Eagledad

All adults who unselfishly desire to further the development and growth of youth making ethical and moral decisions based from the Scout Law and Oath are welcome. Barry

Dear Friend I have worked with a lot of adults who have worked many challenging scouts in many situations. Rarely, in fact I can't recall any, adult being kicked out because their personal situation was contrary to the membership requirements. So, for those leaders, and most leaders through the times, give them praise. Rarely, and I can't recall one, are discussions about kicking out scouts due to behavior. The discussions are about adults and what they role model to the youth. This should be one place where the youth are not used to prop up an opinion righteously over other opinion

Exactly! I worked with several respected gay and atheist volunteers. One atheist is an Eagle. The program works well imitating real life for the scouts until adults take advantage and push the program toward their self serving dreams. BSA Membership has taken a dip every time National has tried to appear more culturally inclusive. Honestly, I'm not sure anyone understands what just and fair mean anymore because inclusiveness has watered down the servant lifestyle that scouting promotes. Barry

And, pay his camp fees. We pay our SPL's camp fees because they work hard and are exhausted by the end. Barry

Look at it from the perspective of growth from the position. Who will grow more from the positions. From my experience, 14 is the minimum age, and really 15, for scouts to have the maturity to grow from true leadership. Puberty is a good indicator. Which is why our senior leaders (including troop guides) were usually 15 and older. I understand if your troop doesn’t have enough older scouts for an older scout PLC. I was mentioning the ideal situation. You need to determine if the maturity of your scouts are ready to take on and learn from the responsibilities of their positions,

Our patrols always yelled their cheer when their patrol name was called. Then the PL would answer the question. It's fun when the patrols try to out yell each other. We did this at Wood Badge. The Patrols also yelled their patrol yell (or something clever) when they were the color guard during the opening and closing flag Ceremonies. ---"Troop Attention!, Color Guard Attention! "LEAD FOLLOW OR GET OUT OF THE WAY!". Present Colors!". Something like that. It always got everyones attention at summer camp when it was our turn to be the Color Guard. And some troops would follow with the

Strange, I just gave a similar example of our experience. We also had several atheist Eagle dads who gave their time without a uniform. Scouting is about teaching the values that lead to character and integrity. Character and integrity are earned by the actions given towards other people, not actions received. Fit? What is that? Strange you pick out one behavior. Unit leaders are challenged with many. Our unit asked several adults to step back because of their alcoholism. Safety as much as anything, but the scouts knew what they were doing. We had to asked several known abusers

What many folks don't understand about the LDS is that scouting is part of their youth program. For them, the doctrine of scouting is an official doctrine of their church. Or so I'm told. So, they had no option but to back out. We had several LDS familes in our troop. Many churches are struggling with the gay issue for the same reason. It's one thing to accept homosexuality as a sin among sins and still love and respect your neighbor, but to accept the sin as a doctrine of normalcy challenges how they can accept one part of God's doctrine of sin, but not others. In that context, it's not

My observation and experience is that 90% of units function this way. Should that be so surprising! Excluding the Mormons, the theme of scouting is developing character though outdoor activities. The common interest are the activities, not a particular religions. This is a little strange to me. Maybe the adults don't talk about religion, but the scouts sure do. And, we had several atheist families in both the Cubs and Troops. The parents want their sons to experience life and make their own choices. Activist make is sound like Scouting is a hard core exclusive program. But, most leader

That is my point, the program would loose more membership by bringing in another smaller targeted group. The Canadian Scouts change to be more inclusive and as a result, they lost nearly 50% of their membership. The only reason they survived is they were the biggest scouting program in the world at the time. They are OK with that because being inclusive is more important to them than being developers of moral and ethical decision makers. Without a moral starting place, a compass so to speak, the program would not have a values vision to hold a program direction for the youth. It woul

Non starter? Show me that polling data. Don’t worry, you’re safe we know there isn’t any. Personal declarations of why a National organizations will to this or do that are rarely accurate. Personal predictions on forums usually come from emotional blurps. Fact and reason is religion isn’t a basis for why families join scouting. Most families just want their kids to have fun in Cubs. The Duty to god question comes at a later age in troops and by that time, the scout has already made a decision whether to stay or leave. Religion has little do with it. It’s that simple. if the BSA

Very interesting discussion. We live in a challenging time where god, or I think the Christian God, is being persecuted. Just in a 10 minute time after reading this post, I read in the news where the courts are forcing a school to rehire a teacher based on her Christian religious beliefs, and a state congress member was caught hiding bibles in the congressional private chambers. So, acknowledging God, or god, as a source for discovery might become more of a secret. I once heard that all people believe in god, some just don't like him. I'm starting think he is right. But, the challeng

Good job, you are going to have a blast. The two main CM expectations for our pack are plan and run the Pack meeting, and help the Den Leaders do their job. A lot can fall under both those responsibilities, but for me running a meeting meant having fun for an hour, and helping the Den Leaders meant making sure they at least had an assistant and support from their den. I'm not a micro manager, but I can recruit and delegate with the best of them. If the Den Leaders know you have their backs, they will have your back. I have lots of methods for both of those expectations. But, my oth

Badon Powell wrote something, I think in the 1930s, saying basically the same thing. Different words, but the intent was the same. Apparently, human nature is pretty consistent over time. But, there are the few who hold true to those traditional valves of the program and make it work. I haven't scouted in a long time, but I hang around here because it is a place to keep spreading the word. Barry

I have found that most scouting organizations see themselves as their own. Locally The GSUSA, Campfire Scouts and BSA are very different from each other. International is the same. That is why the “everybody else does it this way” doesn’t really fit well in discussions. Another subject where “everyone else does it this way” is uniforms. That of course doesn’t mean comparisons are off the table in discussions, it just means they should be discussed as “here is something to consider”. That keeps the discussion from going down the path passionate feelings going into attack position. Ba

Thanks Richard. One of our adults had a heart attack while bicycling on a campout. Lucky for us one of our other adults was a doctor, and there was an ambulance nearby supporting a bicycle race. After that experience, we performed CPR training every January for all adults and scouts in the troop. And all the ASMs had to maintain certification. Our district brought a someone 4 times a year to train and certify any unit adults. Barry

You read way way too much into my post. My post was pragmatic and in no way suggested my opinion or experience. Also, don’t use international scouting to imply scouting in the BSA. It’s different. Instead of trying to sway others with made up polls and guesses, it’s ok to participate in these discussions with your personal opinions. Makes the discussion more enjoyable and educational for everyone. A lot of us have A LOT of experience in these kinds of things in scouting and just might add something useful for most on the list.

NO BACON. I hate this discussion.

Yes, but through out recorded history, credit to morality is given to god. Even the Greek gods had followers. That is how cultural behavior is defined. And thank goodness. Otherwise, the definition of behavior comes from the person with the biggest stick. Look a Russia and China. China has the fastest growing underground religions in the world. Why do you think that is. And how can a youth association define itself as a character development program without a generally agreed source? Of course you think you are moral without god, but that is a lot of responsibility for 100 scouts under yo

Actually, if you search moral definition, most link it to religion. But, to your point, if there is no source, then every SM has claim to moral definitions. Chaos. Units can teach whatever behavior they like and call it morality, and nobody could argue. The Oath and Law would have no foundation to stand on because behavior would depend on the emotional mood of the SM in that moment. The BSA points to one source, god. So, where did the 10% come from? Barry

10%, wow, how do you know that? The mission of the BSA is Developing ethical and moral decision makers. If the Declaration of Religious Principles is dropped, what is the common foundation of values for developing moral and ethical character? Barry

We drivers upped our personal liability. It didn’t cost very much back then. Barry

You nailed it. I don't know if the problem is burned out adults, or if they just don't know how. I've said here many times that I find difference between flourishing troops and troops that struggle is the flourishing troops have adults who were scouts as a youth. Those adults remember what made their scouting experience fun, and insure it is part of their program with a purpose. And as you said the adults need to have fun too, they find the Joy is having fun program. I think the problem is adults often fixate on the outcome and not enough on the fun components that give joy the exp

I didn't see this before, so my apologies for the late response. The word "fun" is being over used in this discussion implying that it is the main reason for scouts staying with the program, even to Eagle. We talked about fun a lot in our troop to the point that the scouts were encourage to change any activity to be more fun when they felt it wasn't. That being said, my observation isn't that the fun experiences are the reason scouts are motivated to continually participate in the troop program week after week. There is a famous very old book some here know where the author basicall

There was a troop in our district with an ex Marine Scoutmaster. And he was very much the same as you describe yourself. I think he was an Eagle. It was the districts 2nd largest troop because the scouts loved him. Our adults would laugh as I hoped for rain on the new scouts first campout. Nothing teaches confidence more than setting up your first tent in the dark on your first campout. And, if that experience didn’t go well, which was rare, we had the rest of the week end to experience fun. One year a mom told me that her 18 year old son, who was never a scout, asked his 14 year old brot