IM_Kathy

thank you all for your views. in relooking through the rest of the requirements that he did not do for me... they were rank level work of the very basic rescues which he's had signed off and in witnessing the tougher rescues I know he knows what he's doing... the rest that are left are discussion parts which I will sit down with him at a meeting and go over them with him again - since he's done them before it should be a quick review for him. again I thank you all... and I asked for this specific case since it was a right now, but I also wanted to know in case it were to ever happen to my son or another scout. And I agree that with this merit badge it is more important to verify everything 1) it's eagle required and 2) it is such an important thing to know and to do correctly

the only time I've seen this was due to "postponed due to weather" incident... the webelos were suppose to go camping with the boy scouts and couple weeks later have their crossover and AOL ceremony, but we had a terrible ice storm and the campground was closed down so the BSA troop had to postpone their campout. The crossover/AOL ceremony was already scheduled and booked. The boys did their ceremony, but did not recieve their badge until after completing the campout. some of these boys may already be 11... from when my son was a webelos II all but 1 boy had turned 11 by the the winter.

the bare facts... 3 boys took lifesaving MB at summer camp and all missed the same part of their class. 2 boys were able to attend swim day last year and finished up their MB's that day. the other boy was able to attend swim day last month and I worked him through the skills that he had marked down from previous year that he needed to do. He was to bring his blue card to next meeting and I'd sign those off and he'd be finished. He can't find his blue card. I was not at that summer camp to witness in person him completing other parts, but other leaders were and the other 2 boys said he did all the stuff with them. so, is "a scout is honest" enough or does he have to redo all those other tasks? I know this boy and the other 2 and am completely positive that he did do them, but I'm not sure what "policy" is. I have told him to look, and relook, and repeat, to try and find his blue card. Hopefully he finds it and this is a dead issue. thanks in advance.

our pack's B&G (and our Girl Scout family potluck) is kept at about 2 hours (2 1/2 for those helping with setup) welcome, flags, prayer, eat... awards, skits/songs, final announcements (which includes where the chairs and tables go and that if any thing is left at the end it will be donated to the church kitchen we're using - and that's only because someone will forget to bring a serving spoon and we have to borrow one of the churches) and closing flags the most difficult part of the setup and tear down is that the stage there is one that you have to put up and take down after and they are quite heavy.

you can buy blank cards and envelopes for them at any Walmart or computer/business store... just use a graphics program or word program that allows images and layout your design. I'd recommend printing on regular paper first just to make sure you do it right to get inside and outside done right. oh, and our walmarts here have them for sale in the school supply section with all the different types of paper rather than back with the electronics.

roguedawg: I can see my son doing the same with the dutch oven and hiking it in. My son and 3 other boys started with one troop that never used camp stoves so got so use to using the dutch ovens. the troop they switched to used camp stoves most of the time - our boys came in handy on 1 trip when they forgot to pack the pipe you hook onto the propane tank.. they quickly adjusted all the meals they were planning so they could all be cooked over fire. was a nice lesson for a couple of younger boys who were along and had only used the stoves. my son loves to volunteer to be the cook because he knows he knows how to cook - he worries whenever a "new cook" takes the job. but I have to say I don't think I've ever seen any of our patrols destroy a meal. I have sat there and thought oh my god I wonder how that's going to taste - but they all seem to turn out.

my GS troop is made up of 9th graders in Senior level of GS... they chose not to do the journey that was available this year for them - to them it seemed to much like some of the work they are doing for their gold award and didn't want to divert too much of their time for it. as SUM our unit is very mixed - the new daisy's are doing it very well. Our 1st graders already moved up to brownie's but chose to wait to start journey's until next year. With the uncertainity whether the journey's will eventually be required to bronze, silver, gold I recommend that the troops below cadettes to definetly do the journey's and get use to them. Now were just waiting to see what national does when they go through all the other badge books in a couple of years

I love it!!! I'll remember it if we ever come to a time when we need this. so far the troop rules have done well... any food not eaten by a patrol may be shared to other patrols as long as they've eaten already with their own patrol. The nice thing with this is gets the younger boys a chance to try something new and ask questions about how it was made. My sons favorite meal he learned from the adults patrol meal - he even asks to make it at home and refused to us a real oven, has to use the dutch oven.

we have elections in Dec with take over in Jan and then in Jun with take over in Jul. we do have time between election and take over due to 1 year with terrible weather that ended up delaying elections. one reason why 6 month periods work best is for those that are in sports to still be involved. typically they are either more involved in football in the fall or baseball in the spring/summer. for those in band instead the fall is their busiest time. for established patrols they already know the make up of their patrol and what needs done and what doesn't. the new patrol(s) they don't, but since they are helped so much by their guides it's ok to have a PL that is clueless because they all are at that time unless their webelos den did a good job with using the denner position.

by the time my den ended it's 2 years of webelos I had 2 of my scouts earn the super achiever (our patch was the first on linked by mcdurmll) for Forester and Naturalist we have a near by wildlife refuge that offered programs that the boys did. For Geologist a nearby county conservation group offered a program that my boys attended. One of the dads was an engineer and he came in and worked with the boys for that, and the building the bridge is still my sons favorite memory. For the Artist my step-mom is an art teacher and she came during one of our summer meetings and worked with the boys on it. Readyman we did with another den and another den from another pack - they had a first aid/cpr instructor who had everything and worked with the boys... also can contact your local fire department. We met once a month during the summers (after Bear and between Web I & II) for a couple of hours to do the "good weather" pins. Then during the school year we met twice a month. The "required" pins for Webelos Badge and for Arrow of Light were the only ones I would offer makeup days for - the rest they had to be there for or make up at home and document their work. Otherwise the only one they did at home was Family Member.

I was raised Catholic, my husband wasn't raised with any formal religion... neither of us belong to a church. Because of this my son does not have a church to work on a Religious Medal/Knot... but that does not mean that he cannot complete the "religious" portions of the rank advancements... we sat down and discussed what we each believed and why and he talked about what he understood and didn't and what he believed. Like you I've seen a lot of junk in my life and it makes it very hard to find a "religion" that fits in what I can believe in... but, that does not mean I don't have some belief in a higher power. I once read a great definition that explains the difference in Religion and Spirtuality... "Spirtuality is the built in relationship we have with a power greater than ourselves... Religion is the translation of that belief with prayers and creeds"

is it just me or does it seem like some of the POR are so much easier than others? I wish they weighted them so that those that are "tougher" were given more credit for the work they do. For our troop the Librian, Historian, and Scribe are some of the positions that boys just can't wait to do because they really don't have to do much. SPL is of course one of the toughest jobs seen by the boys in the troop, but I have to say that a good DC does a whole lot more especially when you take into account that the boy attends his regular troop meetings, the den meetings, troop outtings, and pack events. I'm quite thankful that my son (DC) doesn't have a job yet to try and squeaze into his schedule, but since he's not a DC for a den his parents lead (that's often the case around here) I sure wish he was old enough to drive himself LOL anyway, I just wanted to hear others thoughts on this. Is there a way to make sure boys aren't always going for the "easy POR"? Is there a way to make those POR more indepth so they aren't so "easy"?

our troop supplies POR patches and cords for the boy to use while in that position and then they return them when their time is up. If the boy wants his own for keepsake purposes and what not then the boy (or parent) makes the purchase. the pack my son is a DC for has only had 1 DC before this year in all the years that we've been involved with them (this was his old pack) and this year they have 2. They did not do any form of cermony for the boys to start, but I believe the CM is going to do something for the boys when/if they earn the DC Service Award

yes, that answered my questions and yes that is where I got confussed with the crew/patrol term. So what I was wanting to do I can't do in that I didn't want to pull any of the boys away from what they are doing - I just wanted to find a way for my girls to do both because being such a small troop does limit them a lot. thanks again.

I'm trying to understand the whole Venturing program deal... 1) are they totally seperate from a BSA troop? 2) can the be involved with a troop and be a seperate Patrol? 3) can a boy or girl be dually registered? In otherwords can a boy be in the Venturing Program and still be in Boy Scouts to continue his rank work there? Or should it only be for boys who have already earned their Eagle? and for the girls - can they still be registered with Girl Scouts thereby continuing to work on their badges and pins there? The reason for my question is this... my son's (13 years old) troop has several boys that have earned their eagle and are still involved, but not as much as they use to be. I'm just a committe member with his troop. For my daughter (15 years old) is in girl scouts - her troop has only 4 girls (3 come summer when 1 moves away). I'm just wondering if it's possible to make a "venture patrol" which would allow the girls to join in and allow for some special trips for the older boys. I do have to say the troop does do a good job in that they have a high adventure trip at least every other year. anyway, like I said I'm trying to understand all this and would like to know the answer to these questions so I would know how I should think this through. Oh, and as to joining an already active crew - there are none around that I know of. thanks in advance

racing and tourney depends on the track you have... our packs track when my son started did not have a timer so it was done by double elimination. by the end of my son's time in cubs the pack had a new track with a timer - each scout got to race on each lane and the times were averaged for winners. as for car judging it was also done a couple of different ways while my son was in cubs... a few years they had themes (patriotic, space, scouts, funny, colorful, etc...) the boys made their cars to fit one of those catagories and then they were judged. the other few years instead of catagories they went by levels - knowing that a tigers car is often built mostly by the parent and the webelos car was made mostly by the boy they were able to be judged by the work done by the boys.

some useful glove tips... when setting up tents I just put on my batting gloves from softball - they aren't the warmest, but they're better than nothing and allow me to use my hands to grip when cooking I wear a pair of those cheap ol' stretchy gloves that are about a buck and then I put over them a pair of first aid rubber gloves... this allows me to do any cutting, washing, etc and still be warm and keep my hands dry. my son also uses these and says it helps a lot - even seen a few of the other boys do the same now as well. I use to work as a full service gas attendent until just recently and so had to keep warm yet keep my hands usable so I've learned all kinds of tricks along the way.

I recalled something tonight at our committee meeting when our outdoor chair asked our equipment chair about purchasing another turkey boiler.... check to find out if where you are camping has frost free pumps... if not then make sure when you set up camp that you fill up your pots with water so that you can cook up the water and get it unfrozen - or even keep it running on low all night. Nothing worse than all your water being frozen in your water jugs! our troop has 1 big turkey boiler that we use for that sort of thing, but our troop is getting large enough that we really need 2 - thankfully we'll get another 1 before our campout in a couple of weeks because there we don't have frost free spicket

if having babysitting is a necessity I would suggest more babysitters and older. Have you considered contacting one of the older girl scout troops? I have a group of 9th grade girl scouts and they are always looking for fundraising opportunities and setting up a donation jar would be something I'm sure would bring them in a bit each month to help with their campouts and trips and with them doing it as a fundraiser would include an adult or two in attendance as well. The older girls have learned it is better to come preparred with games and other activities rather than just sitting back and watching chaos! if it's not a necessity then I'd say put an end to it because with what you say is going on you're just asking for trouble - either child getting injured or damange to the building that could result in losing your charter

CalicoPenn - you are correct that most of what is listed in our troop handbook is listed in one BSA lititure or another, but how many families in your troop have all those in their possession. Having all of those listed in one location for the scouts and their parents/guardians is handy because they don't have to run around and look here and there and this book and that. The handbook is sent out as a PDF file and is updated every 6 months - though the only changes made are the roster, leadership, and tentative schedule - and the tentative schedule is really just dates for meetings and campouts as for the "redundent" our roster lists boys (alphabetical order) with their contact info and parent/guardian info... patrol breaks down patrol name with just the boys in it listed... youth leadership & adult leadership lists position and name of person or people in that position. while it may be seem redundent - it is broken down this way so that leadership positions and patrol pages can easily be changed twice a year when there are changes made. in our troop the boys are the ones that need the MBC sheet... they look up what badge they are wanting to work on contact that councilor to make sure the councilor is free to work on it at that time (some MBC do have times when they are too swamped with other stuff that they need to wait a couple of months before starting that MB) and then the boy goes to the SM for approval to begin work as to the maps - very handy to have already in boys and parents possession... our summer camp has a parents night where the parents come 1 of the nights and has a meal with their scout and the rest of the families. It's also done the night of tap-out for OA. So, troop already knows that each adult has a map to camp and a map of grounds to find the campsite for when they arrive they just check in and go to that site. like I said at the beginning... yes, much of the items are in some book or publication from BSA, but the handbook is handy because the boys and parent/guardian can have it all in one place. whether you like it as it is or not doesn't really matter - it's what our troop likes... the original post was asking what should be included and so I posted what is in ours - simple as that.

we have a "Troop Handbook" just to show you what it contains here is the contents list... TABLE OF CONTENTS Current Roster Patrols Youth Leaders Adult Leadership Tentative Schedule Troop Meetings Methods of Scouting Youth Protection and Adult Leadership Rules and Policies Fundraising Treasurers Policy Prohibited Activities Rank Advancement Merit Badges and Merit Badge Counselors Merit Badge List Troop Sponsored Camping Trips Personal Camping Equipment Summer Camp Map to Summer Camp Scout Camp Site Map Classification of Swimming Ability APPENDICES Merit Badge Counselor Application Personal Health and Medical Record (Class 1 and 2) Eagle Rank Requirements Eagle Rank Application Form Eagle Scout Service Project Workbook Eagle Scout Reference Letter Troop Scout Position/Descriptions National Scout Jamboree High Adventure Camping

our troop the guides and patrol leaders help teach the skills and work with the scout until they have it down... then the scout demonstrates that skill to an adult leader who then signs it off (not allowed to sign off your own child's) that adult is either SM, ASM, or CM... many of the T-2-1 are done at campouts so it's just who ever was there among the adults.

other than what was already posted... I always pack hand/foot warmers as a "just in case" but the only time I need them is at night when I stick a pair in my boots and then stick my gloves in (opening into boot) to keep them a bit warmer for when I put them on come morning. our troop does a "gear check" before we leave - is boy does not have change of clothes, boots, hat, coat, gloves then he does not go. use the buddy system in that each boy has a buddy and keeps an eye on them through out day/night... make sure they don't exert themselves too much and get sweaty and make sure aren't showing signs of hypothermia or frostbite

the town we live in has maybe had 1 time when any scouts (girl, cub, boy) were in the parade as "scouts" but knowing the kids that are in those programs I can spot them all in the parade. My girl scout's from the unit are either with their ball team, church, or their high school band. But then Girl Scout policies really restrict some of the normal parade normalities... no throwing things, having to have grab bars, etc... the same goes with the cub and boy scouts in this town... they don't have as strict of rules, but they are always with their ball team, church group, or their band. now my son's troop is in another town... they did have a float in the 4th of July parade. Although it was not nearly as full as it could be because of the same reasons for the parade in our town, but that troop is a lot larger and so there are several scouts that don't play sports and aren't in high school yet to march with the band. so not seeing a scout in uniform at the parade does not mean that there aren't scouts in that town.

as a female leader I don't see much difference in the way the boys are with me compared to the male leaders. The only difference I see is that in our troop we have the "Geezer Patrol" in that the adults do their own meal and when one of the ladies is the cook the leaders eat better than when a male leader does the cooking and so we tend to be asked to cook more often. Of course the key to not be to a cook is just mess up once - we have a couple of leaders that have only been asked once LOL sometimes until a boy sees a woman do something won't believe they can do it or is knowledgable in what we say... it's like until they see you light a fire, use a compass, use an axe, etc, they think it's just for men to do it. so it's important for the boys to see ya in action. one disadvantage I have is that when we winter camp I'm usually the only female who goes and so I have no one to share a tent with and thereby no one to help keeping it warm (as many people in a tent as possible really helps it be warmer) the only disadvantage some of the other women have is when we go hiking into "no kybo" areas... me? I have a handy little funnel deal so I can go standing up (I have bad knee so squatting is out of the question) I have also learned to keep it handy when on long drives when the boys will ask to be let out in the middle of no where.