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Posts posted by Eagle1993

  1. BSA just settled 19 suits in Idaho (LDS Troops).  Not sure if the Church settled as well.


    I found this comment to be interesting.... 

    “From what we understand the only way these [four new] settlements will work is if the Boy Scouts do not file for bankruptcy for at least 90 days,” Dumas said. “If they file within 90 days, these settlements may be at risk. We really do not know what will happen.”

  2. I can’t find any official statement, but based upon FB chatter from adults who had daughters in BSA photo shoots for the new handbook

    - the new female cut uniforms will be available in Scoutshops by Feb 1

    - there is virtually no change from the current uniform other than fit

    It sounds like they dumped the idea of a major uniform change that was floated earlier.  Again, not official but they did share some pictures that seemed to validate their story.


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  3. 40 minutes ago, ParkMan said:

    Out of some fairness to the BSA here.  This seems to be a generic problem facing any youth serving organization.  How do you make sure that your adult volunteers do not abuse youth?

    The BSA's error was that they had a list of known offenders yet were loose enough in vetting the new volunteers that they didn't catch the problems.

    Catholic Church, USA swimming, USA Gymnastics, US Soccer all have had issues.   Any group that deals with youth better have strong YPT training and background checks or face lawsuits.   

    This is not BSA unique.  For example, see this law that went into effect this year   


  4. 1 hour ago, Eaglein87 said:

    Not all CO's just the ones where the alleged SA took place. I would think that a prosecutor would go after National, and all those involved which would include Chartering Org especially if it was a church (deep pockets). When it happens (because it will) will not bode well for CO sponsorship of BSA Troops. Already hearing grumblings from CO's on this issue. Church members are wary of possible litigation that may Trickle down. We have a major problem folks.

    Yes, I have seen COs (only when churches) named as many times the individual, church, council and national are all being sued at once.  



    I’m sure more are coming 



  5. Stepping aside from the debate regarding the point of religion, I don’t see much upside for the BSA if the drop the faith requirement.  It is already extremely weak tea.  There is not a large new member group out there that would join (such as when they added girls) and I haven’t heard widespread loss of corporate sponsors or COs like I saw with excluding gays.   All that would happen is further controversy and loss of experienced members.  

    In my pack, which is essential tied to a public school, we tell parents to handle the duty to God requirements and let us know when they are complete.  Yes, I’m sure that there are a few kids and adults that are excluded and more that are uncomfortable with the religious aspects, but BSA needs some stability now and I don’t see this as something they should stir up anytime soon.  I don’t lose kids to g,g,g.... I lose kids due to band, soccer, hockey, friends and fortnite.

  6. 47 minutes ago, PACAN said:

    Wow...amazing how fast the councils are trying to separate themselves from National.  All the notices are almost identical as if "someone" had prepared a boilerplate for each council.  We hope National can get out of their mess but it's not our problem.

    I’m sure they are thinking FOS impact... and I don’t blame them.  People will not want to give to FOS if they think the money will simply to to Nationals and be part of a bankruptcy fund.  I was already asked by multiple parents if they should stop buying popcorn or contribute to FOS until after the bankruptcy....  Councils need to get their message out quickly or they will see major losses in donations.

  7. 7 minutes ago, Sentinel947 said:

    I think it'd be hard to sell too. It's in the middle of nowhere. People only come their because it's Philmont. People only work there for low pay because it's Philmont. Remove the property from being a BSA property, and it loses much of it's value. 

    The only thing it would be sold for is resource extraction, and that'd be a darn shame. 

    I hope Philmont would be safe given your comments.  But what about Sea Base?  I was really hoping to go there with my son in a few years.... but I could imagine that is prime real estate.  Hope that they can hold onto it.  

  8. It’s not the end of a National office if BSA does proceed with bankruptcy.  I think BSA could protect anything that generates net income and is critical to their continued existence... which I think would include the  HA camps they own; however, I’m not 100% sure on that and I’m concerned that a judge would decide if they have to sell Philmont.

    I’m also concerned for the employees.  It seems like typically the highest level employees (and highest paid) are rarely impacted as much as lower level (and in my view more critical) ones.  Pensions, benefits and salaries could be at risk... I hope any impact would be minimal.  

    My understanding is that this would force all lawsuits to stall and into settlement talks.  I would expect BSA would setup a victims fund similar to the Catholic Church.   I hope that fund is large enough to cause significant pain to BSA so they ensure our organization never Harbors those creeps again.  

    I believe this will also halt the damages aspect of the GSUSA lawsuit.   Perhaps that will force the two organizations to figure out how BSA can add girls without causing massive confusion with GSUSA.  

    Finally, I hope this would then be a new beginning.  BSA could look at using this to stop (or at least minimize) making decisions based solely on insurance actuaries and income.   They can put the threat of massive litigation and bad contracts behind them and hopefully restructure.... ensuring more funds remain local and keeping overhead down.  

    One can hope....

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  9. Assets at risk...

    1- Summit appears On National’s balance sheet as a major land asset at over $370M.  Other high Adventure bases (not specially listed) show up as $60M.

    2 - $800M of various financial assets 

    3 - $258M endowment


    Financial Condition-from annual report
    The National Council’s financial condition for 2018 and the next few years will depend, in large part, upon three factors. The first is the outcome of the litigation discussed within this report (see Note 9) and the impact to GLIP (Note 7). The second lies with the success of securing donations for the Summit project in order to continue to pay bond payments as scheduled and maintaining compliance with debt covenants. The third factor is the economy and legislation and their effect on market conditions and liquidity requirements. 

    Note 7 

    This is about their General insurance program.... 

    Note 9

    There continues to be additional lawsuits filed alleging sexual abuse, including claims for punitive damages. The National Council could be required to pay damages out of its own funds to the extent the claims are not covered by insurance or if the insurance carriers are unable or unwilling to honor the claims. Based upon the nature of and management’s understanding of the facts and circumstances that give rise to such actions and claims, management believes the reserves established by the General Liability Insurance Program of the National Council are sufficient to provide for the resolution of these lawsuits. However, in the event the General Liability Insurance Program or its reserves are insufficient to resolve such claims, it is the opinion of the National Council that the total amount of payments to resolve current and future claims could have a significant impact on the financial position or results of operations of the National Council in the future.

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    I am writing to you today in anticipation of news reports that will speculate about the BSA’s financial position. We have an important duty, and an incredible opportunity, to focus as an organization on keeping children safe, supported and protected, and preparing youth for their futures through our nation’s foremost program of character development and values-based leadership training. 

    To do so in perpetuity, we are working with experts to explore all options available to ensure that the local and national programming of the Boy Scout of America continues uninterrupted. We have a social and moral responsibility to fairly compensate victims who suffered abuse during their time in Scouting, and we also have an obligation to carry out our mission to serve youth, families and local communities through our programs.

    We care deeply about all victims of child sex abuse and we are steadfast in our belief that one incident of child abuse is one too many. We sincerely apologize to anyone who was harmed during their time in our programs. As you all know, we have always taken care of victims – we believe them, we believe in fairly compensating them and we have paid for unlimited counseling, by a provider of their choice, regardless of the amount of time that has passed since an instance of abuse. Throughout our history we have taken proactive steps to help victims heal and prevent future abuse. I want to stress that at no time in our history have we knowingly allowed a sexual predator to work with youth, and we always seek to act swiftly when alerted to abuse allegations. 

    Please know that these matters continue to have the full attention of the highest levels of our organization, and we will communicate transparently as there are developments or updates to share. I wanted to update you today due to the news speculation, and I want to assure you that our daily mission will continue and that there are no imminent actions or immediate decisions expected. 

    Thank you for your continued support of the Boy Scouts of America.
    Michael B. Surbaugh
    Chief Scout Executive
    Prepared. For Life.
    Image Image Image Image
    Boy Scouts of America
    1325 West Walnut Hill Lane Irving, TX 75038
    Copyright © 2018 Boy Scouts of America. All rights reserved.


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  11. There wasn’t much beyond the first paragraph.  This is one key

    “Filing for bankruptcy would put the brakes on the litigation and give the nonprofit the chance to negotiate with victims who have sued.”

    I think the GSUSA damages (if any) could be lumped in.  

    However, bankruptcy could lead to some ugly outcomes.   

  12. As a Cub Scout Leader who is going through recharter, I can tell you we are losing scouts to sports and busy parents.  I have had 0 parents tell me that girls, gays or god made a difference with their membership.  What I have been told has been 2 major reasons for not joining or dropping....

    - both parents work schedules are too much to support their child in scouts... if they could simply drop them off at meetings and outings... that could work.  They don’t have time to help their son with PWD, etc.... already too busy.

    - Sports....they see sports, especially for boys, as the best way to grow their son.   

    For those inside the program, we know the unique benefits and experience scouts provides.  I don’t see the general parent population seeing it outside of the Eagle Scout.  My guess is that if they de-emphasized Eagle, you would see even faster attrition... it is the one topic I consistently have parents from outside scouting ask me about when considering joining.  


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  13. 1 hour ago, Treflienne said:

    I don't quite get it.   A Juliette is Girl Scout who is not a member of a troop -- what you might call a lone scout.   But what is the connection between the name Romeo and being a boy scout?

    So much discussion about the names got me thinking about the famous Romeo and Juliet line that fits this discussion .... “What's in a name? That which we call a rose
    By any other name would smell as sweet."  

    That got me thinking that someone could rewrite Romeo and Juliet to be a tragic story of two lovers... one from the house of BSA and the other GSUSA.   I then switched Juliet to Juliette given the GSUSA reference.

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  14. 3 hours ago, an_old_DC said:

    Well it hasn't happened yet.

    I was at a Council event last night and said something about "Boy Scouts" and somebody snottily said "You mean Scouts BSA." So I replied "No, I mean Boy Scouts. On February 1, this will be Scouts BSA, but right now this is still Boy Scouts."

    They weren't happy about it but admitted it is premature to call the program Scouts BSA.

    Usually it is about cub scouts crossing over this spring... so in that case the parents are right (correcting me when I say Boy Scouts).  That said, I have also had the snarky response from a few like you mention. 

  15. I was wondering where they would define what to call members of Scouts BSA... thanks for the link.  I’ve only remembered seeing  references to the program name.   I expect if 5-10 years, perhaps 50 based upon our UK friends’ experience, scouts will clearly mean Scouts BSA and Girl Scouts will be GSUSA.      That is unless GSUSA changes to Girl Guides.  So, if a girl is in Scouts BSA she would say... I’m a scout.  If she is in Girl Scouts she would state I’m a Girl Scout.  Boys will probably either call themselves scouts or Boy Scouts.... either should work.  

    Just had a thought.... I see a new take on Romeo and Juliette (see what I did there). Romeo is an Eagle Scout and Juliette is a Gold Scout.... you know the rest...”what’s in a name.”

    I’m surprised how quickly my area is already switching over to saying Scouts BSA.   I hear it from parents (those with kids in BSA) who correct me when I say Boy Scouts.  

  16. 27 minutes ago, dkurtenbach said:

    OMG, I would hope not - but thanks for checking.  😌  Girl Scouts ARE real Scouts.  Cub Scouts, Boy Scouts, Venturers, Sea Scouts, and STEM Scouts ARE real Scouts.  BSA wanting us to say, "We are Scouts, they are Girl Scouts" just sounds . . . problematic. 

    They want us to say “Scouts BSA”.  Where do you see BSA staying “We are Scouts....”? 

  17. More info just announced...  Not sure how you get added yet.

    In anticipation of the Scouts BSA launch on February 1, 2019, families are already looking for units forming in their area. To help youth join scouts, the BSA has added new functionality that allows councils to display “Coming Soon” units in BeAScout.org.



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  18. 2 hours ago, WAKWIB said:

    Since all this really isn't supposed to go "live" before Feb. 2019, your Council may be hesitant in giving concrete answers to anything.  In theory, the chartering of girls troops is two months away.  On Feb. 1st,  I suspect your Council and all the rest will be fired up and ready to process applications.

    Actual this partially true. Chartering of new Girl Troops is underway.  If girls are to join Feb 1 you need to have a lot of work complete by then.  See attached for an example of a plan.  Note the contact names will be different for your council. I’m sharing this from a private FB account that is supported semi-officially by Nationals.  I recommend searching Facebook for “BSA. Family Packs/Girl Troops” and request to join.  There is a lot of info there.  

    Note:  This isn’t official and just one example from a leader. 

    Scout BSA New Troop Kit.pdf

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