Outside Magazine: Boy Scouts Should Allow Girls

[NJCubScouter 1389]

"Nearly First Class" ?

 

Hmm, would that mean that the rank I ended up with would be "Nearly Eagle"?  Can I get half a knot for that?

[RememberSchiff 3683]

Hmm, would that mean that the rank I ended up with would be "Nearly Eagle"?  Can I get half a knot for that?

 

So awarded 

Edited July 6, 2017 by RememberSchiff

[TAHAWK 1420]

That's an overhand isn't it?  Turn it over.  Use silver thread on a blue background.  District Award of Merit.

 

You can get a not for Life Scout.

[NJCubScouter 1389]

 

You can get a not for Life Scout.

Yes, I have my Life "not".

[EmberMike 144]

It kinda negates the Charter, and as far as I can tell the political trend for gals is to get the BOY Scout Eagle, not the Scout Eagle, not the same brand, not the same thing in the minds of those getting it.  

 

I've never in my life heard an Eagle Scout refered to as "Boy Scout Eagle". I think you're injecting gender into the title unnecessarily. 

[Stosh 3452]

I've never in my life heard an Eagle Scout refered to as "Boy Scout Eagle". I think you're injecting gender into the title unnecessarily. 

 

The emphasis was to point out the difference between an Eagle earned while the program was all boys vs. an Eagle earned when the program would be co-ed.  No gender issue here, just pointing out the Eagle in one program may not be viewed equally with an Eagle in a different program.  We all know that the Ranger Award and Quartermaster are not viewed the same as Eagle even when it all comes from the BSA organization.

[qwazse 4345]

The emphasis was to point out the difference between an Eagle earned while the program was all boys vs. an Eagle earned when the program would be co-ed.  No gender issue here, just pointing out the Eagle in one program may not be viewed equally with an Eagle in a different program.  We all know that the Ranger Award and Quartermaster are not viewed the same as Eagle even when it all comes from the BSA organization.

Well, are they not viewed the same because they are open to different groups of youth?

Or, are they not viewed the same because they have different requirements?

 

If co-eds complete the same requirements, is it not the same award?

 

On the other hand, if someone of the same sex, for an award of the same name, completes different requirements -- say, starting August 1st, did he earn the same award as the one earned by someone else by completing different requirements on July 31st?

[NJCubScouter 1389]

If co-eds complete the same requirements, is it not the same award?

 

 

If pre-change Eagle has the same requirements as post-change Eagle, and they are applied in the same way pre- and post-, and if (post-change) the requirements are the same (and are applied the same) regardless of gender, it is all Eagle.  Not "Boy Scout Eagle", not "Scout Eagle" if that means something different, just Eagle. The fact that more people will be able to earn it will not change what it is.

 

(Note I do not use the word "coed" because it appears the current proposal is to have both all-girl troops and "coed" troops, and girls could earn Eagle in both.) 

[Stosh 3452]

When it comes to marketing, branding is everything.  We see it all the time even with WB.  I can't serve on WB, even though I have 2 beads.  I was "allowed" to serve on a Jambo contingent only because they wanted a pre-21 Century WBer on the staff.  Internally we all experience the differences, out in the "real" world, BSA has even less control over the opinions of others.

[NJCubScouter 1389]

When it comes to marketing, branding is everything.  We see it all the time even with WB.  I can't serve on WB, even though I have 2 beads.  I was "allowed" to serve on a Jambo contingent only because they wanted a pre-21 Century WBer on the staff.  Internally we all experience the differences, out in the "real" world, BSA has even less control over the opinions of others.

 

Well, if you wish to try to predict the opinions of people about the BSA about something that hasn't happened yet, and we don't even know exactly what form it will take if and when it does happen, that of course is your privilege. Maybe when everyone can earn it, it will enhance the esteem of the award in the eyes of the public.  Maybe not.  Who knows?  (That was a rhetorical question; I understand that you think you know.)

[CalicoPenn 729]

My Ex was a school teacher and of course she was responsible for creating test questions and she learned an important lesson on the first test she created.  Just because one creates a test question does not always mean one's answer is wrong just because it answer what YOU wanted it to be is not what they put as the answer.  Be careful of what you think you know is what you are asking. 

 

1) A zoologist is a scientist who studies ________________.  Of course we all know the answer to this question is "hard".  

 

We always answered "empty space" because chances were pretty good that what they were really studying had vanished as they were setting up their spotting scopes.

[CalicoPenn 729]

Girls in.  Scouts of America.  Impact on Congressional Charter?

 

I don't think there is any impact on the Congressional charter - it says the purpose is to provide training to boys - it doesn't say only boys so that doesn't necessarily preclude offering training to men, women or girls.  If there would be a problem with the charter, that would have occurred a long time ago when Exploring became co-ed.

[CalicoPenn 729]

I think there is approximately a zero percent chance that the name of the organization will be changed regardless of what other decisions they make. After all, there have been girls in BSA programs for 45 years and it is still the BSA.  "Cub" is a gender-neutral word, so that stays the same.  I guess that for coed and all-girl troops they will come up with a name other than "Boy Scouts."

 

 

 

The Boy Scouts of America still has the trademark for "Scouting USA"

[Stosh 3452]

 

Well, if you wish to try to predict the opinions of people about the BSA about something that hasn't happened yet, and we don't even know exactly what form it will take if and when it does happen, that of course is your privilege. Maybe when everyone can earn it, it will enhance the esteem of the award in the eyes of the public.  Maybe not.  Who knows?  (That was a rhetorical question; I understand that you think you know.)

 

One can reasonably predict the reactions of people.  Make a change and all fur will fly because they know they can't make any difference.  Suggest a change and all will fur will fly until the cat's dead because until it becomes effective, their comments, preferences, likes and dislikes will be aired up until the last minute...254 posts will attest to that.

 

I remember my Finance professor in college saying 56 years ago that General Motors is too big to fail.  Our tax money was spent to uphold that myth.  Never say never.

[Gwaihir 198]

So I just got back from vacation, did BSA officially make Boy Scouts and Cub Scouts co-ed? 

or did some new news come out over the last 2 weeks that make it seem like it will happen any day now?  

Edited July 25, 2017 by Gwaihir