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Chapter 11 Announced - Part 5 - RSA Ruling

Eagle1993

By Eagle1993
in Issues & Politics

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Eagle94-A1
Eagle94-A1

I also was abused at home. Best thing my father ever did was leave. Scouting was my safe place, and all of the adults were positive role models who i can never thank enough. They showed me positive wa

IWasAbusedinScouting
IWasAbusedinScouting

Sir, I find your comments juvenile, vile and disgusting. You certainly disgrace the few decent people I have personally spoke with who are still trying to defend the organization as being still worth-

mrjohns2
mrjohns2

@David CO Sometimes, things end up being what you weren't trying to do. You may not think that your troop was a safe place, that you didn't adopt any of the scouts, and that it wasn't a big brother pr

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swilliams Senior Member

swilliams

Posted
Posted
  On 8/27/2021 at 2:02 AM, Eagle94-A1 said:

I'm there with you. My only advice is:

FOCUS ON YOUR SCOUTS! (emphasis, not shouting at ya.)

I am once again involved at the district, for the moment,  because my sons wanted me to run the district camporee so it would be fun. But once camporee is done, so am I at the district level.

The council can merge with neighboring councils next year, sell/return to trusts the camps after my camporee for all I care (although I will miss the local one tremendously),  but my focus is on my Scouts.

As to why I am active here and a few other places, one reason is that I get more info here than from my council. Sad when you find out on Scouter.com what is going on and tell your DE, and he is absolutely clueless.

Good luck.

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That last paragraph is what brought me here a few years back. Yes, a wealth on information here. 

Our council has still declined to tell us the amount we will owe, though we didn’t get a letter telling us what the fee increase would be (with an emphasis on what a bargain it is).  To be fair, it does seem they are keeping council fees low compared to what they were last year. 

I did not get a reply to my email pointing out that there is no longer a NDA keeping council from letting us know what the damages will be. Unsurprised. Husband said I shouldn’t have sent it, but what are they going to do?  Fire me?  🤣

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CynicalScouter Senior Member

CynicalScouter

Posted
Posted (edited)

PS: if the notification and solicitation that BSA came up with was part of a conspiracy with Stang, why then did the TCC file objections to the BSA plan?

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/818172_601.pdf

  On 8/29/2021 at 5:54 PM, Muttsy said:

Who objected? 

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The TCC for one.

OBJECTION OF THE TORT CLAIMANTS’ COMMITTEE TO (A) DEBTORS’ MOTION, PURSUANT TO 11 U.S.C. § 502(B)(9), BANKRUPTCY RULES 2002 AND 3003(C)(3), AND LOCAL RULES 2002-1(E), 3001-1, AND 3003-1, FOR AUTHORITY TO (I) ESTABLISH DEADLINES FOR FILING PROOFS OF CLAIM, (II) ESTABLISH THE FORM AND MANNER OF NOTICE THEREOF, (III) APPROVE PROCEDURES FOR PROVIDING NOTICE OF BAR DATE AND OTHER IMPORTANT INFORMATION TO ABUSE VICTIMS, AND (IV) APPROVE CONFIDENTIALITY PROCEDURES FOR ABUSE VICTIMS [DKT. NO. 18]
AND (B) SUPPLEMENT TO BAR DATE MOTION [DKT. NO. 557]

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/818172_601.pdf

Edited by CynicalScouter
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mrjohns2 Senior Member

mrjohns2

Posted
Posted
  On 8/29/2021 at 5:04 PM, CynicalScouter said:

@Muttsyposted this but I really think it needs to be reiterated here: BSA top officials KNEW they had a child sex abuse problem and hid it from even their own folks.

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It took me a long time to get to the the spot of agreeing with this, but the forum was a big part. I am not sure if it was @ThenNow or just a combination of others and my thoughts, but I got there.

This is how I think of it. BSA starts and moves along through time. We can see the cases of CSB and IVF file dates. So, at first, they get word of people that should be in the IVF for CSB. Ok, they fill out the form and put it in the file cabinet. Then, they get 10, then 100, then 200. Soon, the file cabinet is full. 

They didn't step back and say "something is up". 

Then they have to buy a new cabinet, they fill that one, they get another and another and another.

They didn't step back and say "something is up". 

When they get to 10,000, then 20,000, then require a new room for the file cabinets. 

They didn't step back and say "something is up". 

It did start out small and just a bad thing to happen a few times. When it got to the hundreds upon hundreds and thousands upon thousands, they needed to say "somethings rotten in the state of Denmark." It was a chance to find out what draws the perpetrators, the volume of abuse, etc.

It would be the same if there was a string of scouts cutting off a finger or 2. One would think when they got to 1000 fingers amputated, they would think something is wrong with the system and take action.  

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CynicalScouter Senior Member

CynicalScouter

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 8/29/2021 at 5:54 PM, Muttsy said:

Who objected? 

Expand  

By the way: you know who did NOT file any objections to the BSA plan for soliciting and notifying victims?

AIS.

If Kosnoff, AVA, or anyone else had a problem they could have filed objections. The insurers did. The TCC did.

AIS never did.

Edited by CynicalScouter
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1980Scouter Senior Member

1980Scouter

Posted
Posted

I do not know how I feel about scouting continuing.  It was a very good program for me in my time, but I feel like I did not have any knowledge of all the horrors going on. 

As many posters have said home life in the past was not great. Mine was no different, not so great. Scouting was a fun time most of the time. I feel like the BSA needs to shut down and reboot maybe in the future. They are going to lose most of their assets in this proceeding. 

Scouting now is more about large paid staffs on councils. Maybe rebooting can get back to the roots of very few employees and focusing on Scout values and camping, not fund raising.

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Muttsy Senior Member

Muttsy

Posted
Posted
  On 8/29/2021 at 6:01 PM, CynicalScouter said:

 

  On 8/29/2021 at 5:54 PM, Muttsy said:

Who objected? 

Expand  

By the way: you know who did NOT file any objections to the BSA plan for soliciting and notifying victims?

AIS.

If Kosnoff, AVA, or anyone else had a problem they could have filed objections. The insurers did. The TCC did.

AIS never did.

 

Expand  

At the time AIS was represented by the TCC. The TCC represented the AIS claimants indeed all claimants interests at that time. That objection was filed on behalf of all survivors.  The objection was fine and it got some of what it wanted but please don’t conflate a nation-wide noticing campaign intended to protect BSA with justice for survivors in non-window states that you apparently agree should be thrown under the bus. 

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CynicalScouter Senior Member

CynicalScouter

Posted
Posted
  On 8/29/2021 at 5:54 PM, Muttsy said:

Who objected? 

Expand  

Just to be clear, when it came to the solicitation/notifications of victims process, the following groups/lawyers objected.

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/816767_558.pdf

The TCC: https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/816767_558.pdf

Hartford and other insurers: https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/819481_651.pdf

Century: https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/819519_656.pdf

Allianz insurance: https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/819529_659.pdf

And yet somehow AIS never objected.

Huh. Weird.

I can fine nothing in the record about Konsoff Law Firm PLLC objecting.

Nothing about AVA.

Nothing about Eisenberg, Rothweiler, Winkler, Eisenberg & Jeck. They were notified of the hearing and were part of the case since the start.

How strange that there was a conspiracy between Stang and BSA, but Stang a) in on record as opposing the BSA plan and b) not one member of AIS objected.

Ah, well.

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SiouxRanger Senior Member

SiouxRanger

Posted
Posted
  On 8/29/2021 at 6:00 PM, mrjohns2 said:

It took me a long time to get to the the spot of agreeing with this, but the forum was a big part. I am not sure if it was @ThenNow or just a combination of others and my thoughts, but I got there.

This is how I think of it. BSA starts and moves along through time. We can see the cases of CSB and IVF file dates. So, at first, they get word of people that should be in the IVF for CSB. Ok, they fill out the form and put it in the file cabinet. Then, they get 10, then 100, then 200. Soon, the file cabinet is full. 

They didn't step back and say "something is up". 

Then they have to buy a new cabinet, they fill that one, they get another and another and another.

They didn't step back and say "something is up". 

When they get to 10,000, then 20,000, then require a new room for the file cabinets. 

They didn't step back and say "something is up". 

It did start out small and just a bad thing to happen a few times. When it got to the hundreds upon hundreds and thousands upon thousands, they needed to say "somethings rotten in the state of Denmark." It was a chance to find out what draws the perpetrators, the volume of abuse, etc.

It would be the same if there was a string of scouts cutting off a finger or 2. One would think when they got to 1000 fingers amputated, they would think something is wrong with the system and take action.  

Expand  

This is just a d*mning analysis.

And, upon the move to Irving, someone had to point to a set of plans and say, "This is where the IV files go." 

And was that room a key-card access only room?  "We have to make this a secure area."  "Why?"  "Can't tell you."

"Oh the tangled web we weave, when we first practice to deceive."

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CynicalScouter Senior Member

CynicalScouter

Posted
Posted (edited)
  On 8/29/2021 at 6:12 PM, Muttsy said:

justice for survivors in non-window states that you apparently agree should be thrown under the bus

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I don't want any survivor to be "thrown under the bus." What I have said, repeatedly, is a bankruptcy judge cannot magically make all the SoLs go away.

I've asked before and you've never answered, but I'll ask again: What is your desired end state here?

The judge in facts waives that magic wand?

That BSA's bankruptcy fails and we go back to status quo ante (circa January 2020) and lawsuits in state courts?

A dead BSA?

Some combo?

Edited by CynicalScouter
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Muttsy Senior Member

Muttsy

Posted
Posted
  On 8/29/2021 at 6:01 PM, CynicalScouter said:

By the way: you know who did NOT file any objections to the BSA plan for soliciting and notifying victims?

AIS.

If Kosnoff, AVA, or anyone else had a problem they could have filed objections. The insurers did. The TCC did.

AIS never did.

Expand  

Stang and the TCC signed the RSA. What are you talking about? 

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