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I love it when you talk flowery OGE! Gets me all sweaty!


Merlyn is constantly calling the BSA dishonest regarding charters when he knows full well there is culpability on both sides. He even admitted that in one thread yet he refuses to state such.


More flowery talk, please!

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MLR: BSA is a discriminatory organization because it encourages Scouts (and Scouters) to espouse a religion, ie., a belief in a "higher power".

Ev etal: The BSA not only encourages such, but asks members to agree to a statement that makes that belief "public". If the person cannot agree to this statement, then they either will cease membership voluntarily or be asked to leave. This is in agreement with the first point of the Scout Law that all BSAers are asked to abide by (hypocrites not welcome, either. Used to be a mention of that in the Scout Law explanation. Another time...))

MLR: Any USA governmental entity (school, police, water district, rec department, etc.) can not "discriminate" or exclude anyone on basis of age, gender, sexual orientation, skin tone, ethnic origin, religious belief, or political persuasion. Therefore, if a governmental entity denies entrance or participation to anyone on that basis, it is against the law.

Ev et al: So?

MLR: So if a School seeks to sponsor a Scout unit, and the Scout unit denies membership to someone who displays a particular form of something on the above list, the School, by virtue of being the "owner" of the unit, is responsible for the actions of it's unit and therefore is doing something illegal.

Ev et al: But the BSA is a private organisation, and can define it's membership as it wishes.

MLR: Agreed, but the "Charter" organization ALSO defines who can join. Some Churches require that only folks of a certain faith can belong to "their" Scout units, yes? If the CO is required BY LAW to NOT deny admission or participation, then their Scout unit MUST admit any breathing human boy that wants to join. Otherwise, the School should not even seek to sponsor a Scout unit, the local DE should not seek to get a School to charter the Scout unit, and the BSA should not allow entities with governmental duties to sponsor a Scout unit...

Ev et al: You mean...

MLR: Yep, only private organizations should/can legally/ought to sponsor Scout Units.

Ev etal: Churches? Temples? PTOs? Volunteer Fire Companies? Hardware stores? Civic Clubs? Saloons?

MLR: I'd agree to all of them.

Ev etal: Not Public Schools?

MLR: Nope. Uh uh.

Ev etal: Private school?

MLR: No complaint, except...

Ev etal: What now?

MLR: I think that BSA is so much a public entity that it ought to admit everyone, regardless of religious persuasion.

Ev etal: You mean God or god or nogod...

MLR: Exactly.

Ev etal: Thank you.

MLR: Thank you.

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Not bad SSS, Not bad at all. But I see a slight difference:


Merl: Hey, why are you dressed like that?


Boy Scout: Because I'm going to my Boy Scout club.


Merl: What kind of club is that?


Boy Scout: It's an outdoorsy,activity based adventurous club for people who believe in God or some other form of religion.


Merl: That sounds great! I'd love to join, but I don't believe any kind of god exists.


Boy Scout: Well, that's a shame because I think you'd like our club. But believing in some sort of god or having religion is a requirememnt. But there are other clubs that do similar things without having to believe in God or religion...you could always join them.

Heck, you could start up your own. I bet alot of people might join~!


Merl: Nah, I don't want to find another club or start up my own...I just want to stop yours from meeting! I don't like it. It doesn't fit my beliefs , so it must be stopped!


Boy scout: Wouldn't it just make more sense to have your own club instead of ruining somebody elses?


Merl: I don't care about what other people think...it's all about what people like me think! I only care about myself and people who agree with me.

Your club is bad, bad , bad and should be stopped!

It discrimminates!


( Discrimination is a sociological term referring to the treatment taken toward or against a person of a certain group in consideration based solely on class or category. Discrimination is the actual behavior towards another group. It involves excluding or restricting members of one group from opportunities that are available to other groups. Source: Wikipedia )


Boy Scout: So even though my club has no problems with you or anybody else having their own similar or "like" club, we are bad. Yet you cannot stand to let anybody else have their "own" club, and you are better?


Merl: YES!


Boy Scout: That doesn't make sense. That's discrimination against us!


Merl: Not how we see it.. If WE don't like you, it's not discrimminaton! It's only dicrimination if you don't allow us to join!


Boy Scout. But that's not legal according to the 1st Amendmant !


Merl: That's the law because that's how "WE" see it!


Boy Scout: The laws also say I can have my club too.


Merl: But that's not the PART of the law I'm talking about! I'm only talking about one part of the law, not the whole thing!


Boyscout: WOW! That's kinda hateful and un patriotic don't you think? Denying people their CONSTITUTIONAL rights?


Merl: Not if it goes against "MY" opinions of what "rights" is!


Boyscout: So you'd rather destroy somebody elses club that just make your own.


Merl: It's not about me having a club...It's about stopping your!(This message has been edited by scoutfish)

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Yeah, when you can't deny something.... all you have left is insults right?


Speaking of straw.......


America The Beautiful


In 1893, at the age of thirty-three Katharine Lee Bates, an English professor at Wellesley College, had taken a train trip to Colorado Springs, Colorado, to teach a short summer school session at Colorado College. Several of the sights on her trip inspired her, and they found their way into her poem, including the World's Columbian Exposition in Chicago, the "White City" with its promise of the future contained within its alabaster buildings; *the wheat fields of America's heartland* Kansas, through which her train was riding on July 4; and the majestic view of the Great Plains from high atop Zebulon's Pikes Peak.


In the first verse:


O beautiful for spacious skies,

For amber waves of grain,

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Yeah, when you can't deny something.... all you have left is insults right?


Quite the opposite -- a "straw man" is where someone simply makes up another person's opinion, and attacks that. I'm not going to deny a position someone else has made up for me.


But feel free to make more dishonest straw man attacks. I'll just point out that such attacks are dishonest.

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Quite the opposite -- a "straw man" is where someone simply makes up another person's opinion, and attacks that. I'm not going to deny a position someone else has made up for me.


Pot meet kettle!

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