Jump to content


  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won


Everything posted by CynicalScouter

  1. Update: Moving Some Churchill Recommendations Forward While several items were mentioned about not moving forward "at this time", there's nothing about Since they haven't explicitly rejected, I can reasonably assume they are going ahead with it. And we still have no idea what the "minimum standards to be considered a council" are going to be. I am thinking this is probably right. But this was interesting
  2. I found it on Reddit, and the National staffer who leaked it was cut as part of the recent layoffs. I wonder what would have happened had that not been leaked. How bad it would have been.
  3. First, I cannot fault them for that because as you may recall in the spring and early summer it was literally illegal in many states for pack gatherings. No one wanted anything other then outdoor opportunities for youth. But BSA is not about to order packs to meet in defiance of health orders. Second, one of the reasons why BSA and councils focused on online and zoom meetings is that there was a concerted effort to keep scouting alive in some form or fashion. Remember this happened right when most AoLs crossed over and when lots of spring camping was going to happen plus summer camps. I know in my area there were units that have simply stopped meeting for weeks in any way or shape. The online stuff was not optimal, but for lots of units it was the only scouting they were able to get exposed to because they unit leaders had checked out. So let's game out your plan. In spring 2020 BSA and local councils reach out to Cub packs with the message "It doesn't matter that your state and local health officials have prohibited gatherings, come join us for an outdoor adventure this Saturday!" Aside from defying legal health orders (and thereby violating at least 4 provisions of the Scout Law) the Pack would have subjected itself to massive legal liability if any child or adult got sick.
  4. The first rocks were thrown by the pedophiles. The second by scout leaders at every level that failed these scouts. That they are seeking legal recourse it not "throwing rocks".
  5. No. This is just appearance of counsel. Think of it as an introduction.
  6. My own believe remains there will be a "shell" of a BSA and that Eagle will still exist. My committee chair, however is in the "they are doomed" camp. had a meeting with myself and the SM and insisted that the Star/Life we have are going to get pushed through before December 31, 2020 and that after that all bets are off.
  7. Yes, they'll get insurance. At astronomical premiums. And for all the calls for "local scouting", that's fine. But you'll still have to insure or bond. Heck I can remember being on my local Babe Ruth Baseball board and the single biggest expense each year was paying the insurance/bond fee. If you plan to have any kind of youth organization, you will absolutely have to have either insurance under the chartered organization or go buy your own. And if you use the phrase "scouting" the insurance companies are going to go nuts with the premiums.
  8. Yes, and it is not "unfairly targeted" if a) you seek and get an injunction or stay of 35+ lawsuits against your organization and then b) try to play hide-the-assets in the meantime. Stay means stay: it means ALL parties halt their efforts to either grab assets (plaintiffs) or hide assets (defendants) until either a) a settlement or b) special court permission. For example, when National has had to hire people for contract work (and thereby spend assets) they got special permission from the court to do so. That's fine; if the court says you can spend or transfer certain assets during the stay then you are in the clear. What is not ok and yes does get a target on your back is when you try to use the stay or injunction like this. Middle Tennessee just bought themselves (and National if they can prove National knew about it) a world of hurt.
  9. This is not a question of poorly run (although some are). It is a question of diminished membership and liability. On membership,see what happened when the LDS units left; Utah merged several of its Councils into one. On the liability: some very well run Councils are not going to be able to easily handle the amount of money they will have to put in for any settlement. For larger councils, we are talking millions. Even a "well run" council may not have that much cash sitting in reserve, so it's off to sell camps and other things. So no, we won't have a situation where parts of the country are without a council. We will have mega-sized councils.
  10. Yes, in the sense that the incorporated entity chartered by Congress in 1916 as codified as Title 36 US Code Chapter 309 will not be dissolved and that Congress will not repeal the charter. No, in the sense of anything as we've know National. It will be a hollow shell. Maybe a few dozen employees. Your councils will be responsible for everything and the bankruptcy will result in the number of councils collapsing from ~250 to something in the 150 range.
  11. Ok, so then there are councils doing this since at least 2012 https://www.delmarvacouncil.org/document/introduction-to-outdoor-leader-skills-test-out-application-form/119292 http://www.baltimorebsa.org/document/introduction-to-outdoor-leader-skills-test-out-application-form/119292
  12. There's still a not 0% chance that it does get forcibly dissolved. I still don't think it will happen, but if local councils keep playing shell games with property the odds increase.
  13. The NRA is a 501(c)(4) (“social welfare organization”), not a (c)(3). It's official stated purpose as a 501(c)(4) under its IRS 990 filings is "Firearms safety, education, and training and advocacy on behalf of safe and responsible gun owners" That means they can spend up to 49% of their money on lobbying, advocacy and outright political support.
  14. Yeah, hey folks the time to have played shell games with the real and tangible assets of your councils was like 2 years go. Doing it now is nothing but a giant red flag "seize our assets"
  15. That is because many of those cases are class-action and the claimants have until a set time (BSA = November) in order to get their claims in or they lose the ability to file in the future. And the difference between civil attorney and "ambulance chaser" seems to be "I like the plaintiff" or "I dislike the defendant." FYI: the number of civil lawsuits has collapsed in the last decade. You know what the vast, vast, VAST majority of civil litigation is? Contract cases (and in particular debt collection and landlord/tenant). Not torts.
  16. First, then you didn't look. There are literally dozens of state and federal lawsuits pending. Second, do you consider all civil attorneys "ambulance chasers"?
  17. First, the accusation of fiscal mismanagement predate the current AG. Recall the Ollie North debacle and what happened with NRA-TV. No different that Teddy Roosevelt campaigning against trusts and then once elected proceeding to use the Sherman Antitrust Act to hit them over the head and bust them up. Second, it is not any old "private organization"; it is registered as a 501(c)(3) not for profit. It must spend its money accordingly. Third, the end result would be that all donors get their money back and the officers of the NRA who misappropriated themselves funds would be forced to disgorge. I fail to see the problem with that. Those donors want to fund some successor organization to the NRA or fund something like Gun Owners of America, they get to. Finally, the point for Scouting (remember Scouting?) is that it is going to mean adjusting several items regarding merit badges, shooting events, and other related items in the Scouting program. Not sure how that will shake out.
  18. What people I've known for years who are NRA members, there's a general agreement LaPierre and his ilk were in fact misusing funds. The AG"s ideology does not change that. And of course there's precedent: the NY AG's office was able to force Trump to admit to misuse of charitable funds and forced that "charity" to shut down.
  19. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/06/us/new-york-attorney-general-sues-nra.html In short: top NRA leaders were stealing money and/or misdirecting it from the not-for-profit hand over fist and the NY AG is going to try and get the NRA dissolved (exactly what happened with the Trump Charity). Why does this matter for scouting? I can think of easily 6 different standards or practices that are built into merit badges or safety protocols for Scouts, BSA and Venturing; there are probably others.
  20. Where's the Cubmaster would be my first question?
  21. So, I decided to take a look at this. We don't have National's IRS 990 forms for 2019 year; they have until May 15, but almost every group I've ever known always files for the automatic 6-month extension, so I don't think anything of it. We do have for 2018, which were filed in October 2019 (again, 6 month automatic extension). IRS Form 990 (Tax Year 2018) Part VII Compensation of Officers, Directors, Trustees, Key Employees, Highest Compensated Employees, and Independent Contractors (A) Name and Title (D) Reportable compensation from the organization (W-2/1099-MISC). (F) Estimated amount of other compensation from the organization and related organizations (D) + (F) TOP 16 EXECUTIVES TOTAL 5,766,148 3,466,893 9,233,041 Michael B Surbaugh Chief Scout Executive and President 793,824 206,878 1,000,702 Michael A Ashline Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer 445,111 141,575 586,686 P McGowan General Counsel and Secretary 394,368 118,673 513,041 John Green Group Director - Outdoor Adventures 471,671 646,612 1,118,283 Mark Logemann ACSE, National Dir Support Services 313,249 295,226 608,475 Al Lambert ACSE, Dir Outdoor Adventures 349,433 232,038 581,471 Patrick Sterrett ACSE, Nall Dir Field Service 387,012 177,445 564,457 Brad Farmer ACSE, Development 349,140 175,450 524,590 Todd McGregor Group Director - Summit 231,916 200,703 432,619 Mark Winkelman Group Director - Supply 280,342 145,828 426,170 Vijay Challa Group Director - Chief Information Officer 257,406 56,698 314,104 Ron Oats Regional Director 372,417 211,699 584,116 Frederick Wallace Regional Director 298,993 283,028 582,021 Lisa Young Group Director - Human Resources 264,054 225,244 489,298 John Mosby Regional Director 292,314 193,521 485,835 Steve Medlicott Group Director - Marketing 264,898 156,275 421,173
  22. A follow-up to this: CVC was issued a transitional charter and given days to merge or die. Instead, they rebuilt and become the first council in recent memory (possibly ever) to come from from a Transitional Charter. COLONIAL VIRGINIA COUNCIL: RESILIENCE & PERSEVERANCE During the 2019 Boy Scouts of America National Annual Meeting in front of 3000 Volunteers and Professionals, the BSA Chief Scout Executive, Michael Surbaugh, recognized Colonial Virginia Council for its commitment to providing a great Scouting program and for being the only council to go from being on a Transitional Charter back to a Traditional Charter
  23. 1) The "experience and maturity" slam? A scout is courteous. 2) I have no problem with letting scouts run their program within their handbooks. The problem here is that you believe there was and/or is a uniform mandate or requirement in those handbooks. As I demonstrated, that is simply not true. Wasn't true in 1967 ("It is not absolutely necessary to wear a uniform to prove yourself a Scout.") Not true in today's 14th edition. Poverty is never to be a preventative to Scouting. Neither was the uniform.
  24. 1) It is not a "loophole". It has never been a "loophole" (see below). 2) The current Handbook does NOT a) have the kind of uniform mandate you think it does and b) it does not authorize shaming a scout for their poverty or demand they prove hardship. I've got the 14th edition in my hand. No where does it have the mandate you are claiming here. In particular Page 20-21 ("Your Scout Uniform") has no reference whatsoever to the kind of hard, fast, mandate you are describing. 3) Oh, right, that's because the modern scouts have "loopholes." Ok then, let's go back to the "good old days". I have a copy of the 1967 Handbook. Page 56. Scout Uniform. So, even back in the "good old days" there was never, ever a mandate in the Handbook. Does it make you a better scout to be in uniform? Yes, and the uniform remains one of the official 8 Methods of Scouting. But I will never compromise on the notion that poverty should be punished or that there is some hard, fast, uncompromising rule about uniforms in any of the Handbooks. Never was, currently isn't.
  • Create New...