skeptic Posted March 14 Author Share Posted March 14 Absolute safety is a mirage. Sometimes things just happen, even with every precaution. And every effort to find perfection will fail, no matter what. And in this country, the legal vultures constantly circle because we let them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcousino Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 7 hours ago, skeptic said: Absolute safety is a mirage. Sometimes things just happen, even with every precaution. And every effort to find perfection will fail, no matter what. And in this country, the legal vultures constantly circle because we let them. I agree nothing is totally safe. But if you offered an event you are expected to show due care in the event. And attendie's understand the risks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tron Posted March 18 Share Posted March 18 On 3/14/2026 at 11:29 AM, skeptic said: Absolute safety is a mirage. Sometimes things just happen, even with every precaution. And every effort to find perfection will fail, no matter what. And in this country, the legal vultures constantly circle because we let them. On 3/14/2026 at 7:29 PM, jcousino said: I agree nothing is totally safe. But if you offered an event you are expected to show due care in the event. And attendie's understand the risks I don't think either of these apply to this situation. If the narrative is correct that a 12 year old basically romper stomped a 5 year old; like how do you plan for that contingency? How is a total beat down that results in broken bones that occurs in a crowded room full of other youth, adult leaders, and parent partners even on the radar for non-jail based cub scout packs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuctTape Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Probably the only question to be determined in this case will be, "who was responsible for supervising the 5 year old".? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tron Posted March 26 Share Posted March 26 I saw in the news this morning that the family is now also suing national. I think I just heard an old dirty diesel bus turn over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeptic Posted March 26 Author Share Posted March 26 Suspect this is not a coincidence. It was sent to leaders on the list for Scouting Safety. Note the heading. " Scouting Safety Newsletter: SAFE Checklist Revisited! Aol/Old Mail Scouting America www.scouting.org From:[email protected] Unsubscribe To:[email protected] Thu, Mar 26 at 3:03 PM View Online S is for Supervision Scouting America’s SAFE Checklist is the primary methodology we use to help ensure all Scouting America activities are conducted safely. While Scouting America expects leaders to use the four points of SAFE when delivering the Scouting Program, this article will be focusing on the first point: Supervision Our movement has always worked on the concept of youth-led adventure, supervised by qualified and trustworthy adults. Today we codify this concept in the SAFE Checklist. Adults supervising youth: Accept the responsibility for the well-being and safety of youth under their care Ensure that adults are adequately trained, experienced and skilled to lead the activity, including the ability to recognize and respond to likely hazards and potential emergencies Know and deliver the program of Scouting America with integrity Use qualified instructors, guides or safety personnel as needed to provide additional guidance Maintain engagement with participants during activities to ensure compliance with established rules and procedures Supervision is not a checkbox step in Scouting, or a one and done. Rather, supervision is the continually occurring process leaders use to ensure adventures have safe and positive outcomes. Scouters must be honest about assessing their knowledge in any given subject to ensure they have the knowledge, skills and abilities to recognize hazards and respond to them properly. Units often need to be strategic and help ensure their adult leaders have the correct training for planned adventures throughout the year. Remember, your council can help connect you with upcoming training activities. Scouters’ knowledge also extends to the program of Scouting America. One way to think of that is to understand “what chapter and page” you are in the Scouting program. If you can’t find an activity in our official materials, that is a good sign it is not aligned with our program goals. An adult leader should only deliver official program-approved materials from qualified subject matter experts. Lastly, supervision means being involved in activities so that you can detect hazards before they occur and help ensure participants are engaged properly. Supervision is not just watching the exits, but being involved in the moment with Scouts, which also demonstrates what real leadership looks like. Visit Scouting America’s Safety Moment landing page here! If you have a safety moment idea for the Scouting Safely website, share your draft with us at [email protected], and we’ll consider it for publication. If you have questions, email us for guidance or support. Together, let’s grow a strong Culture of Safety in Scouting! Read this month's newsletter here. Resources: SAFE Checklist Guide to Safe Scouting Scouting America Code of Conduct" 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tron Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 3 hours ago, skeptic said: Suspect this is not a coincidence. It was sent to leaders on the list for Scouting Safety. Note the heading. " Scouting Safety Newsletter: SAFE Checklist Revisited! Aol/Old Mail Scouting America www.scouting.org From:[email protected] Unsubscribe To:[email protected] Thu, Mar 26 at 3:03 PM View Online S is for Supervision Scouting America’s SAFE Checklist is the primary methodology we use to help ensure all Scouting America activities are conducted safely. While Scouting America expects leaders to use the four points of SAFE when delivering the Scouting Program, this article will be focusing on the first point: Supervision Our movement has always worked on the concept of youth-led adventure, supervised by qualified and trustworthy adults. Today we codify this concept in the SAFE Checklist. Adults supervising youth: Accept the responsibility for the well-being and safety of youth under their care Ensure that adults are adequately trained, experienced and skilled to lead the activity, including the ability to recognize and respond to likely hazards and potential emergencies Know and deliver the program of Scouting America with integrity Use qualified instructors, guides or safety personnel as needed to provide additional guidance Maintain engagement with participants during activities to ensure compliance with established rules and procedures Supervision is not a checkbox step in Scouting, or a one and done. Rather, supervision is the continually occurring process leaders use to ensure adventures have safe and positive outcomes. Scouters must be honest about assessing their knowledge in any given subject to ensure they have the knowledge, skills and abilities to recognize hazards and respond to them properly. Units often need to be strategic and help ensure their adult leaders have the correct training for planned adventures throughout the year. Remember, your council can help connect you with upcoming training activities. Scouters’ knowledge also extends to the program of Scouting America. One way to think of that is to understand “what chapter and page” you are in the Scouting program. If you can’t find an activity in our official materials, that is a good sign it is not aligned with our program goals. An adult leader should only deliver official program-approved materials from qualified subject matter experts. Lastly, supervision means being involved in activities so that you can detect hazards before they occur and help ensure participants are engaged properly. Supervision is not just watching the exits, but being involved in the moment with Scouts, which also demonstrates what real leadership looks like. Visit Scouting America’s Safety Moment landing page here! If you have a safety moment idea for the Scouting Safely website, share your draft with us at [email protected], and we’ll consider it for publication. If you have questions, email us for guidance or support. Together, let’s grow a strong Culture of Safety in Scouting! Read this month's newsletter here. Resources: SAFE Checklist Guide to Safe Scouting Scouting America Code of Conduct" This is going to be a tough one right. Does supervision mean a leader can never step away even if there are at least 2 other leaders present? Let us spitball here with real situations that have happened in my presence over the past 2 years. What if the cubmaster (they call him the scoutmaster in all the news articles) had stepped away for something other than to vape outside? Same duration away, same timing, but instead of vaping he had to take an emergency call from work? Instead of vaping he had to take an emergency call from a family member? What if instead of vaping he was having an asthma attack and stepped outside to get fresh air and use his inhaler? What if instead of vaping he had to step away to eat on a medical issue based eating schedule? Left field scenario: What if the cubmaster had a scheduling conflict and someone else had to be the unit leader for the night and this had happened? In the last year my packs cubmaster has had to miss pack meetings due to work based scheduling conflicts and the CC or COR has had to step in to run the monthly pack meeting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeptic Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 What if's are the worst problem, as we now live in a society that makes them more important than they should be and there is a legal vulture just waiting. But, we also seem afraid to just be normal and use commn sense within the given framework. No answer to most of it due to our specific "blame" society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcousino Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 26 minutes ago, skeptic said: What if's are the worst problem, as we now live in a society that makes them more important than they should be and there is a legal vulture just waiting. But, we also seem afraid to just be normal and use commn sense within the given framework. No answer to most of it due to our specific "blame" society. Works fine until your the one with a permanently injured child because someone coman sense was faulty. The old saying common sense isn't so common, " it more like hold my beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcousino Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 1 hour ago, Tron said: This is going to be a tough one right. Does supervision mean a leader can never step away even if there are at least 2 other leaders present? Let us spitball here with real situations that have happened in my presence over the past 2 years. What if the cubmaster (they call him the scoutmaster in all the news articles) had stepped away for something other than to vape outside? Same duration away, same timing, but instead of vaping he had to take an emergency call from work? Instead of vaping he had to take an emergency call from a family member? What if instead of vaping he was having an asthma attack and stepped outside to get fresh air and use his inhaler? What if instead of vaping he had to step away to eat on a medical issue based eating schedule? Left field scenario: What if the cubmaster had a scheduling conflict and someone else had to be the unit leader for the night and this had happened? In the last year my packs cubmaster has had to miss pack meetings due to work based scheduling conflicts and the CC or COR has had to step in to run the monthly pack meeting. They are the master of the ship. Most Cub/ Scoutmasters do not understand their level of responsibility. They are responsible for all the Scout Connect adult members. The CO is the highest-ranking member on that chain; most are unaware of their level of responsibility. Events happen, anything other than that vaping sounds better. When an other adult takes a leadership position they assume a lot of the risk. An event happening will still involve the master being questioning about thier choice of this person, trainning. Past preferences ext Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcousino Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 Two deep learnership deals more with possible sexual content issues. 2 trained adults to 10 scouts acceptable control 2 adults 30 multi age scout unacceptable of control (my numbers for a point) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSScout Posted March 27 Share Posted March 27 (edited) As a Archery Range Officer in CSDC, I have stories. They all (thanks be to God) are none-reportable incidents, but make good round the campfire sharings.... What ifs.... I'll give one: CSDC at a large county park. Wonderful facilities, large pavilions, big open areas. Archery range set up , flat open areas,,,, , Eight targets set up .facing a large, tall embankment. Set up flags, double yellow warning tape all around, bright orange traffic cones.... . , Tarps and pop ups for shade. Third day, Cubs have had the safety training, all are very respective of our instructions. At the line, pick up your arrow, nock , take aim.... AND SOME IDIOT IS RUNNING PAST<JUMPING OVER THE TAPES AND CONES>>> "" CEASE FIRE< BOWS DOWN !!! "" Ach du lieber.... Edited March 27 by SSScout 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skeptic Posted March 27 Author Share Posted March 27 And if that person became the character on Ghosts it would still be the fault of Scouting America,etal. At least in this country. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetterWithCheddar Posted March 28 Share Posted March 28 The absurdity of this article caught my attention this week: Prank with pencil gone wrong at Stoney Creek Elementary school | Charlotte Observer Quote One of the students “said that they were trying to play a prank on him, and they put a pencil on his seat, and when he went to sit down they held the pencil still so that when he sat down it went in,” the 911 caller said. “We don’t know how deep it is, but he says he feels the pencil in him,” the caller said. Does this mean 5th grade in inherently unsafe, the teacher was negligent, and students shouldn't use pencils anymore? Of course not. This poor behavior is so far outside the norm that it's impossible to take into account. The prankster's family should be the only one involved in the lawsuit, but I'm sure other parties will be lumped in anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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