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Posts posted by ASM915

  1. Merlyn,

    It sounds like Mr. Speckhardt comes across a little bigotted in one of his later paragraphs, "Mormons, Buddhists, Hindus and Jews". It might have been a little nicer to state the Mormon, Buddhist, Hindu and Jewish religions".


    It will be interesting to see what Obama does with this request. Will he upset the applecart of the largest youth organization in the U.S., especially being the good Christian that he is.

  2. Gern,

    I typed out a post last night, lost it, but it was to late to retype.

    Now Ed, Pack, and OGE have beat me to the punch.


    I must have missed where PETA applied for status as a religious entity. I don't remember PETA and religion being tied together, or us making fun of religion earlier in this post. Maybe it's the Midheimers setting in. We could always change the name of PETA to the "Preposterously Extreme Theological Association". At least we wouldn't have to worry about animal sacrifices, except for us Homo Sapiens if Pack's friends are around.


    I didn't notice any real malicious overboard ridicule like "through the PETA people in with the lovely tigers and lions and see how they all get along." Now that would have been malicious and possibly taken as a threat.


    Now I'm going to look into some of the Bush and Obama bashing threads on the forum, and see if you have posted simular feeling in those posts.


    Gern, by the way, I hear the Governor of New York is looking for someone to add to his administration. the job classification is to go after the comedy shows on the tele, especially SNL, after their little jab at him. Might be a good job for you. (smiley face).


    By the way, did you all hear, it's sooooo coooold in the midwest, that the bubmles bees are wearing yellow jackets?


    Oh no!!! Pack!!! Help!!!Here comes a couple of cars with South Carolina plates on them. Oh yeah, I''l be safe. I forgot they don't know how to drive on snow, and just maybe, they will freeze before they manage to reach me.


    Everyone stay warm this weekend. Lucky for us, we have Klondike this weekend. Oh Boy! I bet the scouts will be doing impressions of Klondike Bars before it's over.

  3. Gern,

    Not a law, but campstaff skits???

    Anyway, Pack, some of the others, and I like belonging to PETA (People Eating Tasty Animals). Just because it has the same acronym as the other, doesn't mean we are making fun of them,. Well maybe. Heck, definitely, but all in jest. I wonder how Langley feels about CIA (Central Insurance Agency), CIA (Culinary Institue of America), etc. I'm sure they privately behind the backs of the others, make fun in jest.


    I'll take a peek into some of the other Bush/Obama bashing, and other making fun of threads to see if the same question has been posted there.


    Let those without sin (earth based, Christain, Jewish Muslim, etc) cast the first stone. I'm now ducking for cover from those first cast stones now.

  4. PETA strikes again. This morning, on the way home from work, NPR had an item about Old George, the 20+ lb lobster in the NYC restaurant. The owners allowed PETA to return Old George to the sea, because he was somewhere between 100-150 years old.


    Pack, we missed some nice aged lobstah that could have fed you, Gonzo myeslf and the families for a nice dinner.

  5. Pack,

    Gonzo temporarily moved to St Louis last winter, but he's back in Gainesville again. At least I won't have to take the long route to HHI next September.


    As for some of my former A&P pets, they were anesthtized, but alive, to practice procedures. I guess that was a little more humane then the gas chambers.


    Lisa, BOO!!!

  6. shortridge,

    Is 32 by 32 the traditional BSA dimensions? I thought I read somewhere that neckers from Europe, as well as other countries were larger, 40 by 40 maybe. This would definitely make them more useful.

  7. Pack,

    Sooooo, do you have a trap door in the living room floor just in front of the Lazy Boy recliner? I'll have to remember to submit the cost of the lobstahs for dinner. Oops, I mean experiments. Is your buddy still at the university? Maybe I'll stop in next September for a seafood dinner on my way to see Gonzo, and then to HHI. Then again, if you have a Vet Med program, you could always put in a proposal for an experiment involving woking the dog or cat, and see how far it gets before they realize it's not a typo.


    Yep, sure do remember the frogs, cats, dogs, along with some other assorted parts back in the 70's for A&P, and for some of the clinical labs. Gives you a real love for your pets, and sympathy for the unfortunate anesthetized pound pups and kits we used, so we could learn how to save lives. Every once and awhile I come across my old dissection kit in the drawer, and start eyeing the four frolicking felines running around our house. (JUST KIDDING!!)


    I wonder if the PETA people have DNR tattooed on their chest. I'm sure they wouldn't want us working on them if they knew what we did to their furry critters. That's one way to weed them out of the gene pool.


    Speaking of 7 degrees of separation. SWMBO went to school with Dahmer's first. Then again, living in NE Ohio, it's not hard to find a tie to some nationally known infamous loony. Damned Seasonal Affective Disorder.

  8. If the EBOR is 3-6 months after the 18th birthday, the scout needs to appeal to National?


    My oldest turned in his packet the night before his 18th birthday, Nov. 6th, missing the deadline for the Nov. EBOR day. The next EBOR day was in late February, falling in the 3-6 month zone. We never were informed that we had to appeal to National for an EBOR. He had his EBOR without incident. I wonder if the DAC contacted National about why the EBOR was held after 3 months, instead of making us appeal? If so, I guess our district is blessed.

  9. Our troop has always had the candidate give a SAE using our CC's address to the people that the scout chose to write the letters. The letters are sent to the CC. If a letter has not showed, then the CC is able to inform the scout to check into it. This way it takes the guessing game out of whether Council has received the letters or not.


    3 hours? Sound like they wanted to drill him a little over something, or really wanted to hear and discuss this young mans views and perceptions on the scouting program. Our district's EBORs are usually an hour, occasionally an hour and a half.


    If your district is like ours, they have set dates for EBOR's every three months. There is a deadline, usually four weeks ahead. This gives the DAC time to gather everything that is needed and make copies. Two weeks before the EBOR, anyone sitting on an EBOR receives a packet for the EBORs that they will participating in, to give them a chance to look everything over. The four week deadline also gives the DAC an idea how many EBORs he is going to have to run that day, how many people he will need, etc. On occassion, the DAC will convene a EBOR at another time for special circumstances, such as college students home on break like your son.


    Good luck to Matt. Tell him to keep an open mind, and be ready with some witty comebacks to break the ice, if the occassions arise.

  10. Our Council is charging $1500 at this point. Both the troops are filled, and we were just allotted a third troop. For 2005, our Council presold tents and equipment to troops to help recoop some of the costs. I haven't heard what their plans are for 2010. Our scouts are already set up on a payment plan and are already making installments.


    As for fundraising, the Council has come out with a set of six patches just for Jambo. The Scouts can purchase two sets at half price. Adults pay full price foe a set, around $36, or $100 for a framed commemorative set. I hope they plan some other fundraisers, and don't just put all their eggs in one basket with a bunch of patches.


    My son has covered his costs with Xmas and birthday money, as well as wages from working camp staff so far. I hope he keeps it up. I plan on applying for staff, which is $795 before incidentals.

  11. 540,

    What Eagle92 meant to say was that his Lodge has instituted a First Year Arrowman Award where the new Ordeal member can earn a special First Year patch that only first year members can earn if they are active, and attending Lodge functions. Check out Croatan Lodge's website. The First Year Arrowman Award is actually pretty easy to earn, if they are willing.


    92, I'm formulating a plan to present to our Lodge leadership that will take (alright, steal) a lot of your ideas. I've already planted the seed in our chapter leadership about post-Ordeal chapter meetings this coming year. I haven't dropped the idea of a FYA award yet. I'll plant that one a little later. We have started getting them excited about planning Chapter outings. Last week before Xmas, we took 5 of them to an indoor climbing facility for a couple of hours. Back in Oct. they did a service project followed by a quick reward of lunch and swimming in the afternoon.


    I'm hoping the chapter guys will pick up on the hints and ideas, come up with some of the activities for the above ideas on their own,and then get the balls to approach the LEC. We have a young chapter age wise (actives that is), and they are still a little intimidated by the older guys yet.


    LEC moved our Fall Fellowship back a week next fall to coincide with our Council first fall Good Turn Weekend. This would make the Lodge visible in camp doing projects in the morning, having fun in the afternoon, and holding a Lodge meeting/social and elections in the evening. The Lodge hopes that by doing this, that they will get more Arrowmen to come to the meeting/social, and have more Arrowmen present to vote on officers.


    Our Lodge has it a little hard in that they have to compete for bodies against our Council's freestanding Camp Honors program, which is more then 80 years old, and draws troops for over 25 states, Canada, and a few from Europe countries to our summer camp program. The CHP uses around 200-250 participants per Friday night to make the program work. Once a youth or adult receives their 5th year CHP award, they can become participants in the Friday night festivities, which last to the wee hours of the morning (3-4:00AM). The comradery is just as tight in Pipestone as it is in OA. It's hard when you have two great honors programs running throughout the summer, to be able to divide your time between them.

  12. Beavah,

    30 minute rule applying to Jambo? I thought each sub-camp had a MASH type setup with an MD an RN and a couple of orderlies, and that there was a medical facility on site to treat more critical issues until the person was medivaced out. If so, then the 30 minute rule is a moot point.


    A 4 mile hike, or what ever the distance at Jambo is, doesn't sound like a HA activity to me, unless we're in the Sahara, Amazon or Antarctica.


  13. This topic is also being on one of our other scouting forums. In that forum, it has come out that the rescuer was intoxicated, thus questionably doing more harm. Supposedly, that is why Cali Supreme Court is allowing the trial to go forward. So the rule of the day is IF YOU HAVE HAD A FEW BEFORE WONDER OUT, AND WHILE IN AN IMPAIRED STATE ATTEMPT A RESCUE CAUSING MORE HARM, THEN THERE IS A GOOD CHANCE THAT THE GOOD SAMARITAN LAWS WILL NOT COVER YOU. It has nothing to do with a sober rescuer using good judgement.


    Does anyone out there have access to the actual case information who can verify this?


    As also stated on the other site, this also protects us from poorly trained wouldbe (want-a-be) first aid providers and rescuers. And yes, the implication was there about us, BSA, and how most just push the requirements through with now real follow up to make sure the kids realy umderstand and know how to do things correctly, like back in the 70's when we had to do it. My First Aid MD was a ARC taught FA and AFA program, group setting, all scouts. We then went back and used that to reach the skills for TF-FC.

  14. My apologies to the ladies on the forum. My post should have started out "Ladies and ....."


    Scoutldr, bring out the rack!!! Or can we just get by in them old platform shoes from the 70's.


    Vicki, have a girdle I can borrow to get rid of the pop gut? By the way, good idea on the insurance cards. I know I copy our information on the back of the physicals for myself and my sons when we head out somewhere. makes things a lot easier.

  15. Gentlemen, Gentlemen, Gentlemen,

    BW is probably closer to interpreting the passage correctly then the rest. I all know that we are all getting older, and the the alzheimer's is slowly setting in, but do we remember a few months ago National came out with a policy that any unit traveling to Philmont (? other HA locations) needed someone trained in Wilderness First Aid?




    Sound familiar?


    Nationals wording is bad. Now I'm not a telepath, (don't tell my kids that) but I bet "By" should have been "FROM" in the statement "...Emergency evacuation is more then 30 minutes BY (replace with FROM) ground transportation...", which coincides with a wilderness medical emergency.


    1) Most camps are at least 30 minutes to the nearest ED.

    2) Most camps (which have easy access) are in rural areas with volunteer EMS systems. Your looking at 10 minutes just to get the rig on the road, then how ever long it takes to get to camp. It's 10-15 minutes just to get EMS to our camp. It's then 35-45 minutes to the closest ED, and that is with a private EMS company 10 minutes away.

    3) Most camps with exception of some out west, have roads that make access within 30 minutes not an issues, whether it be trained EMS camp staff, or Muni EMS's.


    What it boils down to is that National does not want people trying to carry us big ones out more then 30 minutes to the EMS unit, and medically jeopardizing the litter bearers. But then again, a 71" 300lb'er isn't any easier then a 60" 300lb'er to lug around, other then you'll have more room on the sides for extra hands to grab onto the litter. Either way, one will be hanging out over the side rails and the other off of both ends of the litter.

    Just think about how you would handle a Northern Tier situation?


    As for me, I need to come down 20 lb's just to get started.


    BW, the boat all depends on how fast the USCG can get there, yes?


    Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah to everyone and Solstice to Trev.

  16. Good Samaritan Laws depend on the state. If your are a medical person, and bypass an accident scene in some states, you can be effectively sued for not stopping and rendering aid.


    As for cars exploding, not!! But they do burn nice. Case in point. Just a few weeks ago in our county, a Life Flight pilot and his fiancee came across a single vehicle accident with a partial entrapment, and burning. By the time the pilot managed to remove the victim from the car, the victim sustained 4th degree burns and will lose both lower extremities. The victim is alive for now.


    I guess in California, We wait until the car blows, and then treat once the victim has been thrown clear. Someone needs to talk with Arnold. Anyone out there know him?


    Medical lawsuits are funny things.


    While tending to an trauma victim while working EMS, if I remove clothing, a bra or other undies on a female victim, which is protocol, (strip them naked so you don't miss injuries, male and female) without cutting them off, I open myself up for an unwinnable suit. I automatically loose if it is a woman.


    While removing a man from an upper floor of a burning building. I am allowed to ride him down the ladder using my thigh and knee between his legs. Guess what happens if I do the same with a woman? You guessed it, if I'm sued, I automatically loss. I'm suppose to throw her over my shoulder and take a chance of loosing my balance climbing down the ladder just so my knee is not in her crotch.


    True story. Two firefighters are sent to a second floor apartment in the back of a second story structure fire to tend to a chest pain victim. On the way across the building, the medic goes through the floor. The EMT stops to get the medic help and tend to the medic. The medic is severely injured with spinal and other injuries. The EMT is sued by the chest pain victim for delay of care and abandonment because he stopped to aid the medic. The medic was sued for delay of care. The case was won because the EMT or medic supposedly made sure the scene was safe.

  17. OGO,

    For a pre-District BOR, at the troop review, definitely. At the District level, it depends on how the DAC runs things.

    At our DEBOR's, the board is made up of three District people, and two troop committee members selceted by the candidate. The SM introduces the Scout and parents to the board. The board then sends everyone to another room except the SM. They first talks with the SM. Then they bring in the parents and talk with them. Finally they bring the scout in and the EBOR is on. My oldest asked our COR to represent him on the DEBOR, but then again, we had a very active COR, campouts and all.

  18. KS,

    As Beavah stated, he can earn his Eagle as a Venture Crew member.


    I think that your son should go forward with the SMC, though. Work with him on how to handle questions that may be purposefully pointed to rile him. Work with him on staying calm and cool, and not blowing his lid. If the SM tries this tactic, just have your son ask the following question as the answer; "No disrespect meant sir, but is not a scout suppose to be helpful, friendly, courteous and kind? If so, how is this question relevant?" If the questions are open ended, have him steer the answer toward his achievements. Tell him to answer honestly, but be diplomatic at the same times. Have him express some of his concerns about the troop, and what he feels may help.


    My oldest had a few off the wall questions thrown at him at his DEBOR relating to his Native hertiage to see how he responded. One was how he felt about Natives running casinos, and if that was "Morally Straight"? Luckily, he has always had a quick wit about him, and answered "We took our lead from the Whiteman".


    If asked what he will do after achieving Eagle, inform the SM that he feels a Crew will be a better fit for him in the future. Have your son make an offer to the SM during the conference, asking the SM what your son may be able to do to help the SM with the troop? Maybe the SM will finally see a new and interested scout, not the old one, and finally except your son.


    If your son stays and has his ECOH with the troop, he will have a few minutes to talk and thank people who helped him on his road to Eagle. Have him discuss how he overcame some of his obstacles, being ADHD. Have him make light of some of his challenges, he was camp staffer. They know how to find the humor in things and make fun of themselves and others. If the other scouts see that he can do it, it may give them incentive to continue toward their goal.(This message has been edited by ASM915)

  19. Mike,

    Thank you for your thoughts. That was why I had brought the discussion up a couple of months before the election last winter. All we did was ask the old and new Chapter Chiefs to talk with the boys about popularity contests, which they did, and it worked out nice for the Chapter.


    The scout in question, was called out at the Spring Camporee. He completed his Ordeal at the Spring Ordeal. Everyone who knows him from campstaff, were pleasantly surprised that he managed to control himself through the Ordeal and managed to stay quiet the whole time.


    He helped as a trail guide during the summer call-outs at camp, help with Fall Ordeal, went to Fall Fellowship, hasn't missed a Chapter or LEC meeting, has been elected Chapter VC of Activities, helped put together a service project and swim party, and now a Xmas climbing party with a little assistance. He's planning on Conclave and NOAC this coming year. He's also eyeing the Chapter Chief spot, or the LEC for next year.

  20. I've been planning on getting the book, just haven't around to it yet.


    Our boys were lucky. We had them out camping and playing in the woods from the time they could crawl. We would camp as much as possible from late April until late October, during mid-week when possible.


    The non-summer months, especially mid-week, were best. Very few people around the campgrounds. The boys had the run of the grounds and the woods surrounding the site. SWMBO and I would sit back, relax and just keep a distant eye on what they were doing, with very lttle interference. Occassionally, we would have deer walk right through the middle of our site during midday, feet away from us as we ate lunch.


    Unfortunately, the town we live in, about 5000, didn't have a lot of woods excessible to play in. More farmland then woodlands. Typical Ohio.


    As they grew older and ready for school, we by chance found Spring Garden (SGWS), a Waldorf school about twenty miles away. The school encouraged the children to explore nature at every turn. Parents had to dress the kids for the weather, and send an extra change to be kept at school. The children were outside every day rain, snow or shine. Our school, at it's original location, then it's final location, had fields, woods and streams for the children to explore and play in.


    My oldest hated leaving but was also ready for public high school when the time came. He would complain about SGWS's shortcomings, but lately, he has stated that he will find a way to afford to send his kids to Spring Garden Waldorf.


    Now we, SWMBO and I can't wait for grandkids to appear on the scene. When they do, we will kidnap them and run off to the woods to play, probably with their parents playing somewhere close by a few trees over.


  21. gilski,

    The Hiking MB hikes are five 10 milers and a 20 miler. The Backpacking MB treks are three 15 milers over three days, and a 30 miler over five days.

    Now depending on how many miles you hiked at Philmont, you all should have been real close to getting your 50 Miler. If you had 15 nights on the trail, they should have completed the Backpacking MB.

    After Philmont, what's an easy 10 miler?


  22. John,

    A "Watermelon Man" scenario would be interesting. But as we both stated, how to have them experience both racism and intimidation safely and effectively, without being clued in on what is happening, is the drawback.



    As Beavah stated, not everything has to be tied to advancement. If you were so inclined, and know the MBC's of the MB's that I mentioned, you could have a talk with the perspective MBC (you are the one who gives the scout the MBC names). Explain that there was an incident involving the young men (no specifics need to be mentioned), that you would appreciate their assistance, and have them inform the scouts that they, the MBC's, have a list of movies, speeches, and community organizations for the scouts wanting these MB's, to choose from. Give the MBC a list that would be appropriate to pass on to the boys. This effectively still allows the scout to make a decision on what he chooses. Maybe not the movie, organization, etc, that he may have been thinking about, but he makes the decision. This, in a round about way ends up tied to advancement, but only for the purpose of nudging the scouts toward the morally straight path. Plus, because this is not proposed to them in their sitdown with you, they will be none the wiser, just thinking it's the MBC's list.


    Punishment imposed by thyself is good. But i still think service to a NPO related to racial discrimination/intimidation, hate crimes, and or poor inner-city ethnic neighborhoods is a critical part of getting through to the boys.



    I can't answer that. I do not know. Dr Smith was at an international peace symposium when the friendship started.


    I do know that my ancestors have been tied to organizations that could be terrorist in nature, the Colonist or Torries, The Irish Orangemen and Greenmen, the Calvary or the dog soldiers, depending on which family branch is looked at. The last two examples definitely had deaths attributed to them. Both were considered terrorist by the other. Both thought that they were right, and protecting themselves and their interests.


    By the way, how's the weather and snow up there in Buffalo?

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