HashTagScouts

Largely agree with your thoughts. MB universities/colleges/fairs can be structured so that the selection process/choice/approval still happens. Similar to summer camp, if you know the schedule of what is being offered, that is shared to the scouts, and those desiring to attend can make selections from the list of what is available and discuss with their SM what they have selected. If SM deems appropriate, blue card issued, scout goes off to the MBU to work with the counselor. Some may feel that the BSA is implying that MBs are supposed to be one-on-one, scout to MBC- but it does not explicitly state that. We would never be able to offer MBs at summer camp if that were the case. Group instruction is a part of the lives of the youth. In any given school year, they are learning much, much more information in any given subject than that which is learned from any MB, and they do it with group instruction. Are limits on the size of the group important? YES! However, I would hope that is up to the MBC on the appropriate size. As an MBC for Citizenship in the World, an ideal size for me is no more than 5 scouts. I want the requirements to be dynamic discussion, not just "you listened to me, now repeat back what I said", and a group larger than 5 for me makes those discussions too lengthy that I feel many scouts tune out what their fellow scouts are saying by the time it gets to the 6th kid/7th kid, etc. I am also an MBC for Art MB, and I have no problem with that being a group of 20- most art classes in elementary/middle school/high school/college are larger than that. Are there MBUs being run as "show up, you get the badge"? I'm sure there are. Improving quality would be what I would focus on, rather than just trying to eliminate them completely. Offering MBs at unit level is important as well, but I wouldn't want to confine a kid to only what the unit/council can offer. If your unit doesn't have a chemistry MBC, and the nearest one within the council is 65 miles away, likelihood that Billy/Sally Scout is going to realistically be able to work on that MB is small to non-existent. However, if the council is going to have a MB fair at a site that is 10 miles from Billy/Sally Scout's hometown on a given day, and that MBC is going to be there, I'm all in on it! Billy/Sally Scout may already know that chemistry is their passion, and they may go on to be the person who finds the cure for a disease later in their life, and that opportunity as a Scout to work on a MB was the catalyst.

That's a new one on me. What exactly is their logic? You are selling a ticket to a product/service, similar to how units are selling popcorn. If what they were concerned with is having a fundraisers selling chances on a 50/50 raffle, yes, I would say no field uniforms for that, as it is gambling and the unit shouldn't really be doing it.

Perhaps they can be a “bridge” of sorts. Not that they have to only work with other girls, but their DLs might find it advantageous to have the few girls from the two packs have some weekend events held jointly for just the girls to have their own time together. A few troops in my area are doing a mini camp ore of sorts this spring to let the girls learn from each other, share ideas on growth, lessons learned, etc.

Sorry that this has to be such a major issue, but applaud you are thinking of what is best for your kids rather than just taking the easiest road of what is shortest commute for you. I empathize with that. Think beyond the next year though, what would be the landscape for your daughter once she is moving to the next level? Would it be likely she would be in a troop with this 1 girl that is in the pack near you (and would that be a troop that is near you)?

Too much change can really take those changes a long time to fully execute. My advice is start small- have it for Scout rank to start off with as you plan, then maybe have it be "former SPL/ASPL" can sign-off up to 1st Class for the next year after that, and within just a few years you should have a handful of "older" scouts modeling to the others how it should be done, where you could either let it be any Star/Life/Eagle, or just keep it that way.

I can appreciate your view. NSPs can go in a bad direction, in a very short amount of time. We're maybe a little non-traditional in how we view the role of TG. To us, it is a short-term, temporary position. Generally, we encourage the SPL to pick the scout the they see as their potential successor, and that scout may wear two hats for those few months if they are currently scribe or QM, if they are ASPL they may step down their duties as ASPL a bit. Crossover for us is early March, and summer camp is the first week of July, elections are just before camp, with the new SPL/PLC taking over after camp is over. At summer camp, its our expectation that all the "veteran" scouts will be looking out for the NSP kids. We typically will have had 3 campouts with the new kids before summer camp, and I like to see the TG sort of step back a bit during the 3rd campout and let them see if they can find their way. Then encourage the TG to regroup with them to ask them how they think such and such activity went, how could it have gone better, etc. Usually their first meal without a hands on instructor is a disaster, but once the have had the time to cool down and regroup with the TG, they begin to really storm and find their way toward a norm (or at least recognize how much more they need to learn to get to the norm). Our troop had an adult implosion a few years ago that nearly killed the troop. And they were adult run then, so it took a solid year and a half to regroup.

1000% agree. I have barked at several leaders that object to youth signing for youth. It's a requirement to reach Life you have to teach skills- why would you ever want a kid learning how to do that, only to do it once??? Seems insane to me. We keep the crossovers in a NSP until summer camp, then integrate them at the stat of the next school year (that's based on we only have had 3-5 crossover the past few years- if we get back to having 6+, we'd probably leave them as a patrol).

Perhaps a bigger question- who in your troop signs on requirements? For us, we want any scout that is Star/Life/Eagle signing off on anything up to First Class requirements. Adults are a last resort for most requirements.

Pretty much by the time they have completed their second campout. Does the patrol have a Troop Guide assigned to them? We would usually have the TG take the new patrol aside after opening for the first 2-3 meetings apart from what the rest of the troop is doing, and go over all the book-work stuff (requirement 1-3, though some will need to spend some time at home memorizing if they aren't quite as sharp as needed on Outdoor Code, etc.). Totin Chip is at first campout, knots (as many as possible, including bowline and sheet bend) on the 2nd. The hope is by that second campout, they will be at Scout and have started on requirements for Tenderfoot and 2nd Class, and by the time summer camp is over they will be at (or darn close) to completing Tenderfoot and be on good ground to focus on 2nd Class during the fall.

So, here in Eastern MA, November temps can range quite a bit. One weekend it could be 60 during the day, 40 at night. The next weekend could be 40 during the day, 20 at night. Weekend after could 50 during the day - you get the point. I do know of units that cabin camp only in November. Not at all what I would do. December/January/February are pretty assured of having temps that are below freezing at night, so I can appreciate having cabin camping in the winter. I know at least one unit that has gone so far as having pizza delivered each year to camp during their January cabin weekend. I don't suggest every scout should be a Daniel Boone, but getting through the elements at least once in their time as a scout doesn't feel like an earth shattering expectation for me. I also know of units that do lock-ins at the church hall, and count that as a camping night. Others that do lock-in at indoor climbing facilities (we have like 4 around here that do overnight programs for scouts), and count that as a camping night.

BP's original Scouting for Boys had Tenderfoot as the joining rank. http://www.thedump.scoutscan.com/yarn03.pdf

history of rank requirements if you are interested: http://www.troop97.net/pdfbin/bsa_ranks.pdf

Thanks- that is my feeling. The OA, in many areas, is only suffering the effects of what is going on in the program as a whole. BSA culture overall is far too # fanatical today than it was just a few decades ago. Ever heard the "First Class-First Year" rhetoric? I'll take a troop of 10 kids who are really interested in outdoor activities, that don't whine about a 5 mile hike, that know what it is like to wear out the soles on a pair of hiking boots before they outgrow them, who aren't afraid to be out of range of a cell=phone tower for an entire night any day over a troop of 50 kids that is fortunate to have half of them on a campout in the local park.

The # of overnights and been increased in 2016, in part to get things back to outdoor emphasis as it had been in prior to the 90's. It didn't last too long, obviously, before it was changed back down to 3.

I did attend the Thrive webinar with our LEC. The numbers are a bit sobering, and the context of it all was... correct on many levels that we need to be concerned, but missing the mark on some points. The reality is that many units today in my part of the country camp only a handful of times a year. Many scouts are taking 4-5 years to achieve the requisite # of camping nights to complete Camping MB. I know units that do more indoor camping than tent camping in a year, and cancel outdoor activities and do day events to museums, indoor mini-golf, etc. if there is a hint that it will be a rainy weekend. We have gone soft on outdoor program, and far too many of the youth in our program are not nearly devoted as the youth of 30-40 years ago. We've had some spirited discussions this past year on the unit election participation rate in our council, and I come down on the side that we need to better understand the units that are not participating, and evaluate the amount of effort we out into trying to engage them. if the unit doesn't participate, because the SM feels someone from the Lodge did him wrong 10 years ago, it warrants a conversation to spend 3 minutes to convince him those persons are long gone. If after 3 minutes he doesn't show any signal of changing his mind, move on. If the unit has adult leadership that were not involved in scouting as kids/were never in the OA, better chance to lead them to openness to have an election- but we need to be careful that we spend time to educate the adults and the youth on what we are. I was told by other Advisers, from within my lodge and without, that we should use the basic script about the history of the OA and that is all. To me, that only means we get mediocre engagement, and don't really emphasize the honor part of being a member. I'd be OK with 57% and 71% statistics, if we got enthusiastic scouts that cared about the history of BSA scouting, and would see the OA as an expression of their dedication. So, my focus is on how do we get that 30% number up, far before we worry about the first two statistics. National wants a commitment from Lodges to address all 3, which, if we are getting 30% to come back, then probably only about 1/3 of those scouts are actually REALLY engaging and taking leadership roles (either as officers, chapter officers, ceremonialists, election team members, etc.), then we most definitely don't have the resources to spread ourselves thin over all 3 IMO.

Our "suggested" weekends in Ma are the same as yours. The area councils try to be banded together for those dates, as the Boston based media promotes it for us. I would say that November is a time of need, but the food pantry in my town has said they get a lot of donations that time of year and would rather we did February, as donations dip after the holidays.

The script versions they can google can be helpful in writing their own, but they would probably want to see some in action, so I might suggest watching some on Youtube first. Many are only about 30-40 minutes long, though they can probably FFWD through and not have to see the award presentation for every scout. A couple to get them started: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HR741O7xn2o https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiXymm0Dg0I

From someone who has unfortunately contracted Lyme's from a tick, this is not at all the method that the CDC recommends. It causes the tick to regurgitate into the bloodstream before it backs out. https://www.cdc.gov/ticks/removing_a_tick.html

Not admonishing- it does add complexity for sure. The Eagle candidates we've had since last fall had been fortunate that they had parents who were troop leaders, which made it easy enough to assure they had 1 pretty much accounted for, so only had to "recruit" 1 other adult for everything. We have one current scout working on their project that doesn't have that luxury, and unfortunately has gone rogue a few days that has been an issue. His project is for the CO, which hasn't helped him to fly under the radar from us.

Two registered adult leaders 21 years of age or over are required at all Scouting activities, including meetings. from G2SS. Nothing reads as conflicting to me about that.

it's any activity- if you are having kids standing outside a store selling items, you need 2 adults 21+. A patrol activity, same. MB class, same.

Good analogy. Another that helps to grasp it- in many states, an accident/moving violation on your driving record will stay for 5 years, 10 years (depends on your state laws) as long as you stay accident/moving violation free. Get into another accident/receive another moving violation in that time, your costs will increase all over again. You don't typically see a massive cost drop after that 5/10 years has passed, you just don't see a drastic increase on the next renewal.

In agreement that the cub program has become overbearing. I lamented that my son had no interest at cub age, thought he was missing out. Got interested in W2 age, but ultimately heard that the DL was not organized, and the kids/parents were just sticking it out to get to crossover so I held him off until he could do troop. As he got into troop, and I learned what was involved in cubs (was it two fingers now, or three? Law of the Pack isn't a thing anymore? And AoL is a program year itself now?), I didn't regret he didn't join. I've thrown it out in other threads- the BSA seems to care more now about cubs than 'Scouts BSA' sadly. I'm also greatly concerned on those posting that "we'll go through bankruptcy, and all will be fine". Uh, my actuary co-workers would beg to differ on any interpretation that risk mitigation is greater because of a bankruptcy. The future insurance costs are going to be based on the risk to underwrite the program based off the sins of the past, regardless of how much $$$ BSA ends up having to pay in settlements. This new background check process is absolutely an attempt to stave off risk costs. I won't at all be surprised if we see greater age restrictions coming in the next year on shooting sports, climbing, and high adventure. I fear immensely that BSA is going to do what it feels it has to do to keep risk related factors in check to help with costs.

100% agree with you. Sorry, but she knowingly is making this into a circus- what Eagle BOR has she ever known has been conducted by any outside group? None. Zero. So it is not official. Her quote “The Boys Scouts policy right now is they’re not… allowing young women to have boards of review like this until October 2020 even though we’ve already completed the requirements to officially achieve the eagle award.” No, you have not officially achieved the eagle award- the BSA gave you the path, so follow it or don't. Sydney wants the official recognition as the first, period. That is the motivation here. And, as I have always maintained, it is highly plausible she is nowhere near the first female to do what she did, and I don't hear those other ladies yelling about it.

The cost just to be counted as a "Scout" or "Scouter" at $100 I do see as a deal breaker for some for sure. We've been discussing in our TC the ramifications- we'd love to offer assistance to families if indeed it is that big of a jump, but short of rolling in more fund-raising there's a limit of what we can offer. Our CO is tapped. We don't want to have fund-raising to start to overtake time spent on activities. In my view, the community is pretty tapped on those peddling to them. As we have historically covered the cost of registered adults, this could be a big jump to our budget, and I'm beginning to have conversations with those who are only minor contributors - I can't justify paying a $100 for someone that comes only to handful of meetings, never camps, etc. I'm inclined to have them register as a MB counselor (assuming those are still free) just so I know YPT is being tracked.