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LATEST POSTS
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By SiouxRanger · Posted
convoy so that if a vehicle has a failure, we can still get the youth/adult to the train on time. And the wounded vehicle can sort out repairs later. 4. Things happen. Run out of gas. Bathroom stops. 5. Lead MUST know the number of vehicles following, and MUST have a good sense, well perfect, of what the last vehicle looks like headlight wise. 6. A written list of cell phone numbers distributed to all drivers, and if not, MUST exchange cell phone numbers to lead and tail drivers. 7. Tail driver NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, passes the second to last driver. The tail driver is always, ALWAYS the last driver. Some driver stops for any reason, the tail driver always remains the tail driver. The tail driver never passes any vehicle in the convoy. We have had times, rarely, where the convoy got quite spread out and the lead pulled onto the Interstate shoulder for folks to catch up. A questionable thing to do, but depending on circumstances, traffic load, sunshine, etc., not as risky as might be thought. It is a lot to ask of the lead, but if everyone is paying attention it does work. HOWEVER, in light of the information I've learned on this thread, I have to reexamine the wisdom of convoys. (On one convoy to summer camp, a dad, once hitting the interstate, disappeared at 80-85 mph., flying past everyone. Met up with him an hour later at the summer camp. Well beyond the speed limit.) My half cent's worth. (not pricing myself above that sage, the Remember guy…) -
By SiouxRanger · Posted
Very interesting thread. After 25 years of adult participation-never heard mention of the "no convoy" rule. As a lawyer, I've read a great deal of BSA documents on policy, 2 deep leadership, guide to safe scouting (no boomerangs, rats), stoves, liquid fuels. use of words with more than 7 syllables but less than 10 syllables, best practices to avoid plummeting space junk (NASA branded but ownership denied), bull roarers (OK-I think), coracles (nope), etc. A scouting professional once "corrected me" telling me that "scouting is not complicated." Compared to a soccer program where parent drops off child to race across field to the game and returns to the car? Parental involvement in soccer can be nil. Liability risk is less than nil. Scouting is very complicated. AND, if you get it wrong (somehow, and it is easy to do), you might end up a defendant for some abuse case and paying your own lawyer tens of thousands of dollars ultimately to be proven innocent. Try BANKRUPTCY. Seems to have worked for National. All of that sounds "simple" to me. Nope. Our troop has convoyed for my 25 years there. Though never had a vehicle incident, that is anecdotal and no basis to make policy. Much to my distress, I was always designated as the lead. Only got everyone lost once-BUT, I was following the directions precisely of someone who claimed to know what they were talking about. In our wanderings, we came across a local in the hinterland who gave us corrective directions and we made our way safely. (Sunday morning after the campout, we ran into the good smaritan in a grocery store who reminded us (M)E that "you are the lost guys I got on your way…" (Thanks.) So, if convoying, having been the lead, there are some pointers I have learned: 1. The lead is "driving for everyone." That is, my van is 5-10 vehicles long. Like driving a train. You can't run through a light nd leave the rest of the train hanging. You stop at the light. Let folks catch up. With luck all will make it through the next light. 2. Everyone needs to know where they are going in case they get separated from the convoy. It all becomes a massive flow chart, taking into account all the unlikely events and imponderables. (On one convoy, a van lost some electrical connection under the dash. We all stopped, the driver's brother who happened to work at an auto parts place in the town where the failure occurred, sent the right part and an hour later, the ENTIRE troop was on its way. 3. If a vehicle suffers some failure, if all are on their own-no convoy, then that vehicle is on its own. To get to the train taking our treks to Philmont, we ALWAYS -
By curious_scouter · Posted
Another suggestion is ask the SM if it's okay if you plan and host ILST. They might just be overwhelmed, maybe they are even unaware it needs to be done annually and is a pre-req for scouts wanting to do NYLT. Or that it's their job to do it. I know my first year as a SM was super overwhelming and I had been an adult scouter and ASM for many years before taking on the job. The first year I was SM we didn't have OA elections - I didn't know I was supposed to request them and no one told me lol. Oops! Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by ignorance! Make the direct offer with a case. Once they let you do one thing and you do it well, you will find they have no problems letting you do more! Probably. Hopefully! I empathize with your position. It's not an easy spot to be in or to get out of. You seem like a good leader, but sometimes that means feeling lonely and having the weight. This too shall pass and things will gradually get better. Scouting is also generational. It's a blessing and a curse. Next year you'll have new crossovers (probably) with new adults and you may find your people then. Or someone presenting a headwind to you today find themselves busier with work in a few months and their absence means the bad habits they championed also fade a bit. -
From what I can recall as a youth: I had a parent who was also a registered leader. At the troop level, it felt like the program was harder because I had one less adult to sign requirements. Parents were forbidden to approve their own child's requirements or sit in BOR. Neither my brother nor I made it close to Eagle. My father stayed in the program long after my brother and I left it for other activities. Now as an adult, I can speak from both experiences. I started as an adult of a Cub, where I could guide and encourage my young scout from the sidelines. Later on I became a den leader. Then my attention was on the entire den and I had to let go of the focus on my own scout. I feel like it led him astray some, but it also led him to be more self-guided. He is still in the BSA program. I have seen den leaders and their kids "burn-out" and leave. But I think it has to do more with the program, how it changes as the scouts age, and how the kids themselves grow. Not every scout is destined to Eagle. Some kids enjoy the Cub Scout program, but don't like the outdoors program focus in BSA. Some kids find a troop, never been a Cub, and they make excellent scouts. Everybody takes what they need from the program, as long as they find their way into the program to learn and grow. Everyone walks a different path. -
I'll offer my experience/observation at the Cub level, since my boys didn't continue past AOL. I was DL or ADL for both boys during their Cub years. Sometimes I felt bad during some activities due to not always being able to assist my boys while assisting other scouts/parents. I don't think that's the reason neither decided to continue scouting but maybe/might/coulda been a better experience. On the plus side, both boys where always up to date on requirements & never late for meetings or campouts.
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