Lisabob

Well anarchist, I guess we disagree. No, not all campouts are going to be a lark. But your comparison (joy riding with Cindy Lu?) is hardly fair. One can work hard, even struggle with something, and still enjoy it. Even if it is difficult at the time, one can still see the value in it at the end of the day. And we are talking about boys here, who are attending these events primarily because they choose to - most are not forced and those who are (by parents, etc.) usually don't get much out of it anyway. And then, if your older boys are downright bored at very many campouts, I suspe

Cascodad, just FYI in my area many boys join immediately upon graduating kindergarten and do attend day camp as Tigers during the summer prior to 1st grade. Our council actively supports this. I'm sure others will disagree but as far as I'm concerned, whatever pack policy is regarding rank advancement should directly influence whether or not summer camp counts for the lower or higher rank for the outdoor activity award. In our pack, boys were considered to have "graduated" to the next rank as soon as the school year was over. At that point they could no longer work on previous rank r

Rooster7 you asked about troops w/ specific head gear. My son' troop includes a green beret in their class A definition. The berets are stamped in yellow lettering with the troop number, town, and BSA. (green/yellow are the local high school colors - I think that's why these were chosen - troop neckerchiefs are in these colors too). The troop buys the berets from a private company that makes them to order. My son and his buddies seem to like the berets. The troop also has baseball-style caps that are optional for class B but I hardly ever see any of the boys wearing those, even whe

I can't see how the CC can pull this off, or why he'd want to, scoutmom. If attendance at campouts is a real issue, the better approach would be to ask why. Maybe the program isn't very exciting or there aren't enough new experiences for returning scouts, or they're too challenging for the newer scouts, or something else is lacking. In that case, setting a mandatory attendance policy won't fix the problem and it'll probably just accelerate the drop out rate. I can also imagine you'd get some boys who would still attend because they feel they have to for advancement, rather than becau

kram1, a couple thoughts based on my own experiences trying to pick up pieces in a pack that went through something similar. 1. It may be that you inadvertantly made a problematic situation worse for the committee by issuing that newsletter. If they hadn't had time to go through the proper motions for firing the other DL and officially hiring you, your action may be seen as a power play on your part to force the issue. Now I am sure this is not what you intended and it may be horribly unfair but still, some people will see it this way. So it may be useful for you to apologize

Offer to teach them a skill and make it fun. My son's troop does a fantastic open house program for webelos where the kids get a chance to do hands on stuff (put up a tent, build a fire, make dump cake, learn to tie a knot as part of a specific activity - not just for its own sake, etc.). The boys love it. I sure wish the adult leaders would do something like that for new parents too. Now we all know there are plenty of positions where being able to start a fire with a damp stick and an inch of rotting string in sub-zero weather while blindfolded is irrelevant, but they may not know or

I would add a membership and/or round up chair (Could be one job or two separate). This person should be in charge of keeping on top of registrations and keeping a current pack roster so you can communicate with the families easily. They should also attend your district/council round up training and help plan your pack's recruitment efforts. You can also find a discussion of leadership positions in your Cub Leader Handbook (ch 7 I think) and a fairly helpful set of job descriptions at the Virtual Cub Scout Leader's Handbook website (not an official BSA site but a lifeline to cub leade

This is one of those intangibles yet obviously one of the most important things we could hope the scouts develop as a result of the program. I'm curious about how you approach this? Do the boys in your troop have a good idea about what they should be doing if they want you to sign off on this for rank advancement? If so, what do you do to communicate those expectations to them, in addition to leading by example of course? Boys being, well, boys instead of adults, they're bound to have some un-scoutlike moments along the way. How far do you go with these "moments" in terms of d

I suppose we could debate the exact meaning of the requirement but here's how we did it. After attending various troop meetings and activities we invited the SMs from the troops our webelos wanted to join to come to den meetings. That's where they did the conferences (individually). In a couple cases, boys who couldn't decide which troop to join met with more than one SM. Neither SM had a problem with this approach, they were glad that we were doing the conferences at all - apparently most packs in our area somehow miss this requirement (don't ask me how, I don't know!). As an

My son's troop meetings break down as follows: 1. opening ceremony including flag salute,uniform inspections and attendance, and various announcements 2. patrol meeting (what happens here varies) 3. a troop-wide activity (skill, game, preparation for upcoming event, ocassional guest speaker, etc.) 4. some time where the boys don't seem to do much except "hang out" but I think this is supposed to be time to take care of paperwork related to upcoming events - often resembles "semi-organized chaos." 5. closing ceremony including retiring the colors, benediction, and any other ann

The course I was part of (C-19-03 at Camp Munhacke in MI) was great. Well-run and (mostly) very professional, also fun. There was a lot of emphasis on thinking problems through and learning to utilize the talents of everyone on your team. 5 of the 6 people in our patrol finished our tickets. I suspect the 6th attended the training partly because his wife did too and she seemed a lot more motivated than he was. The most useful part of the training was the network I developed. I know I can call up any of those folks with questions any time I need to - and of course vice versa. The ti

My beef with mandatory fundraising quotas and buyouts is that they tend to assume either that the parents are able to afford the buyout, or that the family can provide a social- or work-related sales network for the boys to exploit. This is especially true with fundraising events that stress an experience rather than selling a tangible product. (For example, participating in a road rally, or a jeopardy-style trivia night, at $10 or $20/person - these kinds of events are increasingly popular where I live). In the long term, the boy who doesn't have family to rely on for a customer base,

Yeah well at least we're not prone to mange (grin). Lisa'bob A good old BOBWHITE too!

Wow, lots of great ideas here, thanks everyone. I'm going to print this out. I love the quilt idea. Herms, I guess I didn't realize that the boys could wear those (expensive!) red jackets. I think I may wait until I'm pretty sure my son won't outgrow it in 2 months before buying one of those, but it would be neat to have a little ways down the road. Thanks again for all the ideas. Lisa'bob A good old bobwhite too!

Thanks, EiKY for your replies. Very interesting to see how other troops deal with these issues. Anarchist, I answered some of your questions in that other thread so I won't repeat here either. The reason I spun off a new thread was to get a more general set of responses and insights to these questions (which must, after all, come up fairly frequently with new scouts), rather than a reaction to the specific situation in my son's troop. However, yes, I am a registered scouter and I have been for 5 years. Not long in comparison to many of you with more experience, but I do think

Anarchist, Of course I'm still "talking" to you...no worries, I've got thicker skin than that! And yes I've read the BSA handbook for the boys as well as gone through a fair amount of BSA leader training directed primarily at Boy Scout leaders (like Woodbadge). I don't pretend to understand all the nuances of the program though and there are times when the differences between cubs and boy scouts catch me off guard. In this case though, I suspect the issue is as much about troop "culture" as the divide between cubs and boy scouts. To answer your questions: 1. yes there are t

This has been spun off from another thread ("Another Stupid Question" in the patrol method forum). I'm curious to know how or if you help your new scouts, usually 10-12yrs old, to take initiative in terms of seeking help for rank advancement and learning new skills. Also, how much initiative you expect of them at that age and in the early ranks (say, working toward tenderfoot and 2nd class), in comparison to more experienced/older scouts? 1. Do you find that most new scouts in this age group are capable of taking initiative on their own, or is this something they usually need to

gwd-scouter, if your whole troop sells just $600 of product and you are making the standard 33% unit-level profit of about $200, and now you have to pay almost $100 of that profit for excess product, then yes you have a problem. Heck, you could probably raise more money doing a soda can drive. I guess if it were me I would take the math to the council professionals and politely explain to them why, sadly, next year, your unit will not be able to participate in the council popcorn sale. And that you'll be planning an alternate fundraiser instead (for which you do need council approval

I share Michelle's and her nephew's frustration, as this is similar to the way my son's troop operates. The only difference is that in my son's troop there are plenty of new scouts instead of just a couple. 8 months after the cross-over, 2 of 12 boys have achieved tenderfoot, none have 2nd class. This isn't for lack of attendance on the part of the other 10 boys, his troop just takes a very hands-off approach to advancement that requires the boys to be quite assertive. I understand the value of that in terms of the boys' personal growth but at some points I wonder if it isn't a bit too dauntin

Wow is that a short-sighted attitude. As a former cub leader this is JUST the kind of attitude from some (all too common in my experience!) in the Boy Scout end of programming that really ticks me off. Where do these folks in your lodge think most boy scouts (and hence, most OA members) come from, if not from the cub scout program? Have they spent any time lately actually talking with any cub leaders about their cub outdoor programs??? I hope these same people aren't ever caught bemoaning boy scout recruiting trends... At the very least, maybe you can suggest that participation in

Our council requires units to buy full cases too and no, we can't return opened cases either. Argh. Anyway our pack has dealt with it by using the leftover for prizes, as thank you gifts to people who help us out (like the school janitor who bends over backwards - sometimes literally - for us and doesn't get paid any extra), and as samples for show&sells in the future. I've heard of a few packs that have an informal swap set up so they can fill small orders without having to buy another whole case from council. Lisabob A good old bobwhite too!

EagleinKY, it is interesting what you said about the appearance of an adult-led troop and parents who think their boy can be done before he's 14, etc.. No doubt there are plenty of these folks out there. I probably misunderstood the "boy-led" idea too prior to my son crossing over, despite my best efforts to learn a lot about all of the BSA programs - seeing is not the same as experiencing. But I know a lot of parents who wanted their boy to join "the organized troop" (ie, the adult-led) in town not so much to pursue a quick-n-dirty path to Eagle, but rather because they wanted to mak

Wish I'd had your webelos to scout transition class when I was a webelos leader! One thing I've seen in my area is that a lot of packs and troops don't think very creatively about opportunities to get the webelos and boy scouts together and interacting on any kind of regular basis. There are some troops that seem to have a once-a-year (whether you need it or not) kind of mentality toward the idea that they should invite webelos to their events. And there are WDLs who seem to think going to the annual troop open house is all they should do too. Neither side really gets to know each ot

Beth you asked about "keepting the boys interested in the less exciting subjects/activities" What NOT to do... The first, and worst, den meeting I EVER ran was a local history walking tour of our town for the Bear book (requirement 4 I think). I did all this research, set up a great 1/2 hour walk, Parents loved it, the boys absolutely hated every minute of it. And they didn't learn much either. What worked much better... Thank goodness they gave me a second chance. From then on almost everything we did had to meet the "fun with a purpose" test. The citizenship badge for web

Welcome Beth! Not sure what age group you've got? Things that worked great w/ wolves wouldn't fly w/ some webelos. A couple thoughts from my experiences as a cub leader: 1. Crafts - Nature-related crafts or wood crafts that included tools, painting/staining, and gloppy stuff were bigger hits with the boys than most pre-packaged kits with lots of steps/small parts. Some boys hate doing crafts though so be careful not to over-do it, and try to include things they might not think of as "crafty". Tying these in to the program isn't so hard: **Wolf book - requirement 5 (t