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RememberSchiff

Buzzfeed - CSE Surbaugh - Girls - Scouter.com

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9 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

Colorized? What next Casablanca?

I know, really.  It is a bit of a sacrilege.

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6 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

But no one says a thing when girls don't want boys in their club house. Then it is a safe space and empowering. 

Careful there...you will be pegged as one who is not inclusive supportive and liberating of these efforts.  Just get in line citizen, it is a big and colorful tent but no room for dissent 

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3 minutes ago, cocomax said:

No safe space for the patriarchy at any age!

Apparently the GSUSA matriarchy is exempt. 

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30 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

Related image

I wouldn’t say that exactly. Just want my safe space to be a guy. Btw I know you’re joking. 

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16 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

Careful there...you will be pegged as one who is not inclusive supportive and liberating of these efforts.  Just get in line citizen, it is a big and colorful tent but no room for dissent 

Image.jpeg.19025554e55dd5f1e0ce6a8961c69b3a.jpeg

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10 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

Apparently the GSUSA matriarchy is exempt. 

Yes they are exempt, and they have cookies.    

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Just listened to the “pantsuit nation” podcast with Sydney Ireland as the guest.  The striking inconsistency of the argument presented that BSA must tear down this patriarchal program while maintaining Girl Scout are great for girls is blatant.  I warn you not to go searching for the podcast....

That said, it is the reality for COs and Packs that choose to include girls.  

After starting the process of adding girls I believe it is clear the BSA MUST release and start the pilot program of the girl Boy Scout program this summer.  The startup issues of just adding dens and girls to the Pack have been tough enough.  Adding a new girls program will be massive and they will need some groups to work out the bugs to be ready for 2019 Feb/March crossover.  Given the what is in this article I think they realize this and may be feeling the pressure of simply adding girl Patrols to Troops.  Whatever solution, they need to  have a kickoff in the spring for training and begin pilot Troops or patrols this summer/fall.  Waiting until next year will be a disaster.

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11 minutes ago, Back Pack said:

Image.jpeg.19025554e55dd5f1e0ce6a8961c69b3a.jpeg

In every South Park episode there are great lessons to be learned

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What are the rules these days? I think they are something like this:

Women are always victims.

Men and masculinity must change to meet women's needs.

Women will only be equal when they are considered exactly the same as men and, therefore, must be granted special safeguards from and privileges over men.

***(I do not like these rules, and I wish they would go away and women and men could be friends again.)
 

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12 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

Just listened to the “pantsuit nation” podcast with Sydney Ireland as the guest.  The striking inconsistency of the argument presented that BSA must tear down this patriarchal program while maintaining Girl Scout are great for girls is blatant.  I warn you not to go searching for the podcast....

Is Sydney Ireland really talking about "tearing down" the program?  I doubt it.  I am sure she thinks of herself as trying to build it up.

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3 minutes ago, NJCubScouter said:

Is Sydney Ireland really talking about "tearing down" the program?  I doubt it.  I am sure she thinks of herself as trying to build it up.

Sort of unclear, but it really is about her and getting the Eagle.  So yeah, I would say if it's all about you and changing something just for you, you do kind of want to tear stuff down.

It's all about the Eagle Scout and leadership.  Pretty much she wants to change what we are, and did I mention it's all about the EAGLE rank?

Smashing the patriarchy, fighting to be recognized, the fight is not over, incremental fight.  Fighting for the right for girls to be part of the Boy Scouts.  She along with her brother, he was an "Official" member but she was not allowed to.

She wanted to change that.  The Eagle award opens many opportunities.  Basically it is all about the Eagle.  Sidebar - so many who are beating the drum of girls in the program tout the rank and earning the Eagle as the end all be all.  Scouting is so much more.  It's outings and leadership and learning to be responsible and the Oath and the Law and overcoming obstacles and time spent just being a scout. Yes those that earn Eagle are recognized, but are they recognized because of the rank, OR is it because they demonstrate the values they learned as a scout.  

She wants it changed sooner.  She wants to get her work acknowledged.  She is an unofficial Star scout apparently (WTH, is that a thing??).  She claims she has literally done everything but does not get credit.  She is up against the system (the man is trying to keep her down).  

They did mention Girl Scouts, why not join that.  She does not explain why the Girls Scouts is different or why GSUSA does not meet here needs.  They glossed over that part and really did not even go into why a program founded by women, run by women, serving girls and women, does not meet the needs of those they service.

She does say single gender is great for girls BUT the BSA has portions that are coed, so the part that gets EAGLE needs to be open.  So apparently single gender is not good for boys

Beats the drum for recognizing work done while not a part of the program, again it's all about the Eagle rank

Did I mention it's all apparently about the Eagle rank???

28 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

I warn you not to go searching for the podcast...

You did warn me, and I went, and the whole Pantsuit nation is a interesting bunch

It's at the 9 minute mark or so, may want to skip ahead

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23 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

Smashing the patriarchy, fighting to be recognized, the fight is not over, incremental fight. 

 

Just to be clear, Sydney did not say any of these things. That was said by the show's host. 

 

23 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

...so many who are beating the drum of girls in the program tout the rank and earning the Eagle as the end all be all.  Scouting is so much more.  It's outings and leadership and learning to be responsible and the Oath and the Law and overcoming obstacles and time spent just being a scout. Yes those that earn Eagle are recognized, but are they recognized because of the rank, OR is it because they demonstrate the values they learned as a scout...

 

It certainly is so much more, and much of what it is, Sydney has done. By age 16, any boy in the program has learned a lot of those things, and a lot of 16-year-olds are rank-motivated. I don't hold it against her that she is motivated by the rank, too. 

I think everything she has done is evidence of what Scouting has made her into. Overcoming obstacles, outings, leadership, all of the things you mentioned, she has done and/or exemplifies. So now, after 12 years, she wants the rank. I don't think it's wrong for her to be so focused on that. 

Edited by EmberMike

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33 minutes ago, EmberMike said:

Just to be clear, Sydney did not say any of these things. That was said by the show's host.

Correct, I didn’t mean to put this on Ireland or start another Ireland debate.  It was a lead in prior to even talking with Ireland.  

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4 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

Correct, I didn’t mean to put this on Ireland or start another Ireland debate.  It was a lead in prior to even talking with Ireland.  

True - but that being the case, she is member of Pantsuit Nation, she is familiar with the group, she is media savvy, and she was part of their showcase on the podcast.  Probably not her intent to come off as fighting the patriarchy, she just wants to get people to sign her petition and send letters to CSE (and who among us has not) and the President of AT&T.  She was a willing part of that discussion and, as can be seen in many instances, people with cause A are often used by another group to forward their agenda.

She may need to be cognizant of that and realize that contrary to PT Barnum's input "There's no such thing as bad publicity" is not always true.

Maybe she should strive for this effort - "All publicity is good if it is intelligent"

 

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