yknot

If enough occurred that the ASM was forced to resign then that is enough for the youth victims to seek compensation. The fact I find most chilling is that he likely went on to have other victims elsewhere afterwards. These people are sick. They don't stop.

The wording here is that Paddle Craft is strongly recommended: https://www.scouting.org/health-and-safety/gss/gss02/#b Edit: The other reason to have this training is to protect yourself from liability in the event something happens.

I think what he is referring to is the conservative/liberal split within the Methodist church, which is occuring both inside and outside of the US. Many other denominations are having similar issues. It's still basically the UMC though right now.

Lotta drug detection dogs out of work due to the decriminalization of marijuana... perhaps a new career path. Camp deputy dog.

I think Eagle1970s advice was good. What you do on your own time is one thing but if you're in scouts we can't have cameras in the bathrooms. This is kind of a problem with BSA's packaged YPT. By the time it comes out, it's out of date. It needs to be a real time.

I just drove by that place the other day. My dad saw it fly overhead on it's way to Lakehurst right before it exploded.

Virtual beers and steaks have been in your inbox from time to time too, ThenNow. IRL I send actual steaks and beers, but this will have to do.

I am so appreciative of Cynical Scouter's insights and postings, along with several others on this site. There are a few people on this site who I regularly send mental steak and beer dinners on me.

Here's the version I found. Pretty horrific. https://dailyjournalonline.com/news/local/crime-and-courts/scout-chaperone-charged-after-cameras-found-in-s-bar-f-scout-ranch-shower-rooms/article_6574f813-b7fe-5790-9b74-7be6ff182fe2.html

That is exactly the kind of approach that is needed. I don't see where the system worked here other than at the most minimal level.

How is this remotely relevant to scouting? We're talking about kids who are supposed to be in a protected, supervised scout camp operating under the gold standard of youth protection in 2021. The more interesting question to me is how did this person manage to set up the camera. Didn't anyone notice there was an adult hanging out in the kids bathroom or during kids hours? And the really dismaying part, according to other accounts I have read, is that he recorded scouts engaging in sexual activity in the bathroom. What parent will want to send their kid to that kind of camp?

No BSA has been coasting on that perception for decades and that's why so many COs never thought twice about signing that recharter agreement that the nice scout person brought to them once a year. The bankruptcy case, depending on what happens with the COs, really has the potential to completely change that. If BSA had taken a fraction of what it spent on Summit and invested it in becoming the Mossad of Youth Protection, we likely wouldn't be here today. They had the data. They had the money. They had the opportunity and compelling need but chose to focus elsewh

Anything can happen anywhere but I haven't noticed climbing wall gyms being sued en masse for rampant cases of child sexual abuse. Or canoe outfitters. Or shooting ranges. The waivers for those activities generally match the expected risks.

Well, they are not at risk for that on the climbing wall. Not in the canoe. Not on the shooting range, etc., etc. But back at camp they are. Scouting is presented as a physical and adventure activity by BSA. Parents are thinking of broken bones and cracked heads, not rape and molestation, but that's a risk you say they should accept. If so, BSA should spell that out on the waivers.

One positive result that could come out of the BSA bankruptcy is if it sparks a broader conversation on CSA in society. There are scattered CSA statistics and studies but they compare apples to rocks to feathers. It's hard to draw conclusions about what kinds of settings are most risky and what prevention works other than under the broadest of generalities. I think that might come, but it would be more likely after the BSA process, not as part of it.

It is a societal problem. Trying to deflect and exonerate yourself by pointing that out, however, isn't at all useful. BSA is the organization that has been identified in lawsuits as having a significant issue. BSA has to do and be better. Simply doing a better job of living up to its own advertised and aggressively promoted oaths and laws would be a start. BSA has access to decades of its own internal data that it could be using to produce incident reports that could inform leaders when, why, where, and how incidents of CSA are occurring. There is no transparency however. And regardless of wh

I wish you patience and strength of spirit. The knot orientation alone gives me a headache.

It's not lack of scouting experience that is the problem it is lack of common sense and leadership ability. Plenty of great scouters have been born in the camp fire of just jumping in feet first when no one else would. I don't know why but scouting seems to attract a lot of people with big egos, big mouths, big opinions and little common sense. It's the other ones who make putting up with those kind worth it.

Yes, I'm aware of that form obviously. What I am saying it that nowhere on that form does it say your child is at risk of being sexually abused while in scouting. That's what I'm talking about.

The system didn't work if it keeps happening. Parents aren't looking at this and thinking, hey, I'm OK if my kid is within the percentage of scouters who are victimized, they are thinking Holy Cow scouting still can't get it's act together despite all that has happened. I don't want that to be my kid. There may be a statistical defense for CSA cases still occuring in scouting but it is meaningless and irrelevant in the face of the visceral emotional response.

I hear you but we've been saying that scouting is so much better at YP than the public swimming pools. locker rooms, etc. What we need to be saying is that we can't protect your kids any better here than anywhere else. Our YP is good but your kids could still be victimized. BSA is at this moment trying to market safety which is something we can't provide. Where is the waiver, like the ones you sign at the climbing wall or the tubing outfitter or wherever, that says scouting is an inherently risky activity when it comes to youth protection and you as the parent accept those risks? And apa

Ugh. This is why Kosnoff might be right. If this kind of thing is still happening despite gold standard YP, perhaps BSA should not be trusted with children. This isn't something that kind of happened sort of tangential to scouting but right in a summer camp under the noses ofprobably dozens of other adults, If we can't keep kids safe there, where can scouting keep them safe?

"Ryan, some things in here don't react well to bullets." ALEC BALDWIN, as Jack Ryan, quoting SEAN CONNERY, as Capt. Ramius. Things could indeed get very messy.

Ka Boom. What does this mean for folks in the weeds? More 'keep your head down and keep going' for another couple months? Kids trying to get to Eagle? Victims hoping for some kind of resolution?

Nothing specific to scouts but staff and, in particular, lifeguards have been lacking. A number of camps/swim clubs/recreational parks haven't been able to open their pools/beaches or have had limited hours. There are also a number of surprising shortages. Most people know about institutional foods, largely because of missing ingredients, but some resident camps that needed mattresses and linens weren't able to get them. A lot of mattress/linen manufacturers converted over to making masks and are still getting back online. Camps that rely on busing can't get buses fixed because parts are unav