scoutldr

The statement is true as written...you will find troops that are adult-led. That is not the correct method of running a troop, however.

The latest news reports are that the leader's son, Michael John Oliver, 12, suffered two broken legs and was able to drag himself from the burning wreckage. He is in the hospital and is expected to recover. Memorial services and funerals begin today for the three Boy Scouts and Scout leader who died in a wreck Sunday in Southampton County. Fourteen-year-old Carter Thomas Stephenson will be honored at 3 p.m. today at High Street United Methodist Church in Franklin. A memorial service for Jackson Fox, 13, has been arranged for 11 a.m. Thursday at Capron United Methodist Church in Capron. The funeral service for Luke Drewry, 12, is set for 2 p.m. Thursday at Courtland Baptist Church in Courtland. John Oliver, 43, will be honored at an 11 a.m. service Monday at the High Street United Methodist Church in Franklin. The families have requested that Scouts and Scouters attend in uniform if possible. A fund to support the families has been established at the Colonial Virginia Council, ATTN: Troop 17 Fund.

There are several of us here from Va...what part of the Great Commonwealth are you in? (We also have some from as far away as Australia!)

Welcome to the forums, eaglescout06! The only rules are the Scout Oath and Law...and yes, actual scouts can join in! There are several already on the forum.

Problem is, the candidates here have spent most of their money bashing each other and we have no idea what they stand for or if they have a plan.

The turtle is the totem of Unami Lodge #1 in Pennsylvania, but that's not a positive ID.

Donations may be sent to: Colonial Virginia Council Troop 17 Fund 11721 Jefferson Ave. Newport News, VA 23606

I just got home and was shocked to read this, which is close to home. What a sad day. My prayers are with the families.

So, playing devil's advocate, what happens after I write my DL number on the tour permit? Does the nice lady at Council have access to the DMV computer? Does she look up every DL to check the driving records before stamping the tour permit? How many moving violations can I have before the tour permit is denied?

C'mon guys. I read Merlyn's first post as an "FYI" to inform us about an ongoing issue. Not to grind a particular axe or air a beef. I too feel the ruling is proper. As a volunteer to the BSA, I get to decide the limits of my participation...not the parents. That's not to say I'm not sympathetic and very thankful for my own good fortune.

You may have already earned some! If you earned Arrow of Light, a Religious award, Hornaday Award, Heroism Awards or Eagle Scout as a youth, you are eligible to wear the corresponding knot.

The 80's is "the past"???...hoo boy. Seems like yesterday.

I've been told that with a white suit, a red carnation, and a lot of Grecian Formula, I could pass for Ernest Angley. Not sure if that's a complement or not.

How do we get them to think about anything? As stated in another thread, my observation is that kids these days are just waiting to be spoonfed their next activity. They don't think, they don't plan, they just react. Yesterday we had a canoeing outing at the SPL's house which is on a large lake. The activity has been planned for months, troop calendars were handed out, and the parents knew all about it. The weather started out iffy, but the clouds cleared by 9 am and it turned out to be a warm, sunny day. Some showed up late, having to be roused out of bed by the parent with whom they were riding. They were all told to bring a contribution for lunch (chips, drinks, cookies, etc)...none did. I'm the first to admit that troop meetings are boring, because, in spite of the PLC planning, come Monday night, nothing is prepared. I've thought about firing the SPL and getting a new one, but they're all the same. My perception is that they live their lives in 15 minute increments...at the end of the troop meeting, there is no further thought of Scouts until next Monday night at 6:45 when Mom says, "It's Monday night and time for scouts", at which time they grab their balled up shirt from under the bed and get in the car. Then they show up at the meeting and sit down, waiting for the next 15 minutes' worth of entertainment. I started Safety MB with them several weeks ago. I went over all the requirements, most of which need to be completed at home with family involvement. I gave them several resources (internet, etc) with which to find crime statistics, safety checklists, etc. I'm still waiting for the first one to come back and say "Mr. Scoutldr, I've completed some requirements, would you look at them?" They are simply not interested, unless someone nags them. I'm not going to do that. As I reread this post, it occurs to me that this may be why Scouting is in decline. It's not that kids are not smart enough. It's because that today's culture does not fit the "boy-led" model. Planning and leading is anathema to the way they are being raised, both at home and at school. Then they perceive meetings as "boring" because the SM doesn't do everything for them like the parents and teachers do. Perhaps B-P's model no longer works in today's society. Hmmmmm.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

Pack, are you really a Brit with a fake American accent?

It looks like the typical high school or college class ring...

I grew up watching Rob and Laura Petrie sleeping fully clothed in separate beds because the censors would not allow male and female (even married couples) to be seen under the same sheets. Now we have Two and a Half Men, where every other sentence contains a reference to the male member. The favorite shows of the women in my house are "That 70's Show" and "Desperate Housewives", which I find equally offensive. Although I've never watched it, I REALLY hate "Ugly Betty". My mother's name was Betty... We do all like "Dancing With the Stars" though. And I hate to admit we got stuck on American Idol (Soul Patrol!!!). My favorites on cable: Weather Channel, History Channel, Discover Channel, Mythbusters, Antiques Road Show, Lawrence Welk Show.

Unfortunately, I see this all too often. Young people today seem to have a hard time accepting responsibility, because they've never had to be responsible for anything before. Up until now, everything's been spoonfed to them, even in school. Unless there's some immediate reward for them, they can't see why they need to do something just because it's the right thing to do. The only thing you can do is get them into training, and fast. After that, it's up to them. They either perform, or step aside. I hope I'm over-generalizing, but I don't think so. (This message has been edited by scoutldr)

Good question, Bill. I don't see anything that would prohibit it, provided all the requirements are met. (There's a little more to it than just swimming a mile, which they seem to forget at summer camp.)

Here's my take on it, as an Arrowman since 1968. The OA is an approved program of the BSA. IMHO, neither the Troop Committee nor the PLC has the authority to say "we don't do OA." All you have to do is make the time available to the Election Team, and if there are scouts who aren't interested, they can decline to be considered. If there are those who want to become Arrowmen, you can't deny them the opportunity. To me, it's akin to saying "we don't do merit badges" or "we don't do religious awards." Accepting the call to become an Arrowman is an individual decision, not the troop committee's. One of the principles of OA is that an Arrowman's first obligation is to his unit, so if OA interferes with the troop program, you're not doing it right. If a scout is "all OA" and you never see him at troop functions, that should trigger a "Scout spirit" discussion at his next BOR.

Thanks, Beav for the perspective. You make a lot of sense (most of the time :-). I should add that I first met Mrs. Scoutldr in 8th grade Confirmation class, and I was smitten. 39 years later, I still get smote regularly. I should also say that my church, an ELCA congregation does not currently charter a unit, although they did until about a year ago. My unit, a Troop, is chartered to a UMC. Next time I'm sick, I'll scour the internet for the UMC doctrine on the issue. I think that it's just a matter of time before the ELCA and other denominations who are liberalizing their views on gay/lesbian relationships figure out that the BSA policy is anathema to their ministry, at least in this area. My mother's funeral was also officiated by a female Pastor. She was great!

Well put, OGE. I was wondering the same things from the start of this thread. BSA says "atheists and agnostics cannot be members." Scout says "I'm an agnostic". The way ahead is clear. The troop committee should meet with the scout and his family (with the COR present) and clearly explain the DRP and BSA membership requirements. Then I would give them until recharter time (presumably within the next couple of months?) to let you know their decision. This is their decision, not the committee's. While we as scouters may not necessarily agree with BSA policy, we have agreed to deliver the program as it is written.

Not exactly true, Michael. They can still join LFL or Exploring. I know they are "separate subsidiaries" of the BSA, but IMHO, that's just smoke and mirrors so BSA can keep their numbers up. If the BSA is so adamant that gays and atheists are not worth associating with, then the policy should apply across the board. Can't have it both ways.

OK, I've been home sick for 2 days, so I've spent a lot of time surfing the internet. As I've said, I'm Lutheran by birth, from a long line of Pennsylvania German Lutherans, and a Scouter with 32 years of service stars. I am an Eagle Scout and earned the Pro Deo et Patria religious award. I was baptized and confirmed in the Church, and was active in Luther League (youth group), and served on Church Council for two terms, and was a substitute organist. My life growing up consisted of Church and Scouting. Now I'm afraid I may have to choose. I will say up front that my own beliefs are more aligned with the church than with the BSA policy. My church's stand on gay/lesbians is that we are to accept them and minister to their needs, but they will not (yet) be ordained ministers. From the last churchwide assembly the following resolution was passed: Recommendation for Assembly Action Majority vote required WHEREAS, this church holds that marriage is a lifelong covenant of faithfulness between a man and a woman (Message on Sexuality: Some Common Convictions [1996], page 3); and WHEREAS, the Conference of Bishops in October 1993 stated, We, as the Conference of Bishops of the ELCA, recognize that there is basis neither in Scripture nor tradition for the establishment of an official ceremony by this church for the blessing of a homosexual relationship. We, therefore, do not approve such a ceremony as an official action of this churchs ministry. Nevertheless, we express trust in and will continue dialogue with those pastors and congregations who are in ministry with gay and lesbian persons, and affirm their desire to explore the best ways to provide pastoral care for all to whom they minister (CB93.10.25); therefore, be it RESOLVED, that the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America continue to respect the guidance of the 1993 statement of the Conference of Bishops; and be it further RESOLVED, that this church welcome gay and lesbian persons into its life (as stated in Churchwide Assembly resolutions from 1991, 1995, and 1999), and trust pastors and congregations to discern ways to provide faithful pastoral care to same-sex couples. An even bigger question is how do ELCA churches (and other denominations with similar stances) reconcile chartering BSA units if they are forced by the BSA to actively discriminate and deny gay/lesbian Scouts and Scouters. I'm afraid the BSA is painting themselves into a corner.

The 50 miler award application says, "Make suitable plans for the trip" and "Select a suitable trail or waterway" Based on that, walking in circles around your front yard doesn't qualify.