John-in-KC

So you are not a Vigil Honor. Most Scouters are not. Most Arrowmen are not (that has included me since sealing my membership in 1971). We give cheerful service because we care about the youth, whether we were voting members as youth ourselves, or whether we were inducted as adults. If your motive to serve is to help young people have a great and good time, learning things they can apply back in the home Council, go for it. If your motive is anything else, examine your own heart. I will let others discuss being an Adviser onsite at NOAC. I have not had that privilege, EagleSon the past two summers has been either a Camp Staffer or in his HS band. NOAC was off his scope.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

I now keep a Scouting resume on my PC, which I update once a year or so.

May I please ask when and how we completely hijacked this thread? EDIT: Answering my own question: Kudu did it. I really do hope we gave the original poster some unit level reasons to take the course. John I used to be an Owl (This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

B, Not to mention that in OUR youth, age 11 WAS the floor. Of course,it's also been 39 years and 10 months since I joined Troop 110, Reseda CA.

It would be re-created with new letters the following week. John who is utterly cycnical about most high-level federations of federations.

Another option, especially if your Chartered Partner is a church, is to find a peer parish in your destination area, and have your pastor ask in your behalf.

Oh, gad, I'm stuck in a laugh attack. As I read this, a song from Sheri Lewis popped into my mind: Wait for it! "This is the song that doesn't end... It just goes on and on my friend... Some people started singing it, Not knowing what it was, And they'll continue singing it Forever just because..." Wait for it! "This is the song that doesn't end... It just goes on and on my friend... Some people started singing it, Not knowing what it was, And they'll continue singing it Forever just because..."

I have to agree with Avid. For the young men who've achieved Eagle in my Troop, we get the ScoutNet record as the young man is approaching ELSP completion. We scrub the record, if there's a discrepancy, we cut a new advancement report. While I was the keeper of Troopmaster for us, I could say, pretty darn certainly, that I had a handle on our unit advancement! SM did the program stuff... assigning Counselors and signing blue cards to indicate his permission to start a MB. I did the admin stuff... keep the records. Pretty simple division of labor. He got the fun, I got to make sure there were no panic attacks 3 days before the EBOR.

Here's the real rub, Army initially wore a colored flag in-country. GUESS WHAT BECAME AN AIMPOINT? I kid you not, bad guys with various power scopes aimed on the flag. Rather quickly, Army in country started using a subdued green/black flag. When we send SF or Rangers in harms way, they remove everything other than US Army from their uniforms... enough so they will be legitimate combatants and not captureable/shootable a spies.

I took it about 3 years after I went active as a Troop level Scouter, and about 5 years of adult service overall (2 in Cubbing, then ...) My concern is not so much "do you understand the Scouting system" for a prospective attendee as it is "Have you had that ah, S### moment in your life where YOU were the deer in someone else's headlights? It seems to me when you've had that moment, you learn real fast how to cooperate and rely on others strengths. We had a transitional Scouter (not yet turned 21) in our Patrol. He'd not had his Ah, S### moment in life. We left him behind in the dust as we started solving problems. We weren't necessarily hierarchical "little democracy," our Patrol dynamic was more "collaborative to each other strengths, compensate to each others weaknesses." He just didn't understand that. He completed the coursework, but never finished his ticket.

Yippeee!!! I get to Sing!!! I Used to be an OWL (Hoot, Hoot)... And a Good Old OWL Too (Hoot, Hoot)... But Now I've finished OWLing and I Don't Know What To Do! I'm Growing Old and Feeble AND I CAN OWL NO MORE!!! So I'm going to work my Ticket if I can! Back to Gilwell, Happy Land!, I'm going to work my Ticket if I can! John Owls, C-40-05

reprise... Here we sit like Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Here we sit like Birds in the Wilderness Waiting for the Eagle Patrol... Waiting for the Eagle Patrol... Waiting for the Eagle Patrol... Here we sit like Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Waiting for the Eagle Patrol!!!!!!!!!!

I've said this before and I will say it again: The program has also been restructured so the trail to Eagle, while still having all the requirements, has them in a more measured way. When I was a youth member (1968-73 or so)... 1 Eagle Required MB to Star, 5 total 5 Eagle Required MBs to Life, 10 total. 11 Eagle Required MBs to Eagle, 21 total. A Scout becoming Life was looking at an uphill trail to Eagle. Now, if a Scout doesn't double dip the "Pick a badge" categories... 4 Eagle Required MB to Star, 6 total 7 Eagle Required MB to Life, 11 total 12 Eagle Required MB to Eagle, 21 total ... a Scout is "over the hump" on both his Eagle Required MBs and his total count when he arrives at Life. That, to me, is a good thing.

I was a Cub from 8-11, took a couple months off (had to find a Troop), then was a Boy Scout or Explorer from 11-17. Earned Life, entered OA, backpacked 3 different trails. All this during Viet Nam and the meltdown of the late 60s/early 70s, when the older half of my "life group" (boomers) were taking American society to Hell (and we've not come back imnsho). Granted, Dad had been in the Army, and I shared his campfire tales, but nights in the field in Scouting were part of what propelled me into ROTC and then into the Army. Fast forward to my son being 8, and it's time to re-join the movement. Now, mine is not unique, but it's my story: When my bride decided I was surplus to needs, and also decided to attack on custody, a good port in the storm was to go active as a volunteer in Scouting. I've not looked back. Great people, good times, chances to serve, chances to share. Adult Association is a method which works for Scouters too!! Does that give you the feedback you needed Lisa?

A Little Backstory please? Specifically, why is the Committee talking with him, and not the Scoutmaster? What is your registered position? Have the CC and SM shared this with your Chartered Organization Representative yet? What about your Unit Commissioner? WHERE IS THE SCOUTMASTER IN ALL THIS? The young man's parents? If I would offer one piece of advice at this moment, it is (Shouting)...MASTE HASTE SLOWLY AND VERY DELIBERATELY! If you're looking for a validation of "Hang him from the highest yardarm," you will not get it from me. YIS

B, THANKS!! Will check it out! John

I don't know your position in the adult structure, but I submit: - You will have the leadership psych tools to help guide a PLC through its annual planning, coordination, and close planning processes. - You will have a better network of Scouter resources to bring to bear to assist your young men. - You will have intense and in-depth review of the 3 Aims and 8 Methods of Scouting, along with determining means of applying them to your youth. - You will have to design and execute projects (to include internal controls) which will benefit yourself, your Troop, and the Scouting community you serve. All of those to me are external benefits. Per your request, I won't discuss the internal benefits. YIS John

B, At the time of some bad things in my life, I rearranged my estate planning: I've got a living trust and an irrevocable death trust; as part of settling affairs, the death trust will pay out a one-time tithe to one church's evangelical body, and another one-time tithe to the Council endowment. EagleSon has accepted his admission to a particular university, and I'm probably a year out from re-visiting the estate plan again. I see the logic of what you are discussing, and it makes a lot of sense. Is there a website which discusses community foundations in more detail, and might have links to same? TIA/YIS, John

In general, I also agree with Beavah, FScouter, and ScoutingAgain, but I also submit: The adult who is watching over the Eagle Candidate needs to be listening for these kinds of "administrivia" minefields. He needs to help the young men determine if a project is worth continuing to develop! There are lessons to be learned in a project which doesn't get to the point of host approvals and presentation to the District Advancement Committee.

EagleSon entered a Troop which was in its 2d year. All the 1st year youth came from two dens 1 full year cycle ahead. There were NO older youth to assist in guiding the younger youth. Whilst boy-run, this Troop became to me an example (at least for a while) of boy run roughshod. To make matters worse, when that first group turned 14, the founding SM grabbed them all and formed a Venturing Crew. My conclusions: - Web II families, indeed, need orientation that a Boy Scout Troop is not a Web III den! - Troops starting up need to find start-up leadership. Two patrols of Tenderfeet (or by the time we joined, arriving First Class) are not ready to make the mature decisions a proper PLC needs. - You do not gut a Troop by taking away a year group of boys, no matter how cohesive they are. As a Scouter, and a founder of a new unit, you owe loyalty to the unit you created.

We're completely out of Wood Badge Order!!!!

A comment as to how the US Army currently wears the flag on the Army Combat Uniform: Our immediate past Chief of Staff, General Peter Schoomaker, made a decision shortly after we entered the current little fracas in Iraq. Your US Army was to be an expeditionary Army, travelling to harms way. The stripes of the Flag follow the field of the stars when the Flag is in motion, and at that time the field goes to the right hand side, when looking at the right hand sleeve of a garment. So, General Schoomaker went to Mr Rumsfeld and Mr Bush, the National Command Authority, and asked permission to change the Flag patch as worn by the US Army. It does not meet US Flag Code. I do not remember whether the Army got an Executive Order or a Letter of Instruction from the Commander-in-Chief, but we got our permission.

CA, Simply put, because those decisions belong to two people: - Executive Officer of the Chartered Partner - Chartered Organization Representative NOT the SM, NOT the CC, NOT the Committee, NOT the ASMs, and NOT the parents. The Chartered Partner owns the unit. It should have decided to license Scouting because its values agree with Scoutings'. I want to think the Chartered Partner will do the right thing. At the same time, our society is litigous. As we've seen in recent years, "truth is always a valid defense" doesn't always work anymore. The right thing is to let those responsible for making the call DO SO. The rest of us need to BUTT OUT. Our job is to serve the youth, let those who are charged with leader selection and approval do their jobs. Do I have a value judgment in this situation: YES. I've said it elsewhere. DO I get to make this decision? NO.

Comments: 1) There is more than one way for a SM to monitor performance of a Den Chief. It does require a SM to make a phone call or two, or to drop in on a den meeting or two. Novel concept, mentoring out where the action is. 2) Further, as I've stated, what I see many good Troops who deploy Den Chiefs do is detail an ASM to be their "high cover." He's also the guy who goes to packs and listens for requirements, as well as shares service and camping opportunities. 3) If the Den Chief is doing his position at all well, he is, in fact, busier than he ever was in the Troop. Fred, I'm just venting off of your post! I know you know all the above

Here we sit like Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Here we sit like Birds in the Wilderness Waiting for the Eagle Patrol... Waiting for the Eagle Patrol... Waiting for the Eagle Patrol... Here we sit like Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Birds in the Wilderness Waiting for the Eagle Patrol!!!!!!!!!!