Newbie UC's

[Krampus 696]

I thought all UC's did was bug you for your JTE form, email you incessantly about your recharter and hound you about participating in FoS? 

 

Seems anyone any age can do that and requires little training. Perhaps they should hire more wives for that role?

[John-in-KC 311]

First, Stosh...

 

The UC is NOT part of the Key 3 for a unit!  The Key 3 is Scoutmaster, Committee Chair, and Chartered Organization Representative ... and those 3 need to have each others back!

 

The UC is not supposed to be from the unit.  He's supposed to bring perspective by looking at different units and providing best/better practices.

 

The UC is supposed to be a friend of the unit, but he's also BSA's QA mechanism:  His visits seek out areas where the program is strong, but he also looks for weaknesses.  He's there to provide help on Aims, Methods, and program support.  He knows how to reach into scouting.org and find the right best practice info.  If he doesn't, he has a bunch of his friends who are supposed to be able to help him, from his ADC and DC to the Council Commish

 

My opinion, having been a UC:  You don't have to have been in Scouting forever, but you need to have been around it long enough, as an adult, to decide that this form of volunteering is a worthy use of your time.  Others here, such as @@Eamonn and @@Beavah (if he's still posting), will give you their perspectives gladly, by PM or in posts here. 

 

My personal perspective is much depends on how the SE treats his volunteers through the Professional Staff.  I have a day job.   I don't need to hunt down metrics for metric management games after hours.  I don't need to chase down FOS/IIC donations.  I do like being told "thank you" vice "do this".  There's a reason I'm not a UC right now...

 

That's the theory, anyway...

[Stosh 3452]

Yep, you're right on the key-3 thingy. 

 

We're so well run I often forget those things.  I don't have a CC and my COR is also my UC and my ASM is also the DC....   Needless to say, everything is pretty much screwed up in this Council.    Of all the UC's in the district, the DC and myself are the only ones trained.  SM's don't have much nice to say about their UC's.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

My thoughts, and I've been a UC.

 

1) There is training, and if memory serves, it's a day long one. Sorry it's been 18 years since I did it, and having been a DE prior to being UC, it was a rehash.

 

2)  UCs should have knowledge, skills and experience working with multiple units prior to being a UC. Being  on training staff, attending  RTs etc so that folks know who he is and can know the advice given is sound.

 

More later

[fred johnson 936]

A few random thoughts ... 

 

- BSA training is introductory at best.  Maybe Woodbadge has more depth.  Otherwise, comments about who is trained really just reflect who cared enough to take the first step in learning about scouting.  Beyond that, it takes years to understand how to make it work.  And then, you realize just how simple a program scouting really is.  

 

- Unit commissioners are the unicorns of scouting.  Wonderful magical fairy-tail creatures that are proclaimed and counted, but never seen.  IMHO, it's a fundamental part of scouting that is broken.  

 

- An Eagle scout has zero experience to be qualified as a unit commissioner.  The scout side is different than the adult side.  UCs have to learn how to deal with adult agendas such as dealing with the self-interest of leaders who are also parents of the scouts.  

 

- IMHO, the UC is one of several BSA core components that are fundamentally broken and I just don't see how you can fix it.  Period.  It needs a new vision. 

Edited January 11, 2016 by fred johnson

[SSScout 1616]

John in KC:  I agree with your perspective.   The UC should be more of a "Dutch Uncle" than an "Enforcer".   He/she needs Scout experience and training.  They need to have the "glad hand" rather than the "iron hand". 

She/he should be able to tie a square knot and be sympathetic to the vagaries of life.  It would be good if they had had a good Scout experience in their yoooth, but not necessarily. 

I know , IMHE, that I have been called upon to voice opinion on "what should be done" and have had to say "this is what NEEDS to be done" .

 

I wish more Scoutmaster Emeriti would become Commissioners. 

[perdidochas 658]

Okay, riddle me this Joker..... What's all this sage advice to the newbies who know very little if anything about scouting, looking for an entry-level position, etc. and UC turns up as a viable option.  With the UC one of the Key-3 of every unit what's with the newbie being part of that?  With units struggling, financially hurting, flipping CO's, riding out personality conflicts, dumping leadership personnel, folding up units, etc. why are we putting that all on a the new guy?

 

One would think that if nothing else, the old SM's who have all their boys Eagled out, and they want to keep their fingers on the pulse of a unit would be the better candidate.

 

A newbie Eagle, walks into the Scout office and volunteers.  They make him a UC that is the go-to person for when things turn sour, or the go-to person when the unit needs a bump push to the next level, or the go-to person that feeds the latest and greatest info from the council to the unit.  Yep, it's the new guy.

 

Why does this recommendation not seem all that productive to me?  And yes, I have a personal ax to grind with this issue.

well based on our UC, who is an Eagle from our troop from about 10 years ago, I agree with you. It's not a good place for a 20-something year old young man.  UC should be somebody who has been a unit leader/assistant at some point.  I may become a UC when my boys age out. 

[Sentinel947 1205]

Agreed with Fred. Nothing I did as a youth could prepare me to be a UC. Young adults, recently aged Eagles can best provide service as unit level ASMs or OA advisors. We're still learning to be an adult. Even now at 22 I still have no exposure to rechartering, or any of the administrative aspects of running a BSA troop. I'm a program side guy, I leave the admin and the politics to those who have the experience to be good at it.

[MattR 2667]

- BSA training is introductory at best.  Maybe Woodbadge has more depth.  Otherwise, comments about who is trained really just reflect who cared enough to take the first step in learning about scouting.  Beyond that, it takes years to understand how to make it work.  And then, you realize just how simple a program scouting really is.  

 

- Unit commissioners are the unicorns of scouting.  Wonderful magical fairy-tail creatures that are proclaimed and counted, but never seen.  IMHO, it's a fundamental part of scouting that is broken.  

 

- An Eagle scout has zero experience to be qualified as a unit commissioner.  The scout side is different than the adult side.  UCs have to learn how to deal with adult agendas such as dealing with the self-interest of leaders who are also parents of the scouts.  

 

- IMHO, the UC is one of several BSA core components that are fundamentally broken and I just don't see how you can fix it.  Period.  It needs a new vision. 

My experience with UC's agrees with a lot of this. My first one was an older guy that did nothing to help me. The next guy was fairly good but mostly helped by giving me an ear. He was so busy fighting some serious fires (drunk SMs, etc) that he didn't see a need to help me. I currently don't have a UC.

 

It could have been a huge help to make up for all the other training that has good ideas but is so vague as to be of no help.

[John-in-KC 311]

I currently don't have a UC.

 

Not true.  You always have a commissioner.  You can call your District Commissioner, and ask for help.  He or she is supposed to either furnish you the assistance you need in person, or provide you a commish to help.

 

Now, if the District Nominating Committee has a problem, and there isn't a District Commissioner, you call the Council Commish.  Ditto.

 

In fact, you can work this all the way up to Tico as the National Commish.  That WILL make things exciting in your Council, when the SE gets a call from the National Commish.  Professionals tend to avoid being in the deer in the headlights

Edited January 13, 2016 by John-in-KC

[Krampus 696]

Not true.  You always have a commissioner.  You can call your District Commissioner, and ask for help.  He or she is supposed to either furnish you the assistance you need in person, or provide you a commish to help.

 

 

Actually, In my district we have 1 UC for all of our units....on paper. In reality we have no UCs. Ask for one you will hear silence.

[Stosh 3452]

Had a visit with the DC last night at our scout meeting. 

 

UC training will now be done at the UC monthly meeting instead of the 3-hour long session at the scout office.

 

We will be discussing the idea I suggested on the forum of a Commissioner Corps instead of a UC assignment structure.  The DC indicated it wouldn't be a stretch in that the structure of the training committee recently adopted such a structure and will be sending out instructors to units as needed when asked.  It wouldn't take much to implement it for the commissioners as well. 

 

We covered the issue of newbie UC's as well and they would be teamed up and mentored by the more experienced UC's in the group eventually taking point on a unit situation and evaluated by the mentor as they got more comfortable with the role.  On a monthly basis the Corps would discuss the unit situations and learn as a whole.  This would also offer up an opportunity to draw from the experiences of all the UC's for each situation in the district, not just the one or two assigned to help.  It would also help the newbies get an understanding of how UC's are able to assist.

 

This way the units that didn't want UC support wouldn't tie up a UC and those that needed help would get help right away.

 

The UC's meet tomorrow night before RT.

[fred johnson 936]

This way the units that didn't want UC support wouldn't tie up a UC and those that needed help would get help right away.

 

I think that would be an important change.  A "triage" of how the units are going, where the fires are and who needs and/or wants help.  No need to waste names assigned to units.  No need to burn units by assigning UCs that never show up.  Create a structure that continually reviews the health of the units.  That would be a small but meaningful improvement.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

In fact, you can work this all the way up to Tico as the National Commish.  That WILL make things exciting in your Council, when the SE gets a call from the National Commish.  Professionals tend to avoid being in the deer in the headlights

 

Try having the retired CSE as a UC in your district. Yep Brock is now a UC somewhere in my council.

[MattR 2667]

Not true.  You always have a commissioner.  You can call your District Commissioner, and ask for help.  He or she is supposed to either furnish you the assistance you need in person, or provide you a commish to help.

 

Now, if the District Nominating Committee has a problem, and there isn't a District Commissioner, you call the Council Commish.  Ditto.

 

In fact, you can work this all the way up to Tico as the National Commish.  That WILL make things exciting in your Council, when the SE gets a call from the National Commish.  Professionals tend to avoid being in the deer in the headlights

 

Well, okay, but the DC is an ASM in my troop. So, for all intents and purposes, no UC. But my DE likes talking to me and does know scouts, so I'm good with it. The sad thing is I talk to my DC and just hear horror stories of the types of problems they deal with. Boy led is something they dream of talking about. More like finding a SM, kids smoking weed (oh wait, that was my troop), tons of pissed off parents, parents that won't participate, the occasional drunk scouter, rechartering, Eagle project nightmares, wrecked canoes, the list goes on.