SeattlePioneer

> Are you a Cub Scout or a registered adult leader?

> The less I have to do, the better. The only thing I really take charge of is spring and fall recruiting, since I'm also the district membership chair.

> Merlyn must have had his fingers crossed when he signed his BSA application.

> Hello Scoutfish, I disagree. The Pack has a program of activities. It's decided on a program of inexpensive activities rather than pay higher prices for district and council activities. That's entirely legitimate, in my view. There are THOUSANDS of activities Cub Scout families COULD do. The pack has no obligation to promote those in competition with its own program even if some are council or district activities. My pack met a week ago and considered four different activities for Saturday. One was chosen and three were discarded. No effort was made to inform families of all four activities. We had a good turnout and a great time on the pack activity that was chosen. > Perhaps it was discussed at a pack committee meeting which Blujacket didn't attend. Or perhaps Bluejacket didn't attend the program planning meeting where a decision was made. There a certain balance between the district and council promoting activities and events and undermining pack programs. It sounds to me that in this instance the Cubmaster thought his program was being undermined by the District Commissioner. I doubt that the DC was doing so intentionally, but perhaps he was a little too pro active. However, I could easily see myself doing the same thing and being miffed if a Cubmaster yipped at me.

We have certainly defined away legal penalties for killing unborn children, at least if the mother and a doctor do it. If an assailant does it they can still be prosecuted for a crime. Indeed, the ability to kill off unborn children is now a constitutional right --- you can find it right there in the constitution! The mothers of America and Europe have killed off more defenseless human beings than Stalin and Hitler combined

How do OA dues paid translate into funding available for OA lodges and chapters to spend?

If an adult leader is registered, their position can be changed during the rechartering. A new adult leader application isn't changed. Names, addresses, phone numbers, e-mail addresses and other information can be changed during rechartering for youth and adult leaders. It's the easiest time to update or correct that information. Also, you can save a copy of your recharter top your hard drive and then e-mail the file to people as needed if desired. I find that having the file on my hard drive is very convenient for easy reference.

> This is one of the universal claims of the sexual liberation movement. Divorce, pornography, availability of abortions, abortions for minors, availability of contraception or whatever. The claim is always that a person who objects to such things needn't do it. But how has divorce, pornography, abortions, contraceptives and a long litany of other elements of the sexual liberation agenda changed our culture for EVERYONE? I would say it has transformed our culture, and very often for the worse. So I think your claim is bogus.

Generally speaking, state legislatures decide marriage laws, including which of the very small number of human relationships are eligible for marriage. It's true that the USSC ruled that state legislatures couldn't restrict marriage between races. It's also true that some state Supreme Courts have decided that their state can't restrict marriage to people of different sexes. But in general, marriage laws are decided by law by the political branches of government. That also means that legislatures can change such rules if they wish to do so. The legislature in Washington State passed a law approving gay marriage, which has been challenged by a referendum. So the issue will be up to the voters to decide in November. If the voters decide to approve gay marriage, that will be the law of the land. If the voters turn it down, it will continue to be prohibited.

The pack for which I'm Unit Commissioner has a Halloween Party, with the Webelos Den putting together a Haunted House behind the curtain of the school stage each year. They just adopted their annual plan and elected not to have a meeting on October 31st. Instead the Halloween Party will be the previous week on October 24th. I've encouraged Cub Scouts to bring in pumpkins carved at home for display. Pumpkin carving at a den meeting can be good.

Those who have been folloowing this thread know that as a Unit Commissioner the pack I'm assigned to was having a leadership melt down. An excellent Committee Chair left a year or so ago, leaving the Committee Chair position to someone who didn't do much. That shifted the burden to the Cubmaster, who did a fine job, but announced he was leaving, and he wasn't finding people to replace the Committee Chair (also leaving) and him. It was a formula for a pack leadership collapse. As Unit Commissioner, I stepped in with some ideas on how to put things back on track. A promising new Committee Chair was signed up, and a new Cubmaster also agreed to serve. We had the first Committee Meeting last night since those leadership positions were filled. The new CC took charge and did a fine job. The old Cubmaster put together a program for the pack for the next school year which was discussed by and approved by the Pack Committee. The new Cubmaster was there, but didn't have much to say. Anyway, we have a quality program idenbtified and approved for the new year. The Committee Chair has definitely taken charge. The new Cubmaster may need some help and support to figure out how to do that job. Our fall (and spring, 2013) recruiting nights and plans are in place. I would say that the transition to new leadership is progressing pretty well. As a Unit Commissioner, I intervened pretty heavily when the Cubmaster wasn't succeeding in finding new leaders, but that seems to have paid off. Was I TOO BOLD? Apparently not.

Hello Scout Nut, > Well --- yes. But I'll bet you could use the Scout Parent or Tiger Cub Adult Leader codes if you want to, just like you can use other codes that aren't listed, such as the College Scouter Reserve. Now remember, you got me started on this with your earlier post: > What are you trying to do --- turn me into a Scout Nut too? We have only room for ONE of those!

Hello Scout Nut, After reading your post I reviewed the Adult Leader application to see how one might register as a Scout Parent or Tiger Cub Adult Partner. There was no simple check box that might accomplish that purpose. It looks like you would need to fill out the adult leader application and use position code AP to register as a Tiger Cub Adult or position code PS to register as a Scout Parent. I googled up "BSA position codes and got the following: > A minor point --- a Tiger Cub Partner can be 18 years of age while a Scout Parent must be 21.(This message has been edited by seattlepioneer) This leads me to beleive that a Tiger Cub can have as many registered Tiger Cub Adult Partners as desired, and that as many parents as desired could register as Scout Parents. So BSA is presumably ready for the next advancement in the Sexual Liberation movement, since polygamous families will find that all of little Johnnie's Mommies and Daddies can register as Scout Parents or Tiger Cub Adult Leaders! (This message has been edited by seattlepioneer)

> Hello beardad, I think yours would be much the more common reaction on a pack leader. Most6 pack leaders find themselves overwhelmed with program choices and wind up picking and choosing which they will make part of their program. It might be just such a leader who has made choices and doesn't want them upset by competing programs that the District Commissioner encountered. That's understandable too, in my view. Personally, I would have just backed off and apologized. As a Cub Scout Roundtable Commissioner, I had an e-mail list of all the unit leaders in the district, including not just Cubmasters and Committee Chairs, but Committee mermbers, Chartered Organization Reps and Den Leaders and such. I e-mailed out notices on the monthly Roundtable program and occasionally sent out notices on other program activities to help publicize them. My experience is that if parents are offered several program choices and their time is limited, they will usually choose the one that seems most fun and appealing. If the district is promoting a fun event, it may cannibalize the program offered by the pack. So a measure of caution in promoting events directly to families may not be unreasonable.

Hello Eagle,

Hello Basement, Your right....tiger parents are required to registered....forgot about that. By who's requirement? I've never seen anyone who was a tiger parent registered as a scout leader unless they took a formal position in the unit. >> > A fine point, but not quite correct. When a youth registers as a Scout, there is a box parents can check to be recognized as a "Scout Parent." They are making a pledge to support their youth in Scouting by checking that box. The Scout Parent program is described in some detail on the youth leader application, and contains a referral to www.scoutparents.org for further information. There is yet another box on the youth leader application that invites parents to select themselves as the Tiger Cub Adult Partner. Tiger Cub Adult Partners are listed as a separate group on the recharter application. If the parent filling out and signing the application isn't going to be the Tiger Cub Adult Partner, presumably they would not check that box and they presumably wouldn't appear on the recharter as being the Tiger Cub Partner. But I don't really know how you would designate someone else to be the Tiger Cub Partner. Neither Scout Parents nor Tiger Cub Adult Partners are registered Scout Leaders. Neither needs to complete Youth Protection Training, for example. No fees are collected for Tiger Cub Adult Partners or Scout Parents. A parent can select themselves as a Scout Parent and as a Tiger Cub Adult partner and appear listed in both categories if they check the boxes. I think I am correct on this, but parsing the BSA applications is a subject of seemingly unlimited subtlety. Perhaps someone will correct me if there are yet more fine points I don't have correct.(This message has been edited by seattlepioneer)

> All of the above.

Hello AlFansome,

Hello Packsaddle, As I understand BSA policy, we aren't supposed to go into detail on those issues. In compliance with BSA policies, I'd like to encourage you to ask your Mom or Dad about the birds and the bees...

In Washington State the state legislature over the past few years gave homosexual partnerships every privilege of heterosexual marriage except the name. During the last legislative session legalizing homosexual marriage was passed. It was since the subject of a referendum petition and will be on the ballot in November. So check out the results in Washington state on election night for an answer to your question.

> Hello BSA24, I think your comments are too tough. Most Scouters have to struggle with which "rules" to take seriously and which rules to take as guidelines that may be dispensed with when there are good reasons. We see disagreements about where that line should be drawn all the time on these forums, and in the end Scouters and leaders have to decide such things for themselves, or as committees. So while I think that using the patches as recognition during IOLS was a reasonable idea --- a good idea, even, I can see where reasonable people might decide to "go by the book" on this.

I've seen plenty of examples of adults who learn effective small group leadership and personal management skills while they are BSA adult leaders. I'm one of them.

BSA24 has obviously made his choice. He is welcome to it.

Hello suzisk8, Congratulations on your appointment! Assuming that the "Recruiter" strip is a youth award, I think it's an excellent example of where leaders may wish to use the BSA as a guide to running their program, rather than as binding rules. If I need to sew something on to my uniform to make my program work, I'm going to sew it on.

Hello Horizon, Human beings are different than other animals because human beings can reason. So they are treated differently than other animals. Still, making gratifying our animal lusts isn't a suitable cornerstone for organizing society, although that is what the sexual liberation movement has been doing the past half century or so. People have two basic moral choices they can make these days: 1) support the principles of natural law which makes the right and natural use of human genitalia for procreation the cornerstone of human sexuality. 2) support the principles of the sexual liberation movement, which makes gratifying sexual lust the cornerstone of human society You'll notice that the goal of the sexual liberation movement is far more ambitious than that of the natural law agenda. Basically nothing is allowed to get in the way of gratifying sexual lust. Divorce, sex between children, polygamy, adultery, incest. The arguments are the same to support all of them and a lot more. Take your pick.