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walk in the woods

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Everything posted by walk in the woods

  1. walk in the woods

    And yet more changes - even Pedro is not spared

    Q the name change has nothing to do with youth or what they want. References to anything male will have to be struck from the program in order to deconstruct the patriarchal oppression it represents.The women on the thread who noted they wouldn't be bothered to read Boy's Life just don't realize they are victims of the oppression. The Navy attempted to remove the word man from all it's rates in 2016 (e.g corpsman was deemed a sexist job title). They failed not for lack of trying but due to general outrage from the rank and file. The BSA won't face such headwinds.
  2. walk in the woods

    IOLS vs BALOO

    In general, the courses don't cross-count. BALOO is a one-day training for Cub Camping, IOLS is an overnight focused on Boy Scout skills. If you see yourself as an ASM/SM next year I'd say take the drive (within reason, say an hour or less), camp, and get both done.
  3. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    I hope you are right.
  4. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    This was exactly my experience in HS when Physical Education went co-ed. Dodgeball, gym hockey, wrestling all disappeared from the curriculum. Flag football went from a contact game to being kicked out of class if you bumped into a girl. Boys weren't allowed to block shots in basketball or hit spikes in volleyball if the person on the other side was a girl. Again, kicked out of class for the day. They added square dancing for the love of Pete!
  5. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    It's about the same era, close enough anyway. The alternatives are tough. It probably involves harshly punishing the perpetrators of bad deeds while not restricting the rights of innocent actors. It's the same philosophy as the knife discussion. Blanket policies restricting anything mostly serve to punish the innocent. Anyway, thank you for acknowledging the YPT does affect program.
  6. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Thank you. Let me provide what I hope is an equally well stated rebuttal. I don't see the addition of girls to the program as adding a layer of richness, I see it as replacing a layer of richness that already exists. A place for boys to hang with their mates around the campfire is a rich and important experience. There's plenty of literature out there that suggests today's men don't have other male friends and it's impacting their mental health. The Boy Scouts has always been a place for boys to learn how to make male friends, nay, brothers. That process will be irrevocably changed with the addition of girls to the program. Men will suffer as a result. You said that we're preparing the boys for adulthood, and since they'll have to work with women, they should work with girls now. While I think there is truth in that argument, forcing co-ed scouts at all ages is using a sledge hammer to kill a fly. I believe that boys certainly in the 11-14 year age range, and probably in the 5 - 14 year age range need to learn how to deal with the transition to manhood first. We all remember what it was like to be that age. Having mentors and leaders and peers who have been or are going through that same period in life is critical. Yes, they need to learn how to work with women, but, I think that happens after they've learned how to be young men. I have no problem with co-ed scouting at the high school age level, as an option. If I honestly believe the separate troop thing was anything other than a short transition phase to fully co-ed Troops, designed to minimize losses, I might be onboard. In a spearate thread on this forum at least one scouter was already touting their co-ed patrols. Separate or linked troops are a fantasy. You earlier referenced Scouts UK as a model. The wikipedia page references their 2016/2017 report and says "Girls now make up 27% of all-age participants with a total of 99,989 female participants aged between 6 and 25 and a further 69,460 women involved in volunteer roles (being more than 1 adult female for every 2 female young people), while new recruits are now 71% girls (approx. 2.5 girls for every boy)" Emphasis is mine. If in 10 years our movement is 27% female, and we don't lose any marketshare in boys, then we'll just have made up the delta for the departures in the last few years. More importantly (and I haven't read the entire report so I'm taking the 2.5:1 comment at face value), if the UK Scout Association is recruiting 2.5 girls for every boy that enters the program, one has to question if they are in fact serving the general population of boys. It's not clear to me that set of numbers is a win for boys. The Scout Association is seeing 8% year-over-year growth, so it is clearly winning, but maybe at the expense of boys. I too have seen girls bring fun and enthusiasm to activities in Cub Scouts. But, I've also watched adult leaders, male and female, break up boys unstructured, loud, rough, and unstructured play in order to get them to attend to some boring, quiet, and structured activity. The girls thrive in the latter, the boys in the former. I've had more than a few conversations with leaders, male and female, to the effect of you have to let boys play. Requirements are nice, but, not nearly as important as unstructured, rowdy, play. Once they've blown off that steam you can probably get them to attend to whatever classroom stuff you have to offer. Finally, you said "It hasn't been a negative in school classrooms to have boys and girls working together." I can't begin to express how strongly I disagree with this statement. Boys are loud, squirmy, and active. Nobody who has ever actually worked with boys was shocked when taking away the unstructured play of recess, and the jungle gyms and swings, caused problems in the classroom. But, instead of giving boys the room to be boys, we've chosen to medicate the ones that can't act like their female counterparts. Scouting used to be a refuge from that mentality. I fear it will become more of the same, and worse than it is today (MBUs, Citizenship MBs at summer camp, etc.).
  7. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Well, first, the program for girls hasn't started at the Troop level yet. Second, you don't get to argue there will be no program changes, then, when program changes are pointed out, also argue program changes don't matter. Pick a position.
  8. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    My last year of summer camp (between my Jr. and Sr. years of HS) my SM asked me to tent with and generally buddy with a first year camper. He was our only first year and his parents were concerned about home sickness. I was in camp to hang with my Tribal brothers so no big deal to me. For that week I was his big brother and he was my little brother. If there had been a two-year age differential tenting restriction at the time that relationship wouldn't have been a beneficial for him or me. Program goes way beyond activities, merit badges, and rank requirements.
  9. walk in the woods

    And yet more changes - even Pedro is not spared

    Keeping the word boy in the name of the organization or the magazine would be perpetuating the patriarchal hierarchy of oppression........
  10. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    that list is very long if you go back to my time in scouts, but, you asked for this to be an optimistic thread about the future of the BSA, not me defending the past.
  11. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Share your vision then. Why are you optimistic? What am i missing? Why will the new BSA be better? I just rechartered as a UC for the next year. Why should i be excited?
  12. walk in the woods

    Condom Distribution at World Jamboree

    I'm not sure I give the BSA much credit for taking the high road. In my mind the high road would have sounded something like this: "We understand there has been concern in the press and social media about the availability of condoms and alcohol at the upcoming World Scout Jamboree in West Virginia. We'd like to explain the situation and set the record straight." No need to mention TLUSA (kind of like political candidates never mentioning their opponents name), no need to state anything but the facts. And the opportunity to stand up and say, Yes, we agree with these requirements from the WOSM. That would have been refreshing and honest.
  13. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    I would encourage the folks who believe the most recent change in the BSA is a good thing to offer me their vision of the future of the BSA. I can't see it from where I sit. Change my mind!
  14. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    @gblotter, it occurs to me that my previous answer was a bit rambling and unsatisfactory. I do believe the membership losses will be greater than just the LDS and will reverberate beyond the intermountain west. The LDS church was the counter-balance to the forces fighting for change. I suspect the Church was instrumental in local option decisions that were handed down in 2013 and 2015 (even though snubbed by the BSA on the latter decision). The Church, I think allowed non-LDS scouters some hope for stability in a live and let live program. With the Church's departure, there is no longer a counter-balance to keep the BSA from barreling head long down the progressive path. The hope for that live and let live program is dead. And, I think the possibility of a new counter-balance (say the Catholic Church) arising is probably also dead. That it has been the desire of the BSA leadership to move in a progressive direction has been clear for some time, but the pace will only accelerate after December 31, 2018 and probably sooner. So, yes, I think a number of long-time, scouters, who stayed in the program through the changes for their boys, will see the LDS departure as their permission to close up shop for the next generation to take over the BSA. Maybe it will be a glorious revival for the BSA. Maybe the BSA will recruit a million girls and enough new leaders to fill every position twice. I hope that's so. But I fear the BSA that was such an important part of my youth is irrevocably changed and not to the benefit of boys.
  15. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Fear is probably the closer emotion. My scenario is 80% membership loss and FOS loss drives consolidation. Which drives cost cuts which drives service reductions. Community units get less attention. Their favorite camps get sold. Attitudes wane. The LDS subsidized scouting from AS to ID. I don't see a replacement. IDK what the critical mass is but it's not clear to me that any council easily survives even a 10 or 15% immediate membership drop. Beyond that I think conservatives in the vast red middle of the country will check out. Not immediately but in a couple years. The old guard will slowly retire which isnt a bad thing neccessarily but i have limited confidence a new guard will arise. I was SM for a rural troop. My boys found the BSA restrictions on rifle ranges, ATVs, laser tag et. al. absurd. They already did all those things with their dad or uncle or on their own or with a church youth group. How am I supposed to explain to a kid whose been farming for 4 years he can't drive a tractor at a conclave or run a log splitter because he's only 17 and untrained? I expect more of these kinds of things moving forward and decreased relevance for BSA, especially if they start down the ISP trail. The tipping poi t for boys will be way lower than for scouters.
  16. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    New uniforms, Venturers and Sea Scouts in the OA are both program changes. Changes to two deep is a program change. The military has different PT requirements for men and women so expect changes to Personal Fitness MB and Tenderfoot requirements. Family Life MB used to have a requirement to discuss with your counselor what it means to be a good father. That will change. Rumors of the OA dropping NA regalia will be a program change. New magazine name is a program change. But the program is more than rank and badge requirements and logistics. The program is made by all the intangibles of a single-gender environment and all that will end.
  17. walk in the woods

    And yet more changes - even Pedro is not spared

    Maybe but the odds of the BSA rolling back any of the recent changes is less than zero. I'll just close my wallet, focus on my unit gor now, and see what happens.
  18. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Maybe, but it takes real courage to wear one of these in public :).
  19. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    I didn't mean to imply blame on the LDS departure. I'm just thinking it will trigger a lack of critical mass in the intermountain west that will be larger than expected.
  20. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    It's still buried in a box o' memorabilia somewhere.
  21. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Eagle in 79 (started scouts in 74) but I did have camping, swimming and lifesaving MB so, you know, don't judge me too harshly :).
  22. walk in the woods

    New YPT Launch

    This afternoon I've received an email from my DC, which came from the Council Commissioner, etc. about the launch of the new YPT. This blurb was in the FAQ Attachment By October 1, 2018, all new and currently registered leaders will be required to complete the updated training. The enhanced and updated content will allow leaders and councils to comply with all current legal requirements. While this may be inconvenient for some, it reflects the BSA’s commitment to the safety of all youth. I haven't logged in yet to see if it's available.
  23. walk in the woods

    Putting the pieces together - Where are we headed?

    Agreed. I didn't word that section very well.
  24. walk in the woods

    2017 Annual Report

    Interesting, 10-year treasuries had a 2% yield in March 2012, just over 3% today. Even if we can refinance those bonds the principal/interest payments bump up fairly dramatically.
  25. walk in the woods

    Condom Distribution at World Jamboree

    I think this is it, https://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-7th-circuit/1176886.html
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