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25 minutes ago, walk in the woods said:

All-girl packs don't exist yet.  The early adopters were Boy Packs that agreed to take girls now.  We shouldn't see Girl Packs until fall based on the full kickoff.

They do exist .. at least 1...

 

http://www.visaliatimesdelta.com/story/news/2018/02/01/visalias-all-girl-cub-scout-pack-blazes-new-trails/1086714001/

 

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5 minutes ago, NJCubScouter said:

I think the organization is still going to be the "Boy Scouts of America," as it has been even though there have been girls/young women as youth members in one of its programs for the past 45 years.

I also think that the program, "Boy Scouts," is still going to have that name even if National pulls a switcheroo and allows girls in Boy Scout troops.

I'm willing to bet one person $1 on this.  (My standard betting limit.)  :)

Probably depends on how many girls join.  If girls represent 20-30% of total scouts I think this changes.  One guess is that Boy Scouts of America moves to BSA (similar to Federal Express went to FedEx).  Boy Scouts would become .... no clue.

If girls represent 5% and our membership continues to decline we will become REI Scouts of America (or whatever brand(s) help bail us out).

I agree that I don't think any change will happen immediately but a few years down the road it will.

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13 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

We had a campout with 18 scouts and 16 adults and 6 siblings--give me a break) and have bigger fish to fry,

That would be time to punch out

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2 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

Probably depends on how many girls join.  If girls represent 20-30% of total scouts I think this changes.  One guess is that Boy Scouts of America moves to BSA (similar to Federal Express went to FedEx).  Boy Scouts would become .... no clue.

That's possible.  My Scout shirt from the early 70s has "Scout BSA" over the pocket, not "Boy Scouts of America" as it was before and after that (including now.)

I guess the analogy to Federal Express/FedEx would be BoSco.  (No, not the chocolate drink, do they still make that?)  And I didn't make that up.  Some may be familiar with Camp No-Be-Bo-Sco in New Jersey (where much of the original "Friday the 13th" was filmed.)  The name stands for North Bergen Boy Scouts.  So there is some precedent for Bo-Sco... not that I think there is any chance of that happening.

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51 minutes ago, NJCubScouter said:

My Scout shirt from the early 70s has "Scout BSA" over the pocket, not "Boy Scouts of America" as it was before and after that (including now.)

Mine too. But I hope no one is nostalgic for that disastrous experiment of the 70s. Can we really not learn from past mistakes?

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17 minutes ago, gblotter said:

Mine too. But I hope no one is nostalgic for that disastrous experiment of the 70s. Can we really not learn from past mistakes?

What was the experiment?  I was 2 in 79 so my memory is a bit fuzzy.

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

What was the experiment?  I was 2 in 79 so my memory is a bit fuzzy.

It was a disastrously failed attempt to reinvent Scouting for the modern era. This could never happen again, say by reinventing Scouting to include girls? Nah.

From Wikipedia.

Outdoors skills de-emphasized

In September 1972 the Boy Scouts launched the "Improved Scouting Program," publishing a radically revised handbook with less emphasis on outdoor skills for the three lower ranks. Skill Awards for Hiking, Camping, and Cooking included outdoor skills requirements and were required for Second Class and First Class Scouts. Several outdoor merit badges were removed from the list of those required to become an Eagle Scout; those removed from the list included Camping, Cooking, Nature, Swimming, and Lifesaving. The Scoutcraft information and requirements were replaced by information on drug abuse, family finances, child care and community problems. The use of boy was de-emphasized: the eighth edition of the handbook was titled simply Scout Handbook and the new strategic logo used Scouting/USA. The concept of the personal growth agreement conferences was introduced as a requirement for each rank.

Other changes included new colored cloth badges for all ranks and positions and "skill awards", represented by a metal loop worn on the belt, that were awarded instantly at the time they were earned. They supplemented individual rank requirements which along with merit badges were also presented immediately, and recognized later at the court of honor. The merit badge program—previously only available to First Class and above—was opened to all ranks, and merit badges were required for Tenderfoot, Second Class and First Class. The number of required merit badges for Eagle Scout was increased to 24, and Camping merit badge was dropped from the required list. The entry age was changed to 11 or 10-½ if a boy had finished fifth grade.

Return to traditional Scouting

1970s-era Scouting/USA branding
The changes in the advancement requirements were a disastrous failure for Scouting and membership plummeted. The BSA lured William "Green Bar Bill" Hillcourt out of retirement in 1979 and he spent an entire year writing the 9th Edition of the Boy Scout Handbook. It was a return to the traditional Scouting program after the disastrous membership losses suffered by the 1970s program. From a peak of 6.5 million Scouts in 1972, membership declined to a low of 4.3 million in 1980. The 9th Edition has a great deal in common with prior editions of the handbooks that Hillcourt had helped write. The new edition reproduced entire paragraphs and pictures from the earlier editions.

In 1976 the National Boy Scouts discontinued the Improved Scouting Program and introduced "All Out for Scouting", a back-to-basics program developed by Hillcourt. The program was launched with "Brownsea Double-Two", a week-long course for the senior patrol leader who would then introduce the troop-level "Operation Flying Start" to their units. It emphasized teaching and practicing Scout skills, the purposes of Scouting, and the role of the patrol method within the troop program. Many councils ran both Brownsea and Troop Leader Development, but some councils held only one or the other. The number of Eagle required merit badges was reduced back to 21, and Camping was restored to the required list.

 

Edited by gblotter

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2 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

BoSco is much better than an alt BoyScAm 😀

They should just keep it as BSA....its a historical name and means something.  Nothing wrong with that.  I know a jew Jewish females that have membership in the YMCA.  I don't see anyone having an issue with that.

I'm going to predict the older girl program will be "Girl Guides" as a homage to the international girls.  If they just throw a label out there, people will calm down.

And I can't imagine that they won't have a troop formed in 1/2019 with a few older/interested girls to accept girls crossing over in the February-April timeframe.  I would hope so. I put my name in the hat to be on the committee in our council, if one forms near our home.  Let's see how that goes.

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6 minutes ago, JustAScoutMom said:

I'm going to predict the older girl program will be "Girl Guides" as a homage to the international girls.  If they just throw a label out there, people will calm down.

Paying homage to a historical label like Girl Guides will likely help traditionalist swallow the pill a bit easier, but our Texas brainiacs don’t have a great track record in this area.

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10 minutes ago, gblotter said:

Paying homage to a historical label like Girl Guides will likely help traditionalist swallow the pill a bit easier, but our Texas brainiacs don’t have a great track record in this area.

Some of us history-minded GSUSA oldtimers who are thinking of switching to BSA might like "Girl Guides".  But I see two big problems with "Girls Guides" as a name for BSA4G:

GSUSA would hate it, because they are the WAGGGS member in the USA, and BSA is not.

And the girls themselves who don't know much scouting history, just like their older American sisters 100 years ago, will want to be called "scouts" and not something else.

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Just now, Treflienne said:

Some of us history-minded GSUSA oldtimers who are thinking of switching to BSA might like "Girl Guides".  But I see two big problems with "Girls Guides" as a name for BSA4G:

GSUSA would hate it, because they are the WAGGGS member in the USA, and BSA is not.

And the girls themselves who don't know much scouting history, just like their older American sisters 100 years ago, will want to be called "scouts" and not something else.

They are scouts though.....just like Venturers are scouts.  They are not "venturer scouts", but they are Venturers, which are scouts.  Just semantics to me.

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And one message of "semantics" is that words have power.  When he stopped calling leaders "Leaders" and started calling adults "Leaders," things got worse, not better.

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I would imagine that BSA would have filed a trademark by now if a new name is rolling out.  I’ve been watching the trademark listing and haven’t seen anything yet.  Girl Guides does appear to be available for anyone to claim.

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34 minutes ago, TAHAWK said:

And one message of "semantics" is that words have power.  When he stopped calling leaders "Leaders" and started calling adults "Leaders," things got worse, not better.

AMEN!

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