Eagle92

Some of my favorites have included the following: Dutch Oven cooking Box oven cooking Scout Signals (both trail and sign) Ones I wouldn't mind seeing GPS Pioneering HA trip planning Memorable boring ones: Safety Afloat and Safe Swim Defense

Broken, Sometimes the goals set are not reasonable, and no matter what you do, say, show, etc, the PTB will not alter them. Best example I can give is a district that had a number of "paper units". Those "units" and "members" directly affected the membership goals. PTB would not listen to the DE, or District Commissioner, would not read the reports that the DE sent to them after the DE visited IHs and the IHs knew nothing about a unit at their organization. The PTB's only focus was on the "numbers." They didn't care about anythign else: rebuilding the weak district committee, turning paper units into real units, converting "in school scouting" units to LFL units, etc, they only cared about increasing membership and FOS. DE and DC actually kept track of the official membership numbers, as well as the "actual numbers." Officially the district barely met Quality District, try 2-4 scouts over the minimum. But realisticly the district grew over 10% in youth and approx 5% in units if memory serves. When that DE left before the end of the year, the district committee decided start from scratch on a quality program and quality recruiting since it wouldn't affect any DE, as one replacement DE quit, and council took its time finding a second replacement. When the PTB left and a membership audit occured, I was told that all the districts in the council lost members, except for the one mentioned above.

Thanks everyone. I'll be contacting some folks this week, and scanning ebay.

Doc and Seattle, One of the challenges for the "zealots" is that some of them lived through the fiasco of "Urban Scouting" from 1972 to 1979. That hurt the movement so bad that Green Bar Bill had to come out of retirement in 1978 in order to save the BSA. And, IMHO, even he wasn't able to fully save the movement as I am seeing the repercussions of that today. By that I mean we have leaders with little to no outdoor skills from the period, or were never involved in Scouting as a youth. And if Green Bar Bill wasn't able to fully turn around the fiasco of the 1970s, then the BSA is really in trouble if they repeat the mistake of taking the "Outing out ScOuting," because GBB has gone home and no one, repeat NO ONE, could possibly fill his shoes (Sorry KUDU but you're a size or two short ) Boys want adventure, they want the excitement, they want to test themselves in the outdoors. If we give that up, or water it down, then we lose. But more importantly, the boys lose.

Moose, My interpretation is that the pack that Conc left has the only track in the district, and rents it out to the other packs. Conc as the old leader did all the work to lend it out, scheduling derbies with the rest of the district and what not, only to have the new leaders say, no we are not going to rent it out anymore. Sounds spiteful if you ask me. One idea is that if the CO is on good terms with ya Conc, then inform them what has happened and how it is affecting the entire district. Your new unit may have some problems getting it, so I wouldn't count on you using it, but hopefully the new leaders will reconsider for the rest of the district. Their pettiness to you will prevent them from lettin you use it.

Good luck with your problem. Don't know it it will work or not, but this may be a realy fast option for asmall unit. http://www.abc-pinewood-derby.com/practice-track.php

John, In my case, the Wolves knew when the deadline was to get the 2010 Wolf Badge, in my pack's case Dec 27th, but even before that date, try around Nov 29th- Dec 6th time frame, my local council was out of them, and the closest national shop was out of them. I bought 3 of the last 8 Wolf badges at the council shop near my employer for the Dec pack meeting. Now they are out. And don't get me started on the Bobcat badge, none of the pack's new Cubs got them as all sources were out of them. I can understand folks getting uspet if they meet the requirements, but national didn't make enough of them. It would be nice if national made a limtied quantity of badges to be sold to those who have not received the special ones, but if the past is any indication, if youw ant the specials, EBAY is the way to go, and be expected to pay through the nose. I still want my 1990 75th Anniversay OA ribbon!

Dan, In knots and lashings imust respectfully disagree to a degree. yes we still teach them, but to a degree we no longer apply them. I remember as a scout building a "Bosun's Chair" at our scout shows as a youth. Basically it was a 20 foot tripod tower lashed together on one end and a 15 foot tripod tower on the other end. Between the two was a cable connected to 2 vehicles and a "Bosun's Chair" that would go from one tower to the other. It had a leash that a scout on the ground would pull the chair across. Because of the height, scouts can no longer build them. Ditto monkey bridges over a certain height, unless apporved by a COPE director and meeting COPE standards. Heck I bet we couldn't recreate the 1937 NSJ photo of a scout on a pioneering tower signalling. Some of the adventure has been taken out of scouting.

'Fish, No Scouting is not doomed with leaders like you who care about the kids. We need more of your type.

'Box, I hear ya. I looked at the 4th ed. FB and it was more geared to specific HA type activities, not bad but some more of the basics that are not covered inteh BSHB would be nice.

'732, If memory serves, 4 months as the requirements came out in April. Unfortunately as one who earned a special award that was available for a limited time, OA 75th Anniversary Award, and didn't receive it b/c national ran out of them,from past history once out, they are out. heck you cannot find 2010 Bobcat badges in my neck of the woods.

I hate to say it, but with inventory being done this past week I have a bad feeling that the MBs have already been pulled and discarded. I hope I am wrong and Trainerlady can give us some details.

2Cub, TC Coach was the title used when Tigers was a separate program from Cub Scouts. When Tigers became fully incorporated into Cubs, the TC Coach became a TCDL. Yes if there is no Pack Trainer, then help them out

Actually if you look at the job description of the PACK TRAINER ( caps for emph.) they are the ones who are suppose to coach the TCDL. But if you need to help them out, go for it. A couple of ideas 1) get them to training ASAP 2) get them a copy of the Den and Pack resource book.

I know in NC there was a push to get a generic BSA plate. I thought they got the 200 or 300 signatures needed to get it done.

G2SS doesn't really cover married youth now does it. By the book, they sleep in separate areas. Me personally I have no problem with it, BUT I can tell you from a similar expereince that folks will look at ya funny. True story a week after I got married I was sent to summer camp (don't ask still ticks me off thinking about it). Wife, who was 21, came to visit me, and one of the vacant offices/sleeping quarters rooms was vacant. So we shared the room. Wake up the next morning, and while leaving the room several leaders noticed us leaving and were not happy about it. Luckily the CD handled it when they complained to him about us staying in the say room.

Pint, Ah yes UK and traffic cameras, I remember them well. One interesting thing in the US is that some places use traffic cameras at red lights. I do not know if it is a state of North Carolina law, or a county ordinance, but several cities and towns were, stress WERE, using them. They stopped using them becasue the cameras actually cost more than they took in. Whoever did the contract didn't take into account a law that stated X% of the tickets revenues from traffic cameras must go to the school system, with the rest going to the municipality. The contract with the company that did the cameras got a fixed rate per ticket, say Y. So the school system percentage plus the camera company's fixed rate totaled more than the ticket. One city went to court over the matter of having to give the school system any money, lost the case, and had to pay the school system plus court costs. EDITED, the company got a % of the ticket, not a fixed rate. So no matter how much the tickets would be, the cities had to pay.(This message has been edited by eagle92)

SP, Again a great question. In response, my troop allowed PLC to sign of on T-2-1 only. So the standard I stated was used as a youth, is the one I use now today with scouts. Now to be honest, with the exception of MBs, I've only signed a BSHB 2 times in the past 7 years, and that was for BORs I sat on.

I too am one of those who don't like being read to. BUT I admit that when I do training, I do use the powerpoints, mostly to A) make sure I cover what is needed to cover B) as a mental note to myself to keep on track and not talk too much ( me talk to much ) and C) le thte students know what is going on, help take notes and know there is a method to the madness. But a comment that someone said reminded me of the 'Self Study" courses offered at one time. When I did Explorer Leader Basic Training Self Study back in the day, I was given the training book to read, and then met with the Exploring Executive to discuss it. Took about a week to read the book between work and school, and then about 15-30 minutes talking to the EE about the material. I know that all Specific Trainingbeing online is headed our way, but why not do some of the Self Study type trainings still?

Been thinking, and I have an idea. What churches in your area have a BSA unit AND a Hispanic ministry? Have the BSA folks talk to the head of the Hispanic ministry about either A) getting those kids in the established unit, or B) creating a unit as part of the outreach program. My CO has a Hispanic ministry, and my unit does have a few Hispanic members, not many but a few. But it is somethign to think about...hmmmm

Now, now Kudu, don't knock rattles; Stomp Dance songs, Gourd Dance songs, and some Iroquois songs use rattles, And I know members of my OA chapter love the Iroquois Duck Dance. Just remember some of us are chomping at the bit for our Cubs to become Scouts, as well as taking them to Philmont or Bechtel Seriously though, I have found 1 very valid argument in why WBers, heck all SMs and ASMs really, do need to know more about Cub Scouts: the Cub program has changed, IMHO for the better, over the years to include camping, and we need boy Scouts and Venturers to help get these Cubs in the outdoors. Unfortunately i have found lots of Cub leaders have no expereince camping, but if experienced scouts serve as DCs, and the Scouts work with their CO's pack to get them camping, it can keep those cubs interested. It's kinda sad when a 4 beader, who is also the OA lodge adviser (you know the national honor CAMPER society) states that Cubs don't need to go camping. Kinda sad when scout leaders do not want to help out with Cub camping activities. Kinda sad when troops and crews don't want to provide den chiefs that can make the program more intersting and help recruit the Cubs into their troops. I know of SMs who don't see the need to get involved with their CO's packs, expecting them to automatically join their troop. I saw one troop die b/c the SM would not send the SPL or go himself to talk to the pack leaders, invite the Webelos to meetings and campout etc. As for the Cub Scout program, yes it's very similar to what I went through, but it has improved since I was a cub because now Cubs going OUTING more, Do I think cahnges need to be made to Cub Scouts, absolutely. I think they need more OUTING, but it is kinda hard when other leaders don't think Cubs should go camping.

Camp, #1 Welcome to the forums. #2 To be honest, in my expereince both going to summer camp and working summer camp, 99.99999% of the campers don't really care abotu a theme. They want to work on MBs and have fun. #3 That said some themes I've seen have included the follwoing: swamp thing, olympics, and pirates. Best one was with a all female scout troop in the UK. They had a Christmas in July theme for themselves. The had Christmas at Youlbury ( name of the camp) buttons made, had Santa hats, and one leader carried mistletoe.

There are two simple solutions to the problem you describe. 1) Multiple Shirts 2) Velcro Problem with 1 is expenses. Problem with two is you will have folks like me jokingly saying " You don't deserve this," and taking the velcroed patch off.

Ditto what 'Fish said. When I did Roundups as a De and now as a volunteer, I didn't target one specific ethnic group, I wanted ALL boys in Scouting. But I will admit their are still some degree of racial segregation in my neck of the woods. While it may not be intentional, it is still around. The units are affiliated with churches, and unless your church is a "new church," i.e younger than 30 years old, or if your church is the only one of your faith, then your congregation will usually be predominantly one ethnicity, which is what the units will predominantly be. One of the things I like about my CO is that it is ethnically diverse, and with the exception of the Venturing crew, it's only 2 years old and the old CA didn't do much wiht the church (but that is changing ), both the troop and pack are diverse. In fact the troop is the only multiethnic one in the district to my knowledge at the moment. In two months there will be another troop, but they are 100% Hispanic at the moment. And Kudu is right in that the new 100% Hispanic troop currently has brothers and cousins in it at the moment. Again in about 2 -3 months the Webelos will be joining it so it will also be ethically diverse. BUT no matter what ethnicity the Socuts or cubs are, they all want the.... ...OUTING IN SCOUTING! Yes the CM is already planning on leading an expedition to Philmont in 3-4 years with the troop as he will be with the troop and pack then. And the Webelos have been hearing his Philmont stories some time.

Just repeating what I was told and heard form others.