Krampus

@@Eagle94-A1, wow...that's some stuff. I guess in our area we have soooo much competition that assuming the scouts in any one pack are going to your troop -- even if aligned -- is a bad idea. Fewer and fewer packs are part of any troop, even if co-located with the troop.

@@mmckenziets, personally I'd like to see districts focus on issues that impact troop operations and success. Recruiting, retention, problem solving, leadership development (unit level of adults and scouts), succession planning, engaging sideline scouts/parents, etc. I'd ask troops what they need. Don't phrase it like "What training do you need?", but rather "What issues do you have?" and develop your training/topics around those responses. I think scouters tune out when they hear "training" or "meeting" or "round table" or stuff like that. If you ask them what their problems are you can then tailor your program to meet their needs. Any outcome of this should be available electronically AND in person. Should be quantitative so that there are things the units can actually take away, use and measure for effectiveness. Anything else is just more noise, IMHO.

Naw...if you ask any of the Chinese, Japanese or Indian parents around my area they will all say that's how their families are run. The Chinese kids have no free time. They are either in school, in "Chinese" school, and music lessons or some other event. Parents are constantly over them making them do things. Same with many Indian families in my area. Having lived abroad as a kid and adult, I've seen a similar mentality...albeit in the last 10-20 years. It is more generational than anything. Even American kids had less supervision than they do now. It is in no way just an American thing.

LOL, well since many of the country's top businesses are moving to this area I don't think it is that. I suspect, and I may be wrong, but I think it has to do with two phenomenon. The first is the nature of non-profit management. Although BSA is a "corporation" (under Title 36 of the USC), it is a non-profit and very much run like one. Anyone who has worked with or for a non-profit can tell you they are rife with mismanagement. They make VERY bad decisions, are slow to act and change is not something that is ever well thought out....though those involved will swear they are on the cutting-edge. Second is the good old boy/girl network. Those involved in Scouting think they know best. Member input is nice to show on a graph so you can show you "care", but they never listen to it really. This is clear in many things BSA does.

I don't care too much for political correctness run amok. Oriental refers to anyone of an Eastern origin so it is a perfectly proper term from a US point of view. Asian would be more specific to anyone coming from the Continent of Asia. But these families are NOT Americans. These are resident aliens who live here. Some are permanent and some are temporary. Their kids may or may not have been born here, and yet we see the same lawnmower mentality as with "American" families (black, Hispanic, Latino, white or otherwise).

In our area we have a mixture. Pack are affiliated with schools to a degree. They may reside at a CO but their is a corresponding school which is "aligned" to that pack. There are some packs still aligned directly with a school but the CO is a "friends of" organization. Most are part of a religious CO, though again have a school "assigned" to them by district. Packs tend to recruit from these schools, though more and more successful packs are recruiting everywhere. Few troops have packs in their actual CO. Even fewer have packs that are directly linked (e.g., Troop 100 and Pack 100) to one another. Most troops have some sort of relationship with a few different packs and "tend" to send scouts to those troops. Our unit monitors many of the packs (over 20) in our area to see how many scouts they have at each level. We then try to reach out to those packs to host events for them to create stronger bonds earlier in the process. This has helped our recruiting as our traditional "feeder" packs -- or packs with which we "usually" get scouts from -- have a smaller pipeline these days. This year we took 14 scouts from three different packs from which we've never gotten scouts. Planning 3-5 years out using this technique has yielded great results for us. We've been able to sustain a new scout average of over 15 per year, whereas had we used our old method of relying just on those traditional sources we would have gotten fewer than 8 each year. The troops that have not adapted this approach have struggled big time.

Interesting. Our advancement chair goes the other direction. He has them sit at a table (6' conference table) as he would at a teacher meeting or any other meeting. His reasoning? We give these kids knives, let the shoot guns, bows, sling shots, throw tomahawks, cook with propane and white gas, hike in dangerous areas, go swimming and whitewater rafting, and camp around all sorts of dangerous animals and locations....so why baby them when it comes to the BOR? He makes them feel comfortable and work through any anxiety they may have. No one has ever run out of the room in tears. They've all passed and moved on. They run the troop so why not actually have that proverbial "seat at the table".

@@qwazse, if you have to coach adults on how to take YPT, I'd suggest you have a bigger issue.

You'd think someone could develop an online version to test certain things (like plants, animals, etc.) and then have a 3 hour "test" for the more hands-on things. If you have ARC basic first aid (or professionally trained like @@Stosh and others) you can show those credentials as equivalency for IOLS. Soccer referees do this nationally in the US (and Germany). You take the basic course and pass, then need to recert every year but can do that online. As @@fred johnson points out in another thread about Cub Scout training, BSA is going the opposite direction with their training; they're making it HARDER to track rather than making it easier to find, take, track and re-certify. National is not just missing the boat, they haven't even woken up yet.

Same could be said for Wood Badge.

We have a training person who checks YPT and other training quarterly. They proactively send out reminders when people on the charter are 30-60 days prior to expiration. Anyone who lapses cannot attend ANY troop event until they re-certify. This has helped us keep folks up-to-date. Anyone without a current YPT does not get re-chartered. Council requires our YPT for anyone being re-chartered to be valid for 60 days post-charter submission (Jan 1st). This practice has avoided submitting anyone without a current YPT. Maybe that will help.

That's nuts! You have a better chance with three modules of 30 mins each. People had a hard enough time keeping track of a few classes. Now 19!!! What was BSA thinking???

You clearly have never met a oriental or Indian family then. The Japanese family across the street walks their kids to school ever day. Hold umbrellas over their heads all the way if it is raining. I don't mean sharing the umbrella, I mean one for the adult while the adult holds one for the child as they walk. Many of these families walk their kids INSIDE the building...until the school had to enact a rule that mom and dad (mostly moms) have to stay outside. It's not just an American thing...by no stretch of the imagination.

When I see this happening it is because the pack leaders have a vested interest elsewhere. Is that the case? We try to offer events that tie to the advancement path and work directly with Den Leaders. We have found that canned fun, ready-made events that tie in to advancement are GREAT ice breakers with the DLs...even if the CM or pack chair are hell-bent on making sure their members go to another troop. Note to hijack the thread, but has anyone experienced a troop getting ticked off with you for recruiting "their" pack members? For example, Troop 101010 has a Pack 101010. Most of the time the pack Webelos to to the troop, but more and more they are looking outside that troop and attending other troops' events. AFAIK those Webelos are fair game, no?

I've always wondered about that since we don't have a crew, but only a troop. When our boys turn 18 and want to stick around, we complete an adult application and have them completed YPT. That's enough for the BSA. We introduce them to the boys as "Mr. (x)" and walk them through the adult's role in Boy Scouts. @@qwazse, so in a crew, even though it runs through 21 people 18 or over need an adult application and adult Venture YPT?

Sounds very familiar. My cub unit never did anything with the Boy Scout unit and the CO didn't care about either. The troop nearly folded and has been on life support ever since. Troops need to be active with Cubs....and not just only during recruiting.

There's got to be a compromise between paying for a recert and practicing your training. Spending $150 every two years and taking another weekend out of your schedule shouldn't be mandatory; especially for someone who practices a ton. Maybe an online test where you need 90-95% to PSA to avoid a recert?

Yes you can see your registered leaders' training. You have to use the icon in the upper left to get to your unit dashboard. Try this PDF link below. It may help. Note: BSA is currently updating charters so your system may not be up and running with your current data yet. Also if you are new to your role the system may not have you as a Key 3 leader so your access may be limited. Lastly the system only tracks the data tied to the specific log in for a user. For example if "tomsmith" does training but he's registered in your unit under "Tom.smith" only the record he's registered under will update. You'll need to make sure your leaders use their registered user ID. This happens more than you think. Good luck. http://www.scouting.org/filestore/idg/MyScouting_Tools_FAQs.pdf EDIT: I had a few minutes to walk you through it. Do this: Log in to my.scouting. Upper left click the home icon. Click your unit menu select on the left, should be your troop or pack number plus your district. Click Training Manager on the left menu. This should take you to a menu with two pie charts. The one on the far right is YPT, the one on the left is any other training your leaders have taken. Note that only leaders registered to your unit will show up here AND it assumes that the login they use is linked to their BSA ID. If not (see example above) their training will not register. If you click on the blue icon immediately to the right of the Trained Leaders caption over the pie chart, this will download a pdf will all training your leaders have taken. BSA is updating their systems now. Your council may or may not have the most recent recharter information online, so you may be seeing 2015 data. Hope this helps!

What has changed in the application of CPR since 2014? I've taken WFA three times; nothing has changed. I teach basic FA for the ARC and little has changed in the last 5 years.

Add in CPR and WRFA to that list. CPR has changed only slightly. WRFA the same. I could see every 4 years or more, but every two? It is a money maker.

He used to be on the forum but left during all the membership hullabaloo. I will find out if he's got the modules to share. It is a big set of files (over 50MB). The great thing about the old JLT/TLT is that it actually taught something. The current ILST is nothing more than an outline of what to teach, but there's no solid takeaways for the boys. Moreover, if you don't know how to teach the subject -- which a large percentage of the leaders and scouts won't -- the course is worthless. BSA needs to develop training that can be taken out of the box and run with little effort or knowledge. Or, they need to have a training course that teaches how to teach ILST, but that ALSO has the "how" built in to the course. Lastly, JLT/TLT should be a "once and done" course, BUT the BSA needs to develop a module for teaching leadership skills that can be done annually as a re-fresher. Re-doing ILST is like reliving the Titanic; you did it once and God forbid you ever have to do it again.

Sorry, but this training is heavy on the "what" but does nothing to explain the "how". Like most BSA training it weak, unfocused and does nothing to operationalize "how" things are accomplished. It doesn't work for adults and it most certainly does not work for boys. We ran this training for a full year (four times) using the council-trained ILST trainer. The guy helped build the course. The feedback after EVERY course was that, while the boys learned what they should be doing, the course did not tell them how to do it. It was like handing someone who had never seen fishing before (and didn't know what fishing was), a rod and reel and telling them to use it properly. At least the old JLT had both the what AND how. Ever since using that, our boys understand what is expected of them. This ILST falls far short of the mark.

Didn't GBB write the JLT and design the crest?

We sell flower flats for $20 and take $8 profit. Cheaper and better than DIY stores and we deliver. Far better bargain!

My cousin did a cool thing. He was took the old JLT and built their TLT on that model. I borrowed it. Far superior to what BSA offers today.