scoutldr

I think what everyone is saying is "don't make life any harder than it needs to be." A small group of like-minded adults ought to be able to play nice and figure it out. Ya wanna see anal-retentive decision making, go to a PTA convention...sheesh. They have a full time professional parliamentarian in the room.

There is no BSA rule. I guess the PLC can implement such a rule, as long as the CO is good with it. In that case, I think the SM can assign "an alternative leadership role" to the young man, at the SM's discretion.

Well, I have a problem with a Unit Committee being hijacked by a bunch of "parents" who come to a meeting prepared with index cards to force a vote. They need to be politely told that, while welcome to sit and observe the meeting, the business of the Pack/Troop is the domain of the registered leaders, duly approved and authorized by the CO and the BSA to run things. If they don't like the way things are, submit an application and they can have my chair, and the BS that goes with it. They may be asked to serve on an ad hoc committee (or "working group" or "task action team", etc) to do WORK, like a fundraising project or Pinewood Derby, or B&G...but they are not the "Decider". That's the CC.

Legalistics aside, I am under the impression that the only path to NCS is if your COuncil sends you and pays for it. Individual unit leaders just can't sign up and go.

Yeah, it took a while to get our heads wrapped around it...and some never did. While we trusted the Executive, the thought of "unlimited power" was hard to accept...we had "fiduciary responsibility", dontcha know! (which Carver said was BS). One of the things Carver suggested was whittling down our Board from 18 to about 6 members. With limited time available (we were all volunteers), by the time we went around the table and everyone had their say on each issue, not much else got done. Everyone felt obligated to "contribute" to the discussion, even if to rehash or reiterate or agree, using different words. That's the danger of "consensus" decision making...it can take a lot longer than just a straight up or down vote. Unit committees can take a lesson from that. Maybe more "ad hoc committees" and fewer "Pack committee members" around the table to streamline things. I definitely would not open the meetings to anyone who feels they need to be there...as a practical matter. Too many opinions are not always a good thing.

Welcome to our campfire! You will get lots of advice here. Has anyone had training? I will start out by saying that I'm not clear on how the CM can influence boys one way or the other? Cubbing happens in the dens...the CM's primary job is to emcee the Pack Meeting, and to recruit and mentor the Den Leaders. Den Leaders run their dens and the Committee runs the business and planning end. As CC, you are in charge, and should NOT be "running the Webelos". So, my first bit of advice is to get everyone trained and then running in their own lanes, and NO multiple roles...there are enough jobs to fill so that everyone can have one. Contact your Unit Commissioner and ask for an objective assessment and guidance...that's their job and it's your job to ask them. Good luck...

To offer a different perspective, I recently completed a 6 year term on the Board of my national professional accreditation board. Almost my entire term was spent on transitioning the Board Governance to the "Carver Policy Governance Model" (you can google it). Basically, the model advocates a strong executive, empowered to do whatever he/she feels is necessary ("means") to achieve the policies and vision established by the Board ("ends"). It was stressed to us that Board time should be spent establishing overall goals, visions, and guidelines, rather than spend time "voting" to approve the minutes, or the budget, or approving expenditures, or, God forbid, getting wrapped up in Robert's Rules. The Executive is empowered to do anything that is not specifically prohibited by Board policy, such as hire and fire employees, raise dues, send out newsletters, form ad hoc committees (NOT board members, etc. The Board, meanwhile, is pontificating on lofty goals, such as building membership, increasing value to the public and stakeholders, etc., and communicating those goals to the Executive, whose compensation is tied to meeting those goals. (well, in our case, forget the compensation part!) Committee work is NEVER done at Board meetings...that is where results are reported. (a common flaw I see at District meetings). Anyway...don't know if this is relevant or not...but I would hate to see Unit committees waste time dictating "process" when they should be dictating "results", and let the process up to those whose job it is (CM, DL, etc).

They will, however, allow you to buy all the souvenirs you can carry at vastly inflated prices. I usually wait for the clearance sales on www.scoutstuff.org

At the rate we're going, we'll be like 3rd world countries where the electricity only flows for 3 hours a day. How's that for incentive? UNfortunately, Americans do not react to threats...they won't do anything until they find themselves cold and in the dark.

Visiting for the day does not sound appealing. Most of your time will be spent parking, walking to and from parking, and fighting crowds, which will be huge. Also, not sure if shuttle buses will be available for visitors, or just paid attendees...do your homework first. Not MY cup of tea. But then, I live 20 miles from Busch Gardens, and don't go there, either. (Kings Dominion is a lot closer to AP Hill).

"but dropped the idea of insurance that covered every visit to the doctors office, routine vaccination etc and handled that ourselves." I suggested that several days ago. That will never pass muster by the Liberals (like my MIL), who think that "someone else" should pay for everything and "we" should not have to pay anything. I think we are moving that direction anyway. The Democrats are right...the current trend is not sustainable...but the solution is to let the free market decide. We'd be amazed at how many MRI's are no longer "necessary" if the patient balks at paying $5000 for each one out of pocket. And if Docs are no longer able to pass the cost of the machine off to the Insurance companies and quit buying them, I'll bet the cost of the machines will drop. Simple supply and demand. Econ 101. Brings an analogy to mind...the Speedy Muffler place where I always got my car inspected (and always passed), got a new "laser headlight alignment" gizmo. Lo and behold, every time I took my car in after that, the headlights needed aligning, or they wouldn't pass it. Took my car to another inspection place and it passed, just fine. Haven't been back to Speedy since. Their loss, not mine.

Was there ever any doubt?

A guideline is, well...a guideline. Not a hard and fast rule or regulation.

That's what insurance actuaries do. If blue-eyed people have more accidents, they're gonna pay more too. It's just business. That's why the under-25 set pays more, and that's why boys pay more than girls and single guys pay more than married guys. Because, statistically, they are a poorer risk. Population-based risk analysis. If you don't like the price you're quoted, shop around. Back to health care, while some may argue that we all have a "right" to health care, it is wrong, IMHO to say that we have a "right" to health insurance and that the private sector must sell it to us at rates that we can afford, even if it means they will not be profitable.

"I won't hit them up for cash in addition" Good, because that would be a violation of BSA policy. Only Councils can solicit cash donations. I recently got the dreaded "phone call" from our DC because I did not submit an FOS pledge card (I think I was absent that night). For the first time in over 20 years, I said no. I recently learned that my health insurance is going up by $50 a month (to over $400), and I am steadily writing checks for my #2 son's upcoming wedding in 2 weeks. I fully expect that, even if I get a good evaluation next year, my takehome pay will decrease...again. I guess what bothers me is that I don't see any communication coming from council as to how they are economizing or downsizing to acccomodate the (I presume) downturn in FOS and UW donations. I am in a district that went through a 1 for 3 split a few years ago, requiring more professional staff. While our district was very large and Camporees were a challenge with almost 1000 attendees, we were very successful. Since then, the 3 resulting districts have been, I think, mediocre. Our council camp was renovated 20 years ago, and since then, not much. Last I looked at the Council's Form 990, there were two employees listed (only those making >50K need to be listed). One of them made barely more than 50K. The other made 3 times that. I have a real hard time asking people to donate toward the salary of someone who makes 3 times what the average parent in my Troop makes...when I know they are struggling with their own family issues like deaths of Dads, cancer, and job loss.

While I agree with the sentiment, I don't think sending threats (via the "sample letter")is very Scoutlike. Especially when the writers do not have the power to make good on those threats.

As long as he can show adequate leadership in a "Project Manager" role, I don't think it matters how the supplies got there...fundraising just won't be part of his project. Sounds like they already know what they want and where they want it, and are just looking for someone to provide grunt labor. The challenge will be to show enough leadership and planning.

Could it be that people with bad credit ratings statistically have more auto insurance claims? Just sayin....

Sounds like a lack of training. The DL's work for the CM to carry out the vision and program decided on by the committee. And I agree, there is no reason to be double/triple-hatted unless you want to have all the power.

There are no "rules" about such things. Committees need to set their ground rules up front...most are very informal and not strict about "rules of order". THe COR is the liaison between the Unit and the CO. So, I would say, yes they have the final say...but if they continued to usurp the responsibilities of the COmmittee and Unit Leader, I would have to have the proverbial "friendly cup of coffee" and ask them to either let me do my job, or find a replacement.

I think if I were being asked to work 50 hrs a week and being called part-time, I'd have a chat with the Labor Department...and the union. THere are laws about that.

"Our MB Pow Wow Organizer who is a District Committee member disagrees and says any scout can attend, so long he is official. (registered, in troop, ect ect.)" This is correct. In addition, they must have SM approval to work on the badge (e.g., signed blue card if your council uses those). Just ignore the DE. He doesn't "approve" anything when it comes to advancement work. It's between the SM, the MBC and the Scout. Now about those MB Pow Wows...

Just like WE are now paying for the "Great Society" that our parents voted for. Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid...what's the diff? Nobody asked ME if I agreed with Medicare. And I DON'T agree with a lot of it...especially the waste and fraud part. And as Big Gov gets deeper and deeper into our lives, it will only get worse. The whole thing is a grand scale Ponzi scheme...the same thing they put Madoff in jail for. Let all the taxpayers keep their money and buy what they need. How's that for "choice and competition". Costs will come down if there is really a choice...but when the healthcare industry knows that Medicare will pay XXX for a procedure, guess what...that's what they will "accept", even if it could be done cheaper. You can bet your bottom dollar that I wouldn't have 4 walkers in my shed if the patient had to pay for them. But the Govt pays for them, so what the hey..."sure, I'll take another one." PS: WWJD? I would hope He'd just cure everyone.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

Here in the Land of Pleasant Living, we drink "Aruh See Cocola". Usually served with Snickuhs or Moon Pahs. When we do get real Coke in a 6 oz bottle, you have to dump in some salted Planter's Peanuts. (not boiled peanuts)

This is really between the parents and the Troop. Just adhere to the rules...if the requirements aren't done, no AOL. Oh, well.