DuctTape

24 minutes ago, Eagledad said:

Being prepared is the mental ability to step up in stressful situations. 

A lot of great stuff in there, but I wanted to highlight this single line as it is often lost on folks. Too often Be Prepared is reduced to things, not the scout himself.

Secondly, the scout slogan and motto are not two disparate concepts. They fit together. Merging Barry's understanding of Be Prepared with Do a Good Turn Daily, one starts to see how these two often misunderstood (and in the case of the slogan; forgotten) tenets of scouting form the basis of achieving the scouting mission.

The elections are a unit activity as they are done at the unit level. Just as a den chief may be elected by the unit to help a den in a different unit. The activities the elected scout participates in may or may not be unit activities.

I think part of the answer can be found in some of the older BSA literature. What I mean is the descriptions of what things were supposed to look like. For example th  older PL handbooks used stories to show a young PL how to deal with situations. And the fieldbook had sample activities for patrols. Heck the entire scouting program for a patrol could be done by following the fieldbook page by page.

And here I go describing a problem... the issue at present with the books is everything seems to be theory without examples of theory into practice. We do it here too. We try to explain the solution in theoretical terms but rarely do we give a "how to script". I have tried on occassion, but it really is time consuming to do more than just a simple "for instance".

I am not sure I have ever seen new scouts bored their first year due to being overprepared. I have seen them bored due to being under prepared. 

Caltopo is good. I also use the USGS collection. I especially like the older maps as one of my hobbies is to explore long forgotten trails.

Over the years I have seen the mention of the "perversion files" a number of times. Were these files specific as to "why" the scouter was on the list? The reason I ask is eagle1993s post references the entire list as though they were all abusers. I am not suggesting otherwise, I am asking whether the files were solely of abusers and suspected abusers or did they include names of people who  were labeled as "pervert". (as an example homoexuals have been labeled this way, perhaps adulterers as well). 

1 minute ago, mncaa said:

Our COR is present at these meetings. Can a CO ask the mandate from one group (a troop) and not for their other groups (pack, church youth group)?

It is their own organization, I would think so.

Whatever your unit decides, be sure to clear it with your COR. I would recommend, the COR be the final arbiter.

4 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

That was my second thought.  My first was hopeful (that perhaps this is a good sign).  My second is that this judge is struggling to make any decision as this is a Sophie’s choice situation.   So, she will wait it out and let fate decide.  Which could mean both groups lose out.  

I have always looked at this situation as both sides WILL lose out. There is no winning here.

Assuming the $103B is what should be owed, isn't the purpose of bankruptcy due to not being able to pay all debts? Therefore isn't the whole point of the bankruptcy judge to determine what reduced amounts each creditor will recieve? 

I think there has been enough hyperbole, sarcasm and thinly veiled personal attacks recently. Perhaps everyone who has posted in the last 24 hours should take the weekend off.

Enjoy your family, go for a hike. Do something else besides post on this or related threads. 

Perhaps after the weekend folks could return to discuss ideas and not cast aspersions at each other. We can disagree without being disagreeable. 

I will be the first to take my own advice...

29 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

Oh goody, then it is ok that those others got sexually abused. I guess they don't matter because they are a rounding error?

I do not think think this response was called for. You certainly know that no one here, including the person you quoted believes any abuse is "ok". You are better than this.

As Barry pointed out, the mission statement is vague and does not capture the essence of "what and how". The mission and the program are different.

One only needs to look at other corporate mission statements to see how they are vague and do not represent the what and how. I submit for example the mission statement of McDonalds, "to be our customers favorite place and way to eat and drink". Over the years McDs has certainly changed some menu items and other aspects for business reasons, but at their core they are still fast food hamburgers and milkshakes.

5 hours ago, yknot said:

I agree that kids like the out of doors but I disagree that scouts really offers much of it anymore. In a previous post I mentioned how nature centers jumped into the gap by offering Covid suitable programming during the pandemic. Their memberships have burgeoned while scouting has tanked. Parents love it when their kids come home talking about hiking and birds and butterflies and trees. Unlike their typical cub scout leader or ASM, the nature center naturalist can actually tell them what animal made that track or the name of the bird they just saw. BSA is really not that outdoors focused. 

Hiking, camping and other outdoor pursuits have grown for sure. Data confirms this.

IMO, you are correct that scouts is really not outdoors focused. On this board many have lamented how scouts is advancement oriented. I agree. Over time scouts shifted from outdoors focus with advancement simply as a natural outcome of doing the outdoor activities to advancement being the primary focus with the outdoors being an option.

Welcome to the virtual campfire. Grab yourself a cuppa.

hmmm. While I agree with the concept of recruiting for scouts, I am not sure it is a good idea to require a public school to have a private organization recruit to a captive audience. 

27 minutes ago, qwazse said:

Society has made propositioning for this thing not fall under "sexual activity/discourse." This might be unacceptable in your your scouter-verse, and for good reason. But if a complaint went up the chain, this guy probably argued  a "I didn't realize that's what they meant ..." clash-of-culture defense.

Bottom line: if youth didn't observe it, you'll be hard-pressed to call it a YP issue.

But it is not our duty to make this determination. It is our duty to report it, and let those who are tasked with investigating do their job.

11 minutes ago, David CO said:

I have zero confidence in BSA.  Too many good people have been removed on baseless and unfounded rumors.  Too many bad people have been left in because of influence and money.

That may be true, but just because others may not be responsible with following through on their part part does not absolve me from doing the right thing. 

Just now, David CO said:

I don't agree with this 24/7 thing that national is pushing.  I totally agree that a den leader is not always acting as a den leader.  Sometimes a den leader is just being a dad.  A den leader can be off duty, so to speak.  I get that.

However, a den leader is always our unit leader at scouting activities.  This is particularly true if he is wearing the uniform with our unit number on the sleeve.  He is representing our unit.  We expect him to comport himself like a scout leader, and we expect him to "log-in" his activities.  

 

yes, If he is wearing the uniform with the unit number I agree he is acting in that capacity.

This goes along with the uniform as a method; it visually designates which group (council, troop, patrol, etc...) which the wearer is representing. 

I would still call HQ that you have heard some things which are concerning. Let them investigate. Not our job to seek out or wait for evidence, that is the purpose of investigating. We report concerns.

I see this as conflating two distinct perspectives. Perhaps I am misinterpreting. 

1. The dad (and his scout) visited a troop.

2. The den leader visited a troop with his cub(s).

The fact that a father also is a den leader conflates the two. Unless he was acting in the capacity of the den leader then I would not expect him to communicate to the cubmaster except perhaps informally in casual conversation just like any other cub father.

My college roommate (and best friend) is color blind. We started a software company back in the late 90s to provide computer games for the blind primarily due to his color blindness and issues with video games.

5 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

As I said, the Hartford thing was a joke. $650,000,000? Keep adding zeros to the end of that ($6.5 billion? $65 billion?) and there's a conversation somewhere in there.

Do you or anyone else know the $ amount (if any) listed on the BSA's insurance policy? 

Please forgive my ignorance as my only experience with insurance policies is car, house, life, and medical and all of them have maximum $ amounts as part of the policy.

Site selection at both the macro and micro level are (should be) fundamental aspects of the program.