconds away. Now, it seems like we shut camp pools down when the first lightning strike is 5 miles away, and we wait until it's 5 miles past.

 

Is that part of a National Camp Standard?

[scoutldr]

From the NOAA National Weather Service:

 

An Approaching Thunderstorm: When to Seek Safe Shelter: Lightning can strike as far as 10 miles from area where it is raining. That's about the distance you can hear thunder. If you can hear thunder, you are within striking distance. Seek safe shelter immediately.

 

Outdoor Activities: Minimize the Risk of Being Struck: Most lightning deaths and injuries occur in the summer. Where organized outdoor sports activities take place, coaches, camp counselors and other adults must stop activities at the first roar of thunder to ensure everyone time to get a large building or enclosed vehicle. Leaders of outdoors events should have a written plan that all staff are aware of and enforce.

 

Indoor Activities: Things to Avoid: Inside building, stay off corded phones, computers and other electrical equipment that put you in direct contact with electricity. Stay away from pools, indoor or outdoor, tubs, showers and other plumbing. Buy surge suppressors for key equipment. Install ground fault protectors on circuits near water or outdoors. When inside, wait 30 minutes after the last strike, before going out again.

 

 

[OldGreyEagle]

I just noticed this at the YMCA where I swim. Posted all around the Pool is the statement "Pool will close for any lightening/thunder".

 

We may not agree with it, but if the YMCA is doing it, it's more than just the BSA being soft(This message has been edited by OldGreyEagle)

[fotoscout]

In this day and age it's prudent to shutdown risky activities when lightening and thunder are in the area. I happen to believe that most camps are deficient in posting and communicating an action plan for lightening events in the area of camp.

 

However, when it's just raining some judgment needs to be used. Torrential rains certainly warrant the shutdown of many, if not all outdoor activities. But light to moderate rain ought to be view as just a nuisance and nothing more. Boys will always slip in the mud, and they will always get cut with pocket knives. It's foolish to think that we can provide a camp environment that is so sterile that know one has the potential for injury.

 

This sounds like the fear of litigation taking over.

[Gonzo1]

Rain is one thing, lightning is another. As someone who has been struck by lightning, I have a greater respect than most people. But, if it's just raining, break out the ponchos and move on.

 

Remember: It doesn't rain in the boy Scouts, it rains ON the Boy Scouts.

 

[Vicki]

Well, Gunny and I are from the same general neck of the woods, so it shouldn't be a surprise when I say that everything except the water activities and stuff involving rocks and towers go on as usual. Of course, tornado advisories and such are a completely different animal than simple rain - as Gonzo suggests, quite reasonably. Hopefully reasonable people make reasonable decisions based on the facts available. It's really easy to second-guess once you know that severe weather cell was forced south of you and the predicted (hah, just TRY to predict weather in eastern Missouri!) downpour didn't happen.

 

Our summer camps also have a fire and severe weather drill (different blasts on the horn for each) every Tuesday. Like a buddy check, camp activities stop until every troop does what they're supposed to do. I noticed when we went out of council that other camps don't necessarily do this. Does yours?

 

Vicki

[Gunny2862]

I don't remember the fire and severe weather drill but they may have happened the during the 10 hours I had to leave during the week (my basement flooded - sump pump froze up).

But we did have a "Lost Camper" drill when someone (turned out to be a staff member) was reported walking down the highway in their Scout shirt. That drill went amazingly well. Everyone on the site was at the dining hall and accounted for in less than 15 minutes from the time the call went out.

[WVCubDad]

At Cub Resident Camp last month our Pack's only scheduled swimming period was cancelled due to thunder. The rule explained to us was out of the water and under the pavillion until 15 minutes passed with no more thunder. True to form at 14:15 another clap of thunder and a conference with the adult leadership resulted in calling it off since another 15 minute wait, the inbrief and buddy tag drill and we'd have about 15 minutes to swim before the end of the session and getting ready for dinner.

 

Aside from being disappointed about not getting to swim, my son (6 at the time) didn't really care for the thunder and we went back to the tent and played cards and talked for a while.

 

During the rain we heard some trees come down in a nearby campsite and found out later that the residents of that site would have to stay at the dining hall while the camp ranger cleaned it up. Didn't take too long, I think they were able to get back in before taps. I can deal with thunder and lightening, not sure I like being a walking nail waiting for a tree to drive me into the ground .

 

One thing I did become aware of is my son's intense dislike of being outdoors in a thunderstorm, almost bordering on a distinct fear of it. Except for the first camping trip we went on last year, every trip has had some rain (I was a CDAT in the Army and concur with the if it ain't raining, it ain't training theory and try to project a hey it's no big deal attitude to the boys.)

 

We're working on the rain stuff and he's getting a bit better with it. Hopefully we'll have some nicer weather camping trips later this summer and fall.

 

John

Assistant Cubmaster

Pack 13

Shenandoah Area Council

 

 

[local1400]

I wonder what happens in the Pacific NW where there is more than average rainfall. Any OR/WA Scouters out there who want to weave a tale? I hear it rains briefly, but daily in HI. Never been there yet so I don't know. But I have worked at camp where it rains 5 or 6 days straight and I know I didn't lay in my bunk all week and wouldn't want to anyway. Scouting is an outdoor event, and that means taking what God drops on you whether it be 30F and snowing hard with a 20MPH wind, or 95F and holy-smokes-it's humid.(We endure both in New England.)

[Gonzo1]

I think some of the weakness comes from weak leaders.

 

We have this guy in our church (not a scouter) who likes to camp, but the only thing he cooks is hot dogs and hamburgers. I offered to go on a two family campout and I could show him a thing or two, but he said "why bother, hot dogs work"

 

I told him I could make pizza in camp, he would rather call out to domino's.

 

He said if it rained, he would just hide in his tent with the family. I started to chuckle, in fact, I'm chuckling now.

 

Gonzo