This is How We Will Grow Scouting

[Stosh 3452]

I guess if one were to get right down to the nitty gritty of the situation, I think it was already stated that the animosity isn't towards professional scouters, but more towards the decisions that they are making and the direction those decisions are taking the program.  As far as the people themselves, they range from the incompetent jerks to the really nice people both personally and professionally.  That can be said about any demographic grouping anywhere in the world.

[Krampus 696]

I think the animosity toward professional scouters and national is directly proportional to their disdain for volunteer leaders. A generalization, but I think it works.

[Sentinel947 1205]

I am shocked, shocked, at the animosity toward professional scouters.

 

I am too. I've had largely positive interactions with the professional folks in my Council and District. A few exceptions here and there, but by and large they've treated us well. I think I speak for alot of members here when I say that I'm frustrated with National. Whether they are shooting themselves in the foot with PR debacles, putting out confusing training syllabuses, or pushing fringe programs and neglecting their bread and butter, those of us on the front lines of the movement look at these decisions and wonder if those resources could be better spent supporting us in more visible and concrete ways. What does my $24 a year pay for anyways? Heck, I'm not even paying to spend time with my son, since I don't have any kids, I'm paying to volunteer with other people's kids!

 

Sentinel947

[David CO 1783]

My apologies, Sentinal947.  I was being sarcastic.

 

 "I am shocked, shocked, ..."  is a classic line from the movie, Casablanca.

[Krampus 696]

My apologies, Sentinal947.  I was being sarcastic.

 

 "I am shocked, shocked, ..."  is a classic line from the movie, Casablanca.

 

[Stosh 3452]

I was thinking a twinge of sarcasm, but wasn't sure....  I just put on my "be polite" hat just in case it wasn't.  

 

I do think we need to remember that the harshness towards BSA is more toward the policies and practices of where the program is going than the twits sitting at the desks.

[David CO 1783]

It is a bit strange that BSA asks adults to pay for the privilege of donating our time.  Even stranger is the fact that we do it.  We really are a bunch of saps, aren't we?

 

Youth sports programs don't charge registration fees or training costs to volunteer coaches. 

[blw2 433]

It is a bit strange that BSA asks adults to pay for the privilege of donating our time.  Even stranger is the fact that we do it.  We really are a bunch of saps, aren't we?

 

Youth sports programs don't charge registration fees or training costs to volunteer coaches. 

a practice my pack started before my time.... adults don't pay registration or training....

but I find that when anyone pays for training, or the CO required fingerprinting, etc.... that they usually just "donate" the cost by not submitting the expense.

so my registrations have always been paid by the unit.

I think this is good practice unless the unit is financially struggling.

[Krampus 696]

It is a bit strange that BSA asks adults to pay for the privilege of donating our time.  Even stranger is the fact that we do it.  We really are a bunch of saps, aren't we?

 

Youth sports programs don't charge registration fees or training costs to volunteer coaches. 

 

Au contraire.

 

In youth soccer some leagues require you to hold a USSF license. Depending on where you are and what license level you need, you may pay between $20-$500 dollars. They don't give you any gear so you may need to buy cones, nets, extra balls, other training aids, etc. Some leagues require you to pay for your own background check.

 

I spend more of my own money and time in BSA, but I spent a fair amount coaching my kids' soccer teams.

[David CO 1783]

No kidding?  Soccer teams charge the coaches?  I didn't know that.

 

When I was an athletic director for my Catholic school, we gave our volunteer parent coaches a couple hundred bucks.  It wasn't much.  It certainly didn't pay for their time.  It barely covered their travel expenses, but I think the gesture was appreciated.

Edited October 13, 2015 by David CO

[Stosh 3452]

Au contraire.

 

In youth soccer some leagues require you to hold a USSF license. Depending on where you are and what license level you need, you may pay between $20-$500 dollars. They don't give you any gear so you may need to buy cones, nets, extra balls, other training aids, etc. Some leagues require you to pay for your own background check.

 

I spend more of my own money and time in BSA, but I spent a fair amount coaching my kids' soccer teams.

 

 

No kidding?  Soccer teams charge the coaches?  I didn't know that.

 

When I was an athletic director for my Catholic school, we gave our volunteer parent coaches a couple hundred bucks.  It wasn't much.  It certainly didn't pay for their time.  It barely covered their travel expenses, but I think the gesture was appreciated.

 

Clearly in this case it's an issue of hiring the who's in the neighborhood hanging around @@Krampus and who's the professionals @@David CO.  

[Krampus 696]

No kidding?  Soccer teams charge the coaches?  I didn't know that.

 

When I was an athletic director for my Catholic school, we gave our volunteer parent coaches a couple hundred bucks.  It wasn't much.  It certainly didn't pay for their time.  It barely covered their travel expenses, but I think the gesture was appreciated.

 

Yeah, and some times big money too.

 

Catholic or Baptist churches down here usually have their own gear, fields, etc., but they still need to compete in the league. Most churches will pay coaching fees. Those folks aligned with community-based teams have to pay themselves.

 

But you point is still well taken, Scouting costs greatly out weigh what most pay for soccer. At least in my case.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

As a former professional,  I can sympathize greatly with local pros. It is a tough, demanding job. I've seen too many pros sacrifice their families and health. I've had friends and coworkers have mental breakdowns and other stress related health issues because of the job.  I have had friends get divorced because of the time away from their families. I was fortunate in that my wife of 2 months gave me an ultimatum. Several of my friends had wives either walk out on them, or kick them out. Worse one was my friend who put his wife through law school, then was served divorce papers by her after her graduation ceremony!

 

The disdain and animosity towards professionals, at least for me, comes down to two things. First and foremost are those that lose the vision of Scouting, and it becomes a job for them. They do whatever it takes, including some questionable stuff to put it mildly, in order to meet their Far Exceeds goals, or be #1 in their division. I'd rather have a solid, attractive program every year, than a great recruiting or FOS year, but have a lousy program and lose donors and members after the stellar year.

 

The other problem pros IMHO are the ones who were either not involved in Scouting prior to being a professional, or have moved so far away from the boots on the ground, that they no longer know what it is like at the unit service level. One boss I had was never in Boy Scouts or Exploring. Had no idea what it was like, and how camp operations were like. Zero experience whatsoever. I was hired because I had 4 seasons of summer camp staffing at 4 different camps. Freaked out when she read my proposed SOP manual for camp operations. Questioned every single point in it, and  would not listen to anything I would say. And didn't even stay at camp to see how things were done once we started, she just assumed. Only when she worked Jambo did she realize how she screwed up stuff.

 

And when volunteers see stuff like Department of Labor laws for businesses being applied to Scouting, you do question the sanity of those in Irving. Heck my Bears, when the DOL rules were incorporated into the G2SS, thought I was joking when I said they couldn't use their little red wagons for a service project.  And off course there is going to be push back when the folks in Irving, farm removed from the unit level apparently, try to mandate having trained leaders redo basic training every time the course changes. It took me 18 months to get trained, and that was only with me involved with a troop and going to college. Nowadays I have 3 district level PORs, serve as an ASM with a troop, serve as  pack MC, plus have a job and family. Yet training I had and have applied all these years is no longer valid because the name changed?

 

To quote one long term volunteer on this topic, "I've forgotten more about Scouting than you've ever learned, and I still know more than you do!"  And the volunteer did!

 

For a more humorous digression

 

http://www.buzzfeed.com/bsastaffer/truths-about-being-a-professional-scouter-j3wp

[Sentinel947 1205]

Thanks for giving me a little more culture in my life. 

[desertrat77 1144]

Well, I'm glum on camporees, but it's not because I don't like camping, it's because I've had to hear the boys in the troop next door whispering and talking until 3 am.  That, and I hate camporees. 

Point taken.  Please remove "camporee" from my original sentence and substitute "outdoors" or "at a campsite" or "visiting any wilderness area."  

 

Also, when I was moving around the country quite a bit, I got to see first hand how people have come to hate camporees.   Some districts and councils have turned them into truly awful events.   However, there are still places that put on camporees that are enjoyable/old school/good outdoor experiences.

Edited October 13, 2015 by desertrat77