Scoutfish

I totally get what your saying, but you have to stop and make a give/take situation with it now days. Watching a movie on a sheet hung froma tree? Well, a few years ago, you'd have to try and find a "reel" movie to do that. Good luck. Of course, not the newest DVD players have projectors that can use the hanging sheet if you want, but a tv screen is an acceptable substitue. The kids are not whating a flat screen nor were you watchinga sheet - you were watching a movie. The movie could be shown on a sheet ,a screen, or the side of a white bulding ( been there- done that! ) Now, the key thing is this: Times are a changin. So a certain amount of centimentality occurs. Right now, I remember being a kid opn summer vacation: We'd pack bologna sandwhiches and pimento cheese sandwhiches. Warm ( if you were lucky) water ot coolaid to drink...coffee can to pee in so dad could make better time on the highway. We used to stop at a particular KFC for dinner. Back then, chicken was just fried. That's it! Either you got if fried or you didn't get any. Green beans, mashed potaoes and if we were good.... banana pudding for desert. Hardee's had a hamburger, cheeseburger and a big delux. THAT WAS IT for the menu. So anyways, I see campouts now with 15 different kinds of juice drinks, power drinks, sodas and what not. There are fruit rollups, candy this or that. This kid has a football, that one a nerf rocket, another has a skateboard. I used to have a pocket knife and a half minded plan for mischeif. So my point is.... alot of stuff is based on the times you live in. Alot of the current stuff would have been at camp had it been invented and an everyday par of life when you were a kid. Now as for cell phones and i-Pods etc.. I think they should be left home. Maybe leaders have one for emergencies, but that's the side of me that says : Why go to camp if your gonna talk to all your friends at home anyways?"

Let me give you some perspective from my point of view.... I am the brand new CM of My pack. The previous cubmaster asked me to be the CM because I am fairly new to the whoile buisness and I have plenty of ideas, enthusiasim,etc.....for now. The Cm was an awesome lady, but she's been CM for 6 years. In those 6 years, she watch the entire leadership cross out with only her having expetrience. She's been the CM, CC and Treasurer all at once for lack of anybody even thinking about helping, much less actualluy helping out. She's dealt with parents who thought BSA meant Baby Sit All the time. Parents who thought they had special priveledges because of their income or last name. Then you have people who are the spouses of registered leaders..who are not actually registered themselves who somehow think they have pull in the pack. WOW! We couldn't make the job harder for the CM if we tried huh? Now as for the committe chair: Bunch of new ideas huh? Sounds great! Who's helping or stepping up to impliment those ideas? I am only asking because a CC cannot do it all by themselves. Now, I'm not saying that your CM and CC are perfect angels.....just saying, not everything is as it seems. Talk to your Cm. See is having a job, as well as kids, as well as taking charges of the program and the rest of everybody elses kids as well as baby sitting parenst might be wearing on his/her enthusiasm a little bit. See if the Cm needs some help ina particular area. See if the Cm can delegate to the ACM or possibly let somebody else take over. CC: Well, a CC is only as good as the committe that serves with the CC

The only, and I mean ONLY thing this Cm did that was okay was to light a campfire. No, not a towering inferno, but just a plain old fire. Nothing more than 3 or 4 logas at a time and the flame not over 3 feet. Everything else......THis is a runaway train. You are not going to stop him yourself, you are not going to make himsee the serious problem with what he;s doing , not will you convince him to stop. The best thing you can do is lodge a formal complaint to the COR, CC and DE( at the very least). Urinating? Not only is this a YP issue, but also a potential health/ sanitation/ spread of disease issue. Right now, in the back of my mind, gears are turning. I may be totally and completely wrong..but why would a CM allow the boys to do such stuff: Urinating in front of each other? Singing about bodily functions? Sexual inuendo? This Cm is doing one of two things: 1) Trying eway way too hard to be liked by the boys..to a point he's doing harm instead of creating comradre. OR 2) He is a predator that is slowly and surely bringing the boys around. Maybe to make inaproprite behavior look like "being a big silly kid". I'll be honest - it's bad enough that a parent might be lax about thier own child peeing at a camp, but to not only allow, but practically encourage by not stopping the whole pack from peeing everuywhere - that scares me. I would not allow my child to be around this guy at all. I'd yank my kid from this pack so fast that I might give him whiplash!

dhendron, Wow! I hate that you are getting hate e-mails and PM's. Shows what people say and what their character is ..is 2 different things. Okay, congrats! When people get off track on your posts...you ought to be honored in that you posted a great post....at least by scouter.com standards! LOL! So your original question: No, He should not get any awards or advancements, recognitions or even a smiley sticker. Why?Because the awards are based on individual character or acomplishments right? The awards goes to the person, not the group the [erson belongs to? So If I am one of those people who - in my personal vehicle - runs stoplights, drives aggressively and shows road rage and regularly passes stoped school buses....I sghould not get a safe driver award because of how I drive a company truck. The award goes to me. Not my company truck over my personal truck. An award to a person or their character is based on their WHOLE ENTIRE character, not just their 9 to 5 or weekend character. Suppose you know a guy who cheats on his wife every time she goes on buisness trips. You wouldn't give this guy an award for being husband of the year because he acts it when she's home, right? Maybe not the best analogy, but you get what I mean.

SHHHH! Don't let my 9 year old hear you....he'll consistantly bug me to join your pack!

Awesome rule Twocub! LOL! Okay, I am the peacemaker. Most of the time..it even works. What I usually do is take the adult and tell them something along the lines of this: Is the situation red or port? Is it scarlet or rojo? Then they look at me like I'm speaking a forieng language. Then I explain about how I see something, how you see something and how the kid sees it. Different people, different personalities, different perspective. Not one is right, yet non are wrong. I then go into the "try and see it from their point of view" discussuion. When all of that fails, I bring out the Adult arguing with a kid to the point nobody else can tell which one is the adult.And I talk about how we learn from mistakes and everybody has the right to make those mistakes so they can learn from them. At my job.. I actually have the power to make that person step down and step back. If nothing else, I am pulling an adult out of the fire and alllowing them to cool down and see things more clearly. Of course, I am in a pack and most cases in my experience are adults being mad that the little brat from "those peoples family" ruined something that their own perfect angelic child was doing...unprovoked ..of course!

Okay, I am going to be the new Cubmaster of my pack. Well, actually I already am, but doing the transition stuff and what not so I can be 100% by fall roundup. Anyways, while shooting the breeze, I was asked if I would get a campaign hat or something similar. Well, I said no because I'm just not into hats. I keep a high and tight flat top haircut as my hair is just soooo freaking thick that my head sweats even in snowy conditions. So anyways, It got me thinking: I have no doubt that a hat does not change me or you, nor does it make either of us a better or worse scout leader. A hat will not give either of us a better personality, make us smarter or make us better scouters. BUT... I do know that wearing the uniform tucked in, neat and clean does rub off eventually. And I am a firm believer in leading by example. So, what about the hat? We buy and for the most part expect our scouts to wear their hats. In Cub Scouts, we know the hats also dennote rank too. So, what do you think? Should I - as a CM - wear a hat? I mean, if I expect the cubs to wear a hat, shouldn't I be held to a higher set of standards? I mean, I know not wearing a hat will not make the program crash....but at the same time...sometimes..the smallest details make a BIG difference. What's your take on it?

Bacchus, An hour a week? Shoot! I'm 9 weeks ahead of my time schedule then! LOL!

Basement....... You know.... I feel the same way sorta. I mean, I do not feel empowered, higher up or anything like that. I feel like I have more chance to work even closer to the boys and also have a chance to impact the boys more. Of course, the down side is I have a better chance of screwing it up as CM as compared to an ADL or DL. Basically put, I'm still the same "me", but I'm in a greater position to mess things up . So far, all I have done ( in my week of CM) is schedule out the 3 summer fun days and started working with our DE about holding trainings at our CO so everybody won't have to drive all the way across the county to get trained. And I have plans for our roundup pack meeting in place already. As well as approaching a few people about becoming DL's/ ADL's and starting them with their training. Sooooooo..... So far it's just more work!

I didn't mean to imply that people don't mislead or lie to the boys...just saying that the tents alone do not tell the boys they will camp every month - that's the fault of whoever is selling the program. Alot of the camping out hiking and saving lives stuff is a urban mislead. Cartoon show scouts camping, fishing, making traps , and just all round being Grizzly Adams or MacGyvers of the woods. You know what I mean? Society's impression of scouts is leading old ladies across 12 lane super freeways and always toting a Swiss Army Knife that even James Bond would be jealous of. Again, as long as you explain the program realistically...nobody will be mislead.

I see nothing wrong with having tents, simulated campfires or that nasty stinky pine tree air freshner being used. The key is...if you explain stuff, there is no misleading of the scouts. Our pack still camps, our pack goes outdoors, goes on hikes, fishing ,etc... And sad to say, not every troop goes camping every month. The props show scouting, not jusy CUB scouting. Scouting doesn't end at cubs, nor does it start at BOYS. It just transitions. The props didn't mislead you.....the lack of insight or effort by that pack did.

No, there is aproblem NOW! Emotional. no can't say I am as it is not, does not, not will if affectme in any personal way. But here's the thing, it may not be a crime to sack tap, but there are laws about touching other people without permission. Depending on how you want to defimne it..it falls under unwanted contact to full physical assault. But I'm not concerned with playing lawyer or court system My concern is with the scouts who follow rules, follow the system and do things right. "Sorry Johnny, I know you were is physical pain nad had to go to the hospital and get stuff done. but well... Billy Bob said he apologized and as far as Billy is concerned...it's all done and settled!" Yeah, so basically, we are telling all the good scouts that as long as the bad scouts apologize, then it's all done , settled and they have to just deal with it? Well, I suppose if a scout ever mouths off to you, decides to give you a sack tap or does anything else...you are gong tolet it slide, say nothing, and give him another chance? Again, this scout is not a first time offender nor is this the first issue anybody has had. I'm not saying take him to jial, just saying, he IS accountable. PERIOD! *IT is the Scoutmasters job to guide the scouts to right and wrong decisions.* Yeah, but the scout already made a decision. *Character is choosing not to follow the instinctive nature when it risk harm to the other person.* Yeah, too late on that too, the scout already caused the harm...physical harm. *Character is the courage to stop others before they hurt others.* It is also the courage to act( EVEN THOUGH NOT POPULAR) to stop somebody to CONTINUE harming others. Not just saying: " We'll let it go this time, but next time there's trouble" This scout isn't 5 years old. And "Everybody else was doing it" isn't a credible excuse. If that's the case, I'm going to rob a bank and then tell the judge" People have been doing it for ages!" Incidentally, I'm not suggesting, calling or suggesting the boy is a sexual predator. Sack tapping could easily be a kick in the but, thumping the head, kicking the back of somebody elses knee, or tripping. He's just a kid who can't keep his hands to himself and the time for him to know to stop was a long time ago.

I see things differently: Wether or not other scouts particuipate in sack tapping has absolutely nothing to do with this scout. This scout's situation is not about tapping only, but other cases of: grabbing repetative trouble the fact that this scout ( as well as his parents) think they have the final say about all matters of closure involving incidents with others This scout and his parents again think they are victems and last but not least; This scout has broken the rules in a big fashion Look at it this way: If I was a cop and either gave somebody a ticket or arrested them for vandalism ( let's say spraypainting) It is not my job or duty to look at all the other people in the neighborhood or city to see if they spray paint too. This scout may not be the only one who is sack tapping, but he is the one who got caught, caused personal injury that also resulted in monetary expenditure, and also thinks he has the right to decide when this turn of events has been settled. When my 9 yead old gets in trouble for taling in school. he might say : "But they were talking too!" But it doesn't mean the teacher will look at my son and say:"Oh, in that case never mind!" Nope, my son still did something he wasn't supposed to do, he got caught and he has to face the consequences for it. Wether or not others were doing it too has no bearing on my son...it just means they may or may not get in trouble too for breaking a rule.

Troop24, I see what your getting at, and it is a great question, but the answer isn't simple nor is it black and white. I'll give you my answer as to why we sometimes exclude or remove people from certain clubs or programs: We can not make or force anybody to act a certain way. We can not make anybody want to be a certain way or have a certain attitude about a program. The best we can do is try to show or lead by example. We can try to explain why things will work out a certain way and hope the believe us enough to live it out. BUT....When 99% of the group follows the program and embraces it ( as well as a kid wil that is) and commits to a reasonable attitude about it...we cannot allow that to all go to naughyt just for the sake of one individual. We can not let one child ruin the other kids experience in hopes that the one child might suddenly see the light sometime in the furure. Think about any colonies: In the overall picture, the good of the colony is always more important than the 1 ant. Especialy when the 1 ant causes harm to the organazation of the colony and especially when that 1 ant causes physical harm to the other ants. Our job is to teach, provide and mentor in the program in hopes it takes. Not watch somebody challenge the program, deny and avoid the program while destroying the quality of the program for all the other scouts. It sucks, sure does..but that is life!

Troop24, I see what your getting at, and it is a great question, but the answer isn't simple nor is it black and white. I'll give you my answer as to why we sometimes exclude or remove people from certain clubs or programs: We can not make or force anybody to act a certain way. We can not make anybody want to be a certain way or have a certain attitude about a program. The best we can do is try to show or lead by example. We can try to explain why things will work out a certain way and hope the believe us enough to live it out. BUT....When 99% of the group follows the program and embraces it ( as well as a kid wil that is) and commits to a reasonable attitude about it...we cannot allow that to all go to naughyt just for the sake of one individual. We can not let one child ruin the other kids experience in hopes that the one child might suddenly see the light sometime in the furure. Think about any colonies: In the overall picture, the good of the colony is always more important than the 1 ant. Especialy when the 1 ant causes harm to the organazation of the colony and especially when that 1 ant causes physical harm to the other ants. Our job is to teach, provide and mentor in the program in hopes it takes. Not watch somebody challenge the program, deny and avoid the program while destroying the quality of the program for all the other scouts. It sucks, sure does..but that is life!

That's how it works with our pack: The DE sets up a date with the schools to have an afternoon assembly with the 1st - 5th grade boys. The DE calls,and e-mails the pack to let theknow when so that we can plan our roundup night which usually happens about a week after the DE does the daytime assembly. Hopefully, the boys will take home the flyers and give their dad more than 10 minutes notice before rounfd up night ( cough cough) At roundup night ( at the schol) the DE stands up and introduces himself as well as the local packs to te parenst and trhe kids. Then at least 20 minutes of silliness ensues. Then the packs tell a bit about themselves and parenst decide which one seems best and the money flows and registrations get filled out. A week later, our pack has it's first pack meeting of the season. Not sure when the others hold theirs. Again, our CM and ACM start out singing and get the kids laughing. Then the DL's take all the new and current scouts outside for games while the CM and ACM give the parenst the talk!

So how exactly do you know permission isn't given? Just saying...you are judging without knowing.

Well, it's hard to say: People who like leopard skins think everybody shouldm have a touch of leopard look toi their outfits...so everybody has a bit of bias. As far as sites go...well, you don't want to be just like everybody elses - that would defeat the purpose - but how about your council logop and pack number as part of the background at the top border of your page? Maybe a phot of some of your boys doing something? You know...if a parent was looking at your site and their kid just happened to look over their shoulder and seeing some of your scouts ( or generic scout photo) doing something fun..that might make that kid want to try out scouting. Other than that..everything looks great! It's all a matter of personal preference..so if You like it...that's all that matters!

I can see the possibility of this thread becoming an arguement over wether it was hazing,or if the instigator meant for things to be as bad as they got. kay, here's the thing to remember: The boy may not have MEANT for it to be as severe as it turned out to be. He may not have been of the mindset that this was hazing or whatever. BUT....The average drunk driver does not think he is too drunk to drive NOR does he mean or intend to cause the damage or death he does when he crashes. The boy may not have meant any harm, but that doesn't matter. Harm was done, actions were innapropriate and rules were broken as well as somebody hurt. It's time to be held accountable.

from scouting.org: This certification grants a Scout the right to carry and use woods tools. The Scout must show his Scout leader, or someone designated by his leader, that he understands his responsibility to do the following: 1.Read and understand woods tools use and safety rules from the Boy Scout Handbook. 2.Demonstrate proper handling, care, and use of the pocket knife, ax, and saw. 3.Use knife, ax, and saw as tools, not playthings. 4.Respect all safety rules to protect others. 5.Respect property. Cut living and dead trees only with permission and good reason. 6.Subscribe to the Outdoor Code. The Scout's "Totin' Rights" can be taken from him if he fails in his responsibility. So it appears that a scout already earned his right to carry a knife. I won't argue that, but in Boy scouts, he graduates to a higher level of "totin" if you will. Kinda like going from a passenger driver's license to a Commercial drivers license. The basic stuff of a regular licenses still applies. If you get caught drinking in an 18 wheeler, you get a ticket over the range of all your driver licenses. So based on BSA, I'd trhink the whittling chip is still acceptable until the time the scout earns his higher level of totin. But is he screws up and shows he's not responcible enough...he loses ALL the rights, and not just the totin chip. Meaning he doesn't go back to just a whittling chip. Lose one....lose both. But I'll bet this is also something that each troop does upon itself - no set standard.

Cool! So I didn't COMPLETLEY screw up by accepting? LOL! Thing is, I was planning on being a Webelos leader this year. I never actually gave much thought to going higher than that. Of course, I'll be honest: I did take the CM position with the understanding that I could still directly work with the boys in a ADL type position ( although I won't have the official title or anything like that). Now, wether it is true or not, it was also explained to me that 99% of all offical CM decisions are made after stuff has ben talked about many timesand that in only 1% of the cases are those decisions instant. But at one time, I was an Asst Fire Chief, so I can handle that. I will NOT say that my recent training as Webelos DL was a waste, but would have taken the CM specific had I know I was going to be CM. But I guess if I hada way of knowing...I'd have won the lottery too!

First, I want to say: Pardon my interupption. I am not a WoodBadger, but based on what I have read here, I have a thought about this "Win all You Can" game. Have any of you ever seen the movie " WarGames" with Mathew Broderick? It was an 80" movie about a compuetnerd/ hacker who was just bored and looking for the next great game/ computer conquest. Well, some how, this guy taps into a military computer that has the "80's movies " version of artifical intellegence, The Hacker thinks he's found some great sorce of games, but in reality, the computer is actually tied into all the ICBM's in the US and is ready to launch them against all of America's enemies. So oin the end, only minutes before launching them, The hacker guy as well as the inventor of the Military Computer system...program in the game of "Tic Tac Toe" . They play the game a few times . Sometimes thay win, sometimes the computer does. Then they have the computer play itself. Of course, this ends up with a tie or scratch game every time. At the last possible second, the computer stops the launch and asks:" Why play the game when nobody can win?" So is it possible, that - that is trhe meaning and purpose of the "Win all you can" game? Maybe the purpose of the game is to get you involved, and emotionally attached..just to show you that in the bigger picture, being the only winner actually means nobody wins? And there has to be some emotional involvement or else the message doesn't stick. Kinda like a wet paint sign: It says wet paint plain as day, but you ignore it and touch the surface anyeways! So maybe somebody could say it's not about winning all you can, but everybody winning - but you might ignore that message just like the wet paint sign. Again, not trying to say that this is what it is about, but just a guess based only on my interpretation of the previous statements.

Let me give my brief experiemce as a Scouter. Back in the late summer/ early fall of 2008, I happened to walk in my front door at about 10 minutes to 6pm. I was hot, tired and covered in sweat and dirt. I hardly walked in when my son runs into the living room and says : "DAD! You have to take me to round up! COME ON...LET'S GO!" I had absolutely no idea what he was talking about. So my wife gives me one of those "Oooops! I love you! / I'm soooo inocent" smiles. Then she tells me that she told our son ( A WEEK AGO ) that I would take him to this roundup thing at the school. She just forgot to tell me! Go figure! So I turned around and walked right back out the door. We had to drive 12 miles up the road ( way way far for 10 minutes notice) to the school where I sat all dirty, stinky and smelly ...surrounded by nice crisp claen polo's and ironed shirts smelling of all kinds of aftershave... listening to this balding guy sing and dance and talk in a very excited voice about hanging out with my son and doing all kinds of fun stuff. To be honest, this guy actually scared me. He was TOO excited to hang out with my son. I now know that this guy is one of the coolest DE's you could ever meet and he is just too happy to help anybody, any time, with anything. WEll, when he's done talking, a few local scout leaders start talking about their packs, where they are, and which ones would be best for who. We found a great pack that had a lady Cubmaster. Really nice, really enthused, and generally just liked kids. Well, this lady really is cool. Has a great sense of humor, has a great sense of patriotism and deep ties to her home church as well as respect for our CO. She especially is a "kid person". She just loved kids, Has 3 boys of her own, who all are in, been through Cubs or are in Boy Scouts. WEll, anyways, as a parent, I am active in my son's life. I love to teach while having fun. So even though I wasn't in the planning stage of my son's cub scout involvement, I signed him up. Then we went to our first pack meeting. Learned what was expected of my son, of me and what the pack and leadership was planning. I went home and asked my wife what nights would be hers and which ones would be mine. She looked at me and said in a Mater Of Fact Voice: "Oh NO! This is YOUR deal!" Yeah, I was not thrilled. But, this was something my son wanted, so I did it. I mean, it's Cub Scouts...How bad can it be? Now, I am not the type to sit in the background or dump my kid off on others. As a parent, I participate and help out! I do not hover, I am not a helicopter. And anything my son does, I make sure he does AT LEAST 50% if not 75 or 85 percent of the work. I do not do his work for him. He won't learn that way. Matter of fact, I don't do any of "his" work, but assist whenever needed. This was his Wolf year. Just before the beginning of his Bear year, I was asked about being an ADL, which due to some camping experiences... I could not refuse.. Later in my Bear ADL year, I was asked by the CM and ACM and CC about being a DL for the Webelos year. I'd love too! Well, a few days ago, that offer was rescinded. Taken back. Canceled! Nulled and voided! I got up Tuesday morning and went out to my company truck on my way to work, and my cell phone was beeping - indicating I missed a call. It was from our CM. So I listened to the message saying she wanted to talk to me confidentially. I called and what she asked me was totally unexpected, and a complete surprise! She started talking about how she's been CM for 6 years now, been in the pack for 8 ( 3 sons stretched over time) and will be in the pack for another 4 until her last son crosses out. Tels me how much the pack has done, how far it has come in the years ( no she wasn't bragging, just saying) . I can concur , at least for the time I have been active, I have seen vast improvement and smoother running. Then she tells me she's getting burned out. Always running around for this or that, settling this dispute or that or handeling certain adults in the committe or leadership, WEll, this year, or committee actually kicked in and became what a committe should be. Lots of new parents stepping up, but still, the previous years have taken a toll.Things are great now, but what's done is done, and she wants to be more of a mom to her son and less of a CM to her son (while at scout functions and meetings). And to be honest, she was the bridge between old leadership and new when 99% of all the old leaders moved on with their sons 5 years ago. She carried more than her share of weight and responcibilty for a long time. She told me she was thinking and praying about somebody to takeover the CM position. Well, I'm still fairly new to the pack, so I assumed she was looking for suggestions about who to ask. I had two people in mind. Then she says: " I wasn't thinking about any particular peson per-se, but thinking about the qulaifications needed to be the CM. I thought long and hard, and I have been praying for a week and a half about it." "Every time I think about the qualities and attributes: Patriotism, working with kids, sense of responcibility, following the God, Country, family theme, and also somebody who gets along with everybody, as well as the enthusiasm , and great ideas and insight, and who the boys like and respect, ......I keep coming back to you!" I almost wrecked my truck! She talked it over with the COR,CC, and ACM - and they all agreed I was perfect. Well, the ACM had already asked me about being ACM back in April during our crosover ceremony,and was still hinting about it. Seriously, I never would have expected it. Then I asked about what some of the other leadership might think? I was told it's about the boys, not the leaders. She then said that she KNEW I had the respect of all the other leaders and committee members except possibly one. And everybody has one of "those" people in their pack or troop - if you know what I mean! So, long story done....I am about to be the newest Cubmaster in my pack. In the begnning of my 3rd year, I will be the CM. I am totally flattered, completely filled with pride and scared as hell about it. So, time will tell. So.......How did you become ACM, CM or CC? Was it ever an idea to you? Did you plan it? Any regets?

No, but you could say I sold the same amount of stuff, but did it with less expenditure...which still equals more profit per sale. Or as it relates here: same work with less effort, which happens to be a physical improvement. Kinda the whole concept behind aerobics and cardiovascular exercise.

Improvement can be misleading. It does not necessarily mean faster time, shorter time, or more reps. Think of this as if YOU were at a gym. Your PT wouldn't expect you to lift 20 lbs today, 30 the next day and 75 the next. Nope, your trainer would expect you to do the same reps, the same weight, the same everything...but with the goal of your conditioning to make it easier for you. You will get stronger and do the same work with less effort. Right now, if I was to go outside and run 800 yards, I would be out of breath and panting after I finished.( assuming I couod finish!) Probably even feel the burning in my throat and lungs. But if I kept that same routine up each week, and maintained a pace, I might do the same distance, the same time, but find it easier and easier each day. Soon enough, If I keep at it, I will run that 800 yards without breaking a sweat and without even breathing hard. Might not even raise my heart rate much at all after I get used to it. That would be a remarkable improvemnt without decreasing my time or increasing my distance. Yeah, it's be amazing and nothing short of a miracle, but you get what I mean, right?