G2SS

[EagleWB]

In the original thread, the G2SS is used to explain why you can no longer do Patrol camping. My question is if ScoutBox is in Switzerland does G2SS apply or is G2SS a BSA document. Does the World Scouting Organization follow G2SS. I truly don't know but am asking.

[shortridge]

Each national Scouting organization is autonomous, with its own rules and regs. If, for example, ScoutBox is a member of the Swiss Scouting organization, the Swiss rules would apply. If ScoutBox is a member of the BSA in an overseas council, the BSA's rules would apply.

 

What matters is who you're registered with, not what country you're in.

[Beavah]

Yah, that's sorta true and sorta not, eh?

 

Generally speakin' the G2SS applies to BSA units. Presumably ScoutBox is in a BSA unit based in Switzerland (usually military bases or foreign service units; might also be a group of U.S. citizens workin' at a foreign site like CERN physicists ).

 

However, local laws and insurance coverage may be quite different, eh? I'm not actually sure about how that stuff is structured for the foreign units. Certainly the litigation-crazed nature of U.S. citizens doesn't play well overseas; courts and juries tend to expect parents to be parents and kids to be kids and the world to have sharp edges that aren't bubble-wrapped with warning labels.

 

So, for example, if ScoutBox's unit was to participate in any scouting at Swiss or other European camps, they would not be able to set up full Safe Swim Defense, eh? The camp would have its own rules and safety structure, and wouldn't take kindly to some U.S. unit setting up roped areas and a buddy board.

 

As usual, common sense, good judgment, and courtesy toward local custom all apply more than a generic guidance document.

 

Beavah

 

[phips]

shortridge isr right.

Each National Scout Organization has its own rules.

 

But for the 22nd World Scout Jamboree there is an online-course on Youth protection for all adults taking part in the Jamboree as Scout Leaders, as members of the International Service Team or Contingent Management Team.

It can be found under: http://safefromharm.se/

 

 

If there is an international event in Europe with Scout groups from different National Scout Organization you talk about the national rules before and design the rules for the event so that everyone feels comfortable.

As a guideline you can use: WOSM: Guideline on Risk Management Policy

and Europe Region WAGGGS/European Scout Region(WOSM):Child Protection Tool-Kit.

This applies to a local event such as a meeting for a weekend or a small international summer camp i.e. with Scout groups from Tyrol (Austria), South Tyrol (Italy), Bavaria (Germany) and BSA Units (TAC).

 

On bigger Scouting events such as National Jamborees or Regional Jamboree the organisation team follows the guidelines of WOSM and WAGGGS and the local laws of the country.

BSA Troops from the U.S. took part in National and Regional Jamborees in Austria in the last ten years and had no problem and did feel fine.

 

In example the Swiss Scouts (PBS) follow the guidelines of the goverment agency Youth and Sport (Eidgenssisches Bundesamt Jugend und Sport) and the Guidelines of their association. The local Leaders are supported by special trained Coaches/Mentors and their regional Scout organization (Corps,Kantonalverband(similar to BSA Councils)).

 

In all European Scout Organizations there is well designed Leaders Training.

 

This documents and helps can be found here: http://scout.org/en/information_events/library/management/guideline_on_risk_management_policy and http://scout.org/en/information_events/library/child_protection/child_protection_tool_kit

 

Yours in Scouting

 

phips

Council International Representative

Boy Scouts and Girl Scout of Austria-Council Tyrol

 

(This message has been edited by phips)

[BadenP]

I always get a kick out of scouters who view the G2SS as some sort of Holy Grail of scouting,and that is somehow a universal document passed down from the ancients.

 

The G2SS is simply a GUIDE as is in its title, a reference tool if a scout leader is somehow unsure how to handle a situation that may come up during a scouting event, and that is ALL it is. The mythos and authority that has been built up surrounding this publication is both very humorous and very sad. As our legal experts here have already stated in other threads local and state laws ALWAYS supercede anything printed in the G2SS.

[shortridge]

BadenP and Beavah - EagleWB asked about the Scouting rules & regs. I think it's pretty clear that when you're in another country, that country's laws apply, and laws trump BSA rules any time.

[eisely]

G2SS is much more than just a guide. It is my understanding (and I believe it is stated up front in the G2SS document) that the language in bold face type is policy that must be followed.

 

I don't think anyone has ever held up G2SS as divinely inspired scripture. I can see how some adult who is new to scouting and who does not have a great deal of experience with outdoor activities might be intimidated. Certainly following the letter of the law is always the least risky course. There is still enough flexibility to have a great program and a lot of fun.

[BadenP]

Eisley

 

To answer your post G2SS is NOT, I repeat NOT more than just a guide. The BSA is not a law enforcement entity. If your troop goes to play laser tag in their uniforms National is not going to send out their G2SS police to arrest you or write you a citation are they? A pack in my district recently did that exact thing, a leader in a different pack, who was present at the time, complained to the SE about what he saw. There was nothing said or written to the pack leaders by either council or National. Again these are guidelines, and unless there is a case of child endangerment or extensive property damage or something equally serious nothing is going to be said or done by the BSA.

[ScoutNut]

>>"It is my understanding (and I believe it is stated up front in the G2SS document) that the language in bold face type is policy that must be followed."

[Adam S]

BadenP is spot on. From http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS.aspx

 

(not quoting the whole page)

 

The purpose of the Guide to Safe Scouting is to prepare members of the Boy Scouts of America to conduct Scouting activities in a safe and prudent manner. The policies and guidelines have been established because of the real need to protect members from known hazards that have been identified through 100 years of experience. Limitations on certain activities should not be viewed as stumbling blocks; rather, policies and guidelines are best described as stepping-stones toward safe and enjoyable adventures.

 

All participants in official Scouting activities should become familiar with the Guide to Safe Scouting and be aware of state or local government regulations that supersede Boy Scouts of America policies and guidelines. The Guide to Safe Scouting provides an overview of Scouting policies and procedures rather than comprehensive, standalone documentation."

 

 

Being a little pessimistic I tend to think of this as "The guide to liability shifting" were BSA can point and say "We told you so" if something bad happens and then hope they have reduced liability. Continuing my pessimism I also think the reason you don't see people getting in trouble for things that "violate" the G2SS would simply result in decreased revenue through enrollment.

 

 

[reeddma]

Based upon what I reading from some on this forum then because Youth Protection and Safety Afloat are in G2SS that these are only guidance statements and units don't need to follow them??? I really find this hard to believe.

 

SM1983BSA

[qwazse]

Cart before the horse. YPT and other Saftey principles don't gain their importance because they are in G2SS. Rather, G2SS is important because these common-sense concepts are in one place.

 

When my coeds talk (jokingly, thank goodness) about sleeping arrangements, I tell them it's a YPT violation, not "the G2SS tells me so."

 

If a youth life guard is operating in my aquatics area, I refer to safe-swim and safety afloat, not G2SS. Heck, at that moment I really don't care if the kid gets YPT or gun safety at all. I do care that he/she knows how to prevent the death or injury of the swimmers/boaters in his area.

 

If kids are throwing 5 pound rocks at each other (nothing in G2SS about lofting projectiles), I'll rudely interrupt them. If they are pointing little red lights at each other in a dark room, I'm not getting in a huff about it. (In terms of safety, that is. I might pull out the "scouting is outing" speech.)

[bnelon44]

The purpose of the Guide to Safe Scouting is to prepare members of the Boy Scouts of America to conduct Scouting activities in a safe and prudent manner. The policies and guidelines have been established because of the real need to protect members from known hazards that have been identified through 100 years of experience. Limitations on certain activities should not be viewed as stumbling blocks; rather, policies and guidelines are best described as stepping-stones toward safe and enjoyable adventures.

 

All participants in official Scouting activities should become familiar with the Guide to Safe Scouting and be aware of state or local government regulations that supersede Boy Scouts of America policies and guidelines. The Guide to Safe Scouting provides an overview of Scouting policies and procedures rather than comprehensive, standalone documentation. For some items, the policy statements are complete. Unit leaders are expected to review the additional reference material cited prior to conducting such activities.

 

In situations not specifically covered in this guide, activity planners should evaluate the risk or potential risk of harm, and respond with action plans based on common sense, community standards, the Boy Scout motto, and safety policies and practices commonly prescribed for the activity by experienced providers and practitioners.

 

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/GSS.aspx

 

In the past, the Guide to Safe Scouting has been a unit leaders guide for activities. This new version addresses other activities at the council and district levels. While some of the literature provides guidance for district and council activities, the primary focus is for unit leaders conducting unit activities.

 

http://www.scouting.org/sitecore/content/Home/HealthandSafety/Alerts/Guide%20to%20Safe%20Scouting.aspx

 

The Boy Scouts of America general liability policy provides coverage for a bodily injury or property damage claim that is made and arises out of an Official Scouting Activity. The Guide to Safe Scouting contains a listing of Unauthorized and Restricted Activities. Unauthorized activities are not considered Official Scouting Activities. Volunteers (registered and unregistered), Units, Chartered Organizations and Local Councils are jeopardizing insurance coverage for themselves and their organization by engaging in unauthorized activities. PLEASE DO NOT PUT YOURSELF AT RISK.

 

http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/HealthandSafety/Alerts/Insurance.aspx

[BadenP]

bnelon

 

Do those unauthorized activities putting the organization and its insurance in jeopardy include laser tag, which is inclued in G2SS as an UNAUTHORIZED activity? Time for National to get a reality check as to what really should be unauthorized, don't you think?(This message has been edited by BadenP)