Eagle732

Any discipline our SPL or PLs hand out is usually something like extra KP for the next camping trip, or clean the bathroom at the meeting hall. We had a couple of boys get into a fight during the last camping trip. SPL had them come with their parents to the meeting hall to fold tents after they were dry. No big deal, it gave both the boys an opportunity to work together. Then I usually follow up with a friendly talk.

SPL/PLC with SM consent (so things don't get too crazy) This is just my opinion

Does the pack have a policy on this? When I was CM cubs graduated in August at the big Pack Campfire and started the next rank at the first pack meeting after school started in September. We didn't have meetings for the month in between but I guess if the cubs had done something for advancement it would have counted. I mostly left that up to the DLs. As the DL I guess you can do whatever you want as long as the CM is OK with it.

"After all that's the slogan. So, why bother making it a requirement?" Well there must be a reason since service is required for 4 out of the 6 ranks. I just thought maybe an increasing (even if small) number of hours would be consistent with BSAs other rank requirements where each rank requires an increasing skill or participation level. Your points against increasing service hours are weak at best. Examples: "I wouldn't want Tenderfoot advancement to be held up because of a troop that had not scheduled a project suitable for a young boy's age and skill level" Obviously not the case in my troop and I would guess that most units have plenty of opportunities for service hours. "For example, setting a bunch of pre-Tenderfoot scouts to road-side litter pick-up is a recipe for failure" Only an incompetent SM would send a new scouts out alone on a roadside clean up, it's not safe. Aside from the safety issue how can you fail at a roadside clean up? Maybe miss some trash? "why bother making it a requirement?" Because the OP asked for opinions on changes in the Tenderfoot requirements. It's just an opinion, I doubt BSA is going to change the requirement based on my opinion. If they do then I have some other suggestions for them! In my opinion most kids in Scouting enjoy camping. So to follow your line of thinking why count the number of nights camping as a requirement? T - 1 and Camping MB all require nights camping.

I'm happy if everyone has a great time and gets something out of it.

FS, I think the concern is the trip counting towards advancement.

Did you ask him why it doesn't count? My ASM owns 60 acres of beautiful wooded property 5 minutes from our meeting place. We camp there once a year, it is the troops favorite place to camp. I count it as a camping trip. Don't know why I shouldn't. Since your CO has this great place to camp you might want to consider using it for a Webelos Open House recruiting site. We do that with lots of outdoors activities for the Webs and have had great results.

I'm a Canoeing MBC, I restrict those who I work with to scouts in my troop with Swimming MB or Mile Swim.

"Eagles list is probably $500 as well." No doubt I spend money on good gear. But I don't think my clothing list is too expensive. Other than the down jacket everything else pretty standard. Obviously if you're going backpacking once a year with scouts you don't need the best gear. But the good quality stuff lasts. Other than the socks and shoes everything else has over 3,000 AT miles on it and countless scout trips. The North Face Paramount convertible pants are $65, get them in green and wear them for scout pants, that's what I do. I like Crocs for camp shoes, I know a guy that hiked the entire AT in Crocs in 2008. I entered the AT's Hundred Mile Wilderness in Maine the day after Hurricane Irene last year. Lots of river crossings, most of the time I just walked across without taking my hiking shoes off, they were wet anyway. Heck the entire trail was a river crossing.

Roadside clean up under the PLs supervision with adults driving a chase vehicle has always been safe for us. All our service projects are suitable for all ages of scouts. Roadside clean up April and October. 3 hours each, total 6 hours a year Trail clean up March and September, 2 hours each, total 4 hours a year Scouting for Food, two days one late Feb the other early March. Each 2 hours, total 4 hours a year Assist with community fair in May. Could be more than 12 hours if you help the entire time. Flag retirement with the local American Legion, June and November, 2 hours each, total 4 hours a year That's over 30 hours and those are just the usual projects. Several other pop up during the year, there's something going on almost every month. No reason why a scout can't earn hours whenever he needs them, in fact I've never seen a scout held up due to lack of service hours. I agree that doing service just for hours is not the goal, a sense of community service is what we are going for. Our troop has very good participation in service projects, scouts always have way more hours than they need. When you have every Life and Eagle Scout in your unit showing up for and even running service projects even though they don't "need" the hours you know you're getting through to the boys. As you can see I'm a big fan of community service and our guys enjoy helping the community.

sae771, I don't know about the Maine High Adventure job but I'd be glad to talk thru-hiking the AT with you. I did it last year.

I'd like to see increasing service hours. Maybe 1 hour for T, 2 hours for 2nd, and 4 hours for 1st Class.

Here's what clothing I wore or carried during warmer months while thru-hiking the AT. Worn while hiking: 1 pr. Convertible pants (North Face Paramount) 1 pr. underwear (Exofficio boxer/briefs) 1 pr socks (Smartwool) 1 wicking T shirt (the BSA one are good) 1 pr. Hiking shoes, Brooks Adrenalin Trail Runners with Superfeet insoles Carried: 1 pr. underwear 2 pr. socks (one spare, one for sleeping) 1 lightweight shorts 1 wicking T shirt 1 Smartwool lightweight long sleeve shirt 1 Down jacket (it can get cool in the evenings, also my pillow) 1 DryDucks rain jacket Most clothing was treated with Permethrin I used Crocks for camp shoes. You could probably do away with the shorts and T carried, I wore these while doing laundry in town. What section of the trail are you doing?

Denver Area Council, "Scouting to all youth and can assure you that we are very diligent in having all of our volunteers uphold the Scout Oath and Scout Law.". Adults should be held up to the same standards we expect from our youth. Too bad that's not always the case.

I started this thread a while back asking if anyone was using velcro. http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=299937#id_299937 I specifically asked about using it to attach POR patches since our guys change jobs every six months. It was being considered as a cost saving and connivence idea. Some posters were against it. We have been doing it for a year or more now. It saves money on the POR patches. We give the hook side to a scout when he receives his first POR patch. That gets sewn on the uniform and he's good to go with POR changes.

Velcro makes a product called Attach-a-Patch. It comes in Desert Tan which matches the uniform. I buy it from a company online called Industrial Webbing for $6.80 including shipping per box, the best price I could find. Each box has a 4" by 12" piece, both sides.

When I was a CM our pack didn't allow anyone who was not a relative or legal guardian to sleep in a tent with a cub scout. CO's policy. My troop does not allow unmarried couples to share a tent on camping trips. Policy goes back before my time and had something to do with two ASMs (one female) indiscretions during camping trips resulting in two divorces. Not a good situation.

What happens when dad and his legal male significant other want to tent with their Cub?

"For those who do not prefer the whole house to smell of beef jerky, put the whole thing outside" Baiting bears is illegal around here

As a CM I held an annual pack open house for troops. Troops were invited to attend and bring whatever activity they wanted to show and share with our Webs (we had lots of Webs and Webs). We also invited Webs from neighboring packs. Some troops built monkey bridges, some did a slide show and display from Philmont, one would just send a ASM with a tent (not much effort there!). But the troop that got the most activity and thus the most recruits was the troop that year after year set up a rubber band shooting range and gave away cheap prizes. Go figure!

Never confuse the business side of Corporate BSA with Boy Scouting as we know it at the unit.

Lunch specials all on flat bread or a tortilla as wrap. Nutella and Craisins Premixed tuna salad in a foil pack. Spam foil packed and cheese with mustard. And my favorite, a Snickers bar wrap with peanut butter. This is a good option when your Snickers bars are all melted. Just peel off the wrapper and smear it on a tortilla then add peanut butter!

From what I've seen DE is the last job I would want and our Council would be the last employer I would want to work for. Our districts change DEs more than I change underwear!

I think you can have as many youth leaders as you want in the various positions. the Scoutmasters Handbook, chapter 3, which describes the positions mostly refers to the positions in the singular but that doesn't mean you can't have more than one of a position. It makes sense to have only one SPL but if you think you need 3 ASPLs then you should have them. If you have large patrols maybe you need 2 APLs per patrol, nothing says you can't. Troop Guides, Instructors, QMs, etc, all depends on what the needs of the unit are. We try to limit the PORs to only those necessary, we don't have a Librarian or Historian. Those all seem to be jobs that are freebies for POR credit. If the SPL and PLC decided we needed a Librarian or Historian we would have one but they would actually have to do something to get POR credit. Out troop has Patrol QMs which is not an official position and doesn't count towards advancement.

In the end it doesn't matter how much time and effort a troop puts into its relationship with a pack. What matters is where the most popular kid in the den is going or where the CM wants the kids to go. But sometimes the unpopular kid will choose a troop and that insures the rest will go elsewhere. Just being cynical but I have seen this happen over the years.