scoutldr

From my heritage, Froehliche Weihnachten! In spite of our differences and sometimes heated discussions, we all wear the same uniform and I am firmly convinced we are all here for the good of the youth we serve, and I would be proud to share a campfire with any of you. To all my brothers and sisters in Scouting...A Blessed Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, and a better New Year!

We've done really well with the "airing of grievances". Now who's for some "feats of strength"???

Yeah, let's sit around and curse the weather. Damn Virginia! Conditions so horrendous no self=respecting human would live there. Let's move Jambo to the UP of Michigan in January, then we can even the score and make us Southerners suffer equally! FWIW, my council camp is about an hour from the Jambo site...never had a problem in the 40+ years I've been going there every July. The casualties at the last Jambo, from what I heard, were more from stupidity than the weather. (This message has been edited by scoutldr)

"people with blood pressure issues should cut out caffein a week or two before the trek" Well, now THAT's sound medical advice. So, after check in, he's free to drink coffee for the remainder of the trek since his BP won't be checked again until he ends up in the ER? Here's an idea...why don't we leave the practice of medicine to those who are licensed to do so.

All of this is for 2010 Jambo purposes. There is no valid reason that a "talent release" should be connected to a Health and Medical form.

Thanks for your unofficial opinion, Bob. But, following your inerrant advice to just "read and follow the BSA program materials", most of us have formed different unofficial opinions. So, until the BSA clarifies the intent, in writing, we will just have to agree to disagree.

Thank you, Counsellor. That is exactly the logic I've been trying to put forth here. If "risk of medical emergency" is the criterion, then we need more "screen-out" factors than weight. Let's have maximum limits for trigycerides, blood pressure, diabetes, smoking, etc etc. The "can't carry a fat guy" argument fails to hold water. When I teach BSA Lifeguard, I purposely choose a victim who is NOT a typical 70 lb 11 year old...usually myself or the Aquatics Director (a female who is more obese than I am, but much more bouyant). It builds their confidence to know there are methods whereby a couple of skinny kids can rescue me off the bottom of the pool, get me on a backboard and out of the pool where they can do CPR. Allow me to throw out another challenge...if I grow 6 inches taller, problem solved and I meet the standards. Anyone want to join me? (my success with this will be about the same). PS: What else is ambiguous, is who exactly will be the "Enforcer". As I read it, the form is speaking to the health care provider who must sign the form. In reality, the 14 yo CIT who inspects my medical record when I check in at summer camp will just be looking for a signature and date. If the form says "strongly encouraged", then I don't know many MD's who will sign the form, knowing they are going against BSA "recommendations" as stated on the form. They won't be privy to these discussions, nor to the FAQ on the BSA website which may or may not clarify ambiguities.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

Posting recipes for Dutch Oven Lasagna should be banned. Anyone for Dutch Oven Salad?

Since you're into being precise, Bob, the word is "prerogative". It's not the local council or your SE who has to sign off on the form...it's your health care provider. If you were an MD, would the language and intent as written on the form be sufficient for you to put your medical license on the line? I can't see arguing with my Doc over the meaning of "evacuate" or whether my summer camp is considered "high adventure" or not. After all, the form is good for a year...not for a single event. He doesn't have time for that...nor should he be required to deal with such ambiguities. My camp does not employ a licensed doctor or nurse. Some years we had junior corpsmen from the Navy (E-2 to be exact, and the last one pointed his ear thermometer down my throat and wondered why it didn't work). Recent years, we had an EMT, who by the way, weighed at least 400 lbs and had to use a golf cart to get around. So I would interpret "evacuate" to mean the time it takes to get an ambulance (i.e., "ground transportation") to the camp and back to the nearest competent medical care (hospital)...at least an hour...on a good day. I'm not trying to make it more difficult...but I DO wish the BSA would hire writers who can say what exactly they mean. PS: Perhaps it's also a cost-saving move...now they only have to stock uniforms in S/M/L.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

That's my interpretation, as well. And I have a 30 year career in interpreting government rules and regulations. In the past, I have been medically "cleared for all activities" on the annual medical form. Unless the intent is to require a new form for each activity...there's a big difference between teaching swimming for a week at summer camp and a two week trip in the Northern Tier. I can't believe the BSA released such a form without going through a "murder board" to uncover all the ambiguities, loopholes and unintended consequences. Or maybe they did, and the consequences are intended.

Call me cynical...I'm not willing to trust my entire estate to some lawyer, whose only interest is to find a way to get the BSA and their insurance carrier off the hook. For a couple of hundred dollars a year, I can sleep at night, and am also protected for non-BSA incidents. Where did I hear this before..."BE PREPARED"???

Go ahead...make my day! What's next? Requiring a weigh-in at each BOR?

"worded extremely poorly" Why should that surprise anyone in a BSA publication, which apparently no one except BW can read and interpret correctly? If the concern is scouts having to carry your butt out of a wilderness area, then no one over 150 lbs should be approved, no matter how tall or healthy you are, so THAT argument falls flat. As someone earlier alluded...what is the problem this is intended to fix, and where is the data?

Ditto, kenk. I was the fat kid in school...since birth. Growing up, Scouting was my life. In spite of my weight, I managed to have an active Scouting career, comleting three 50 milers, summer camp every year, Eagle Scout, mile swim every year at camp, ARC WSI, BSA Lifeguard and BSA Lifeguard counselor. But if my services as a leader are no longer desired because of a number on a chart...so be it. What really makes me sad are the many boys who will be "screened out" of scouting as well, without being given the opportunities to succeed that I had.

Some friend...I'm surprised she's not suing the power company for putting the light pole in that particular spot.

I noted before that the Jambo application for leaders stated something to the effect of "be a role model of physical fitness"...I assumed that was for cosmetic reasons. Don't want those overhanging guts and huge buffalobutts showing up in the news footage and memorabilia pubs and videos and embarrassing the BSA. With the new form, your Dr gets to be the bad guy. Don't get me wrong...I'm all for physical fitness. I assume people with other risk factors will be screened out as well. A smoker weighing 140 lbs is just as likely to drop from a heart attack as a nonsmoker who is overweight....maybe more so.

Based on the new height/weight tables, looks like a lot of Scouters have reached the end of their careers. My summer camp is more than 30 minutes from the nearest hospital by ambulance. How are they going to replace all of us fat Scouters? Guess I won't bother re-registering.

I, too am a bit puzzled. In our council, no EBOR happens until the Eagle App is signed by the Council Registrar who checks all the dates, MB, etc. If the POR date is hinky, no signature and no EBOR. Seems like a LOT of blame to go around, but I have to agree, the Scout is responsible to know what he needs to do, and the SM and Committee are responsible for checking that they were done. I stand by my original post...if I had sat the EBOR, no Eagle from me.

As someone who frequently sits on EBORs, the EBOR charter is to ensure that the requirements for EAGLE have been met...not to go back and ensure that the requirements for STAR or LIFE have been met. That being said, if the POR for Eagle (6 months since earning Life) was not done, the Scout would get a NO vote from me, regardless of whose fault it was. Let the appeal board waive the requirement...that's above my pay grade.

The first requirement is: Tenure: Complete one year as a registered Cub Scout den leader Pretty clear. ADL can earn the Cub Scouter award.

I;m not aware that it's published anywhere. Your best bet is to call National BSA HQ in Irving, TX. BTW, it's called the "Honor Medal". The Medal of Honor is the military award. I think the nicely framed medal and accomanying citation would be enough...I don't see how names of other people would add anything. Never seen that done before....my two cents. Congratulations to your FIL...it's an extremely rare award.

When my financial advisor found out I was a Scouter, he advised me strongly to get an umbrella liability policy...which I did. $2 million worth. Something to think about. If there is an unfortunate accident (even if not your fault), the results can be financially devastating to you just to defend yourself, regardless of how many permission slips you have. The point about keeping the wife happy is well taken...trumps everything else.

Cracked, dry skin on the feet is a typical symptom of a fungal infection. Try an antifungal such as Lotrimin AF for 2 weeks (or generic equivalent). If that doesn't do it, see a podiatrist or dermatologist. I can say from experience, it's extremely persistent and hard to get rid of. Disinfect the shower and bathroom floor as well, and avoid going barefoot in public showers or locker rooms. PS: To answer your question...the powder is probably keeping your feet drier, thus warmer.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

Assault and Battery (not self-defense) is illegal in most jurisdictions and therefore would NEVER be appropriate.

"I'm going to propose at our next committee meeting that we refund registration fees for any families who become unemployed upon request." Why would someone request to become unemployed? In that case, it's voluntary and I would not refund their fees. ;-) Seriously, though...in my part of the country, I don't see where Scouting expenses are a deal-breaker for anyone. Those who can't afford scouting, probably couldn't afford it before and aren't in the program anyway. Granted there are some parts of the country that are worse off... Scouts are supposed to be earning their way anyway...not asking Mom or Dad to stroke a check. That hasn't changed.