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Everything posted by hicountry

  1. Just a few thoughts from a former SM who left in 2011 when his youngest aged out.......(Just had last scout who started under my scoutmastership make eagle so I am reminded to drop by here on occasion) 1.....Scouting USA in the 70's worked so well didn't it ? Apparently some haven't learned from that and want to try again 2.....My major reason for burn out when in scouts was dealing with the adults, the mothers were by far the worst. Thankfully they were not at the campouts messing things up, whining and interjection obtuse ideas and demands. There is no way on gods green earth I w
  2. Appreciate folks opinions positions on this but I think we all know the realities surrounding this...... 1.....BSA already had made a firm decision a while back, the survey and whatever criptic communication on "family Scouting" they but out was simply window dressing to attempt to appease people and give the appearance that they wanted input from the membership before the decision was made. This makes the value of any survey moot in the end anyway. 2.....BSA won't release details of the survey but any info they do provide is likely cooked to support the decision already made by nation
  3. I see it the same as Stosh's buddy and the car. If he took it to the shop and the night prior to the Bankrupcy issue someone called the owner of the car and said.....Hey Joe, shop xyz you have your car over at is filing chapter 11 in the morning, you better get it out of there if you still want it. Stosh's buddy decides he is high and mighty and feels that is not the right thing to do, leaves his car there and loses it in the shops bankruptcy mess the next day. Some might think it is honorable, most would agree it was foolish. We didn't have to drop the CO and go to the new one but we did hav
  4. I'd love to see scouts take the initiative to contact a counselor and work with them like it used to be but I recognize the world has changed, the Norman Rockwell days of scouting are long in the past. I think merit badge colleges, fairs whatever anyone wants to call them are here to stay, I recall going to one at a local firehall in the early 70'2 where I got started on Firemanship, First Aid and Emergency preparedness, it was a great experience so this is nothing new. It is the way the world functions today. I think they are great and encouraged my scouts to attend them, I advertised them an
  5. It struck me that I'm not illustrating this form the point of view as I see it. No disrespect intended but as I see it.... If I went to my troop the scouts all the parents etc and told them we had a problem with the CO (Financial or any other reason) and that the CO had rights per BSA to ownership of all funds and equipment. And if I then told them that the relationship with Co was likely to dissolve and the CO would take (Steal) the funds and equipment that the CO never provided in the first place. And then when asked if I would refund family moneys for prepaid campouts, summer camp,
  6. I don't think character building is sitting on your hands doing nothing to pevent basically the THEFT of the material and funds the familys and the scouts and donors created, to me that is waiting around to be a victim. You can handle it your way, fine but I think it is foolish to knowingly let someone or an organization come in and take what others created. We didn't have to leave so none of this had to happen in the end, but if it had....... Families that put money into the troop to pay for their sons campouts in advance wouldn't have been stolen from tem. It would have been rightfully
  7. 1....BSA Overburden. Would have been worse but we mitigated a lot of this. Our council does not require Tour Permits or whatever they call them now so we stayed in district and avoided that paperwork. Ridiculous picky G2S2 rules and related, we kept the boys safe but ran a reasonable program and sometimes ignored stupid rules(must be 14 to use a wagon, no squirt gun wars, and other nonsense that makes you shake your head and drains you if you think about it too much). Troop had NEVER filled out a unit money earning form in their history so we continued that tradition too. Kept Council at arms
  8. Years ago we had an issue develop with our CO, not financial or bankruptcy but it created similar concerns. Background, our Co was "OK", about all they did was to provide a meeting place and storage closet, we did a service project for them on occasion, they never provided one cent in funds not any equipment. Like most they were pretty much disconnected from our troop. Rules may say the CO owns the troop, it's funds and equipment, but the reality is it was paid for by fundraising the boys and familys did, donations from former scouts, parents and friends of our troop, the CO provided none of i
  9. Our council went to mandatory IOLS at the end of 2010, effected 2011 recharter. The SM taking over for me had nearly 20 years experience in Whitewater Guide, wilderness first aid, camping and running a cub pack 5 years before he took over for me. Had to go to IOLS, complete waste of time, when instructors figured out he knew more than them they proceeded to pick and argument with him on correct Marcus of Queensbury dish washing procedure. One ASM took the training too, he was an eagle with our troop, early 20's, led backpacking, hikes and campouts and was totally competent and again found it a
  10. I'm more about doing the right thing than doing things the right way. Lord knows there are enough rules/laws guidelines and some simply run contrary to what we are trying to do or make it 10 times more difficult to get from point a to point b. If a scout is active fundraising and it saves his parents from writing a few checks I don't see that as a personal benefit, it is not like he is allowed to go buy camping equipment or even uniforms, it covers his cost for a troop 2 night weekend campout, not enough for anyone to break a sweat. Jeff, the problem really kicks in with the families that
  11. Jeff, let me try and answer how that would work in the unit I used to serve but need to maybe step back a bit. Lets say there was $8500 in the troop account pot in May so we are clear of the recharter, dues paying, boys life stuff all that is water under the bridge. Lets say 1500 of that was earmarked as troop general funds that covers troop overhead items and equipment replacement and repairs. $7000 remains and is attributed to the scouts that the money is used to pay for local troop campouts and regular summer camps. Assume 35 scouts that comes to an AVERAGE of $200 a scout but we have t
  12. We had one account in our troop, all money deposited to it and we wrote checks from it to pay for any troop expenses. Inputs were fundraisers, some annual company donations and money paid in by scouts and their parents. Money out was general troop overhead costs and money to pay for campouts and summer camp also reg fees and the like We kept a spreadsheet separate and part of the pot of money was earmarked as general troop funds and part was what the boys could use for campout purposes only, no gear but for troop campouts. Of that portion of funds deemed to the scouts, each scout h
  13. Been down this road years ago, both my boys and a number of our troop eagles at about 16-18 years of age looked seriously into this at a camp in Colorado not far from us. Several were accepted after a long list of hoops to jump, delays and communications problems. Every single one walked away from the offer citing...... Pay similar to what is described above, meals and tent wasn't enough to make it worth it Had to buy 2 sets of dark green uniform and a footlocker which came out of their pocket and reduced the yield of the pay after taxes Were not allowed to stay on Sunday. Ther
  14. An open question but I think we all know the answer. Is anyone from BSA going to go to these LGBT activist groups and tell them...."Hey, we rolled over and gave you your way, so you pony up and bring in thousands of new scouts and scouters now that the policy has changed". Is anyone going to hold these peoples feet to the fire and tell them we put up so you would shut up, now it's your turn to deliver? Where are all the people who said they wouldn't join BSA due to the discriminatory policy ? We all know better, these people are just activist trouble makers who once they get their way will for
  15. It doesn't come off as criticism, I too am sad with the results of over litigation that has negative impacts in so many ways. I too wish many organizations would fight back instead of rolling over to the threat of litigation crowd, or fear of not being politically correct situation or fear of someone being scared, minor injury (cuts scrapes) insulted, breaking some simple and un-necessary regulation etc. The end result is we can do less and less in society, with more and more beauracracy in order to do much of it and it dis-incentivizes participation. We had another instance where one of o
  16. This is a difficult to pull off requirement in the real world and we found it takes some creative interpretation, some might call it cutting some corners. I was fortunate that while I was SM I was also a volunteer fireman in our local community in the rockies west of Denver, certified in structural and wildland fire at the time and had a few years experience under my belt to know what happens in major incidents that a scout troop might play some valuable part in, given that we went with a realistic plan but pulling off a re-enactment is problematic. We settled on the concept of the scout
  17. BSA already has, published instances with pedophile behavior and lawsuits just like the catholic church did and now they want to let the fox into the hen house, makes about the normal amount of sense we see from the BSA. Whatever the argument, moral, religious the bottom line and no one wants to her it so they just try and label you a homophobe....LGBT are perverts, sick and any amount of effort to try and make them chic and mainstream don't cut it with me. It isn't normal for a man to want to get it on with another man, makes me want to vomit actually so I won't think about it. Hey at least w
  18. Agree with some of what was outlined, as a unit volunteer and scoutmaster for 7 years I saw all the folks who were "Too Busy". Some were, some weren't we know the drill. Many folks you wouldn't want anyway (dis-functional, un dependable, vapor for brains etc). Then you get the percentage of folks who do volunteer that shouldn't (Horrible people skills, divisive, can't communicate, don't show up, don't follow through etc). The worst part of the too bsuy crowd is the struggle to get parents to even drive kids to a campout within 20 miles. The other side is the folks who did or would voluntee
  19. Somewhere around the house I have a copy of politically correct Bedtime stories, it was funny 20 years ago, not as much today because we as a society have surpassed much of the ridiculous examples in the book. Enough of the scout is obedient nonsense. This stuff from Irving and much like it is so out of whack it needs to be stood up to. Things erode because some people follow along like sheep and obey every rule no matter how inane. Many times civil disobedience is what makes things change. Continue to play by the rules and they just add more and before you know it you have a worthless mamby
  20. Just more of the feminization, wimpification and sisification spreading over America like a plague, perpetrated by the thin skinned, the politically correct and left wing filth. Call me a redneck but I refuse to participate in the continued erosion of the American spirit, especially in an organization that was supposed to teach and embody that. When my kids have grandchildren and if they want a scouting experience it will be something like trail life, I won't respect BSA with my support as a donor or volunteer as they no longer earn it, they want to be politically correct and squeaky clean sa
  21. As a prior poster said, you are being used as a dormat and the more you accomodate the miscreant parents the more they will feel entitled to take advantage of you. You need to take control of your troop with the help of your CC. If they don't want to back you up 100% of teeh way then time for them to find another pincush....er ...person for Scoutmaster. Quite clearly, the troop desperately needs you based on the description of how little help you get. To be totally honest, it is well past time that the parents should be offering a gift to the Scoutmaster and step up with some volunteers, ta
  22. BD....looks like you got re-affirmation on how trying to deal with these kinds of people can be an excercise in futility. A few things from my experience..... 1. Took a class with BSA university of scouting several years back on "Dealing with difficut scouts". One thing I clearly remeber and want to share with everyone was an experience from an unfortunate troop and scoutmaster somewhere (I relate the story they provided, I have not taken the time to reseach to verify it myself).....A scoutmaster somewhere who had an extremely difficult scout in his troop finally at some point made a
  23. As for an attitude of "I can't wait till I can drop out by adults....I can certainly understand it. It is not all the same motivations though that get people that way. There are some who were almost forced into it under bad circumstances that didn't go away, lazy folks who got into it and when they found out they actually ahd to do some work or help out a kid other than theri own had enough. Many of us got in for the right reasons, did a great job and put in effort but are at the point of burnout for many reasons described in other threads we don't have to rehash.....I was one of these type.
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