acco40

As my brother has told me, quitting smoking is easy, I've done it numerous times. The best way to quit smoking is not to start. Again, some children (and it seems some adults) have a hard time separating bad behavior (smoking) with bad people. Yes, good people do smoke. The pleasures of the flesh make many weak (smoking, eating, drinking, to say the least).

First of all, Scouting is an "open" activity. No one is denied access. In my troop, all parents are allowed, sometimes as observers only, to all meetings and outings (PLC, Committee, Scoutmaster, troop, etc.). Second, the CO approves and possibly selects leaders for a Unit, not the SM. In practicality, in most troops, the SM and or CC run up potential leaders to the CO who gives final approval. Third, many a SM has been frustrated by parents who don't understand scouting. The parents either view it as a family "camping club", repeatedly "help out" with tasks that should be done by the boys, etc. The simple, easy and wrong response by a SM would be to ban parents. P.S. If you happen to be male, it is equally important you understand the boy-run concept and furthermore essential that you be a competent and self-sufficient camper yourself, to set an example for the troop and reduce any distraction your presence might pose.(This message has been edited by acco40)

Awards should be given in a timely fashion after they are earned. At the Cub Scout level for Tiger, Wolf and Bear many individuals can act as "Akela." Parents, grandparents, teachers, etc. can all be Akela and sign off on requirements. For a Webelos den, the Webelos leader or his/her designee are the only ones who can sign off on requirements. Once signed off, the CM, CC or UC should not question the Scouts. By the way, my wife if CC for a pack that I am a UC for. I'm also a Webelos den leader for the same Pack. However, I've kept my UC spot pretty much underwraps (just became UC in Oct.) and will be leaving the Pack as den leader this week. As for my wife, as soon as we can find a replacement CC, she will "retire." Our sons will have all gone on to Boy Scouts. I like the idea of contacting the ADC or DC if you seem to be having a problem with your UC. The UC should not be giving advice unless asked. He/she is there to help things, not run things.(This message has been edited by acco40)(This message has been edited by acco40)

Cabin camping does not count toward OA camping requirement either.

Electoral college - rural vs. urban In the USA, the votes are based on population, not geographical size. If the Chicago area contains 50% of the state population, they should get 50% of the "vote." Doesn't matter that the Chicago area is only 1% of the state.

Following in Quixote's footsteps: The banning of controlled substances would prohibit anyone from taking prescription medications (a controlled substance) during my summer camp (a BSA owned facility with youth participants). Lawyers be damned. Don't smoke in view or smell of the youth. If they happen to see you smoke, YOU are at fault, not them.

With Bush, Iraq is personal, North Korea is not. Heck, SH tried to have his father assassinated. assassin - from Arabic hashshAshIn, plural of hashshAsh one who smokes or chews hashish As for the politics, as they say, money talks BS (not Boy Scouts) walks.

Along a similar vein, A year ago I had a den leader who wanted to include both of his sons in his den. He used that as a stipulation for volunteering to become a den leader. The boys were a year apart in age and in school year. He wanted the older boy to work on his Wolf along with his younger son (2nd and 3rd graders at the time). I told him that the third grader should be in the Bear program, regardless of his lack of previous Cub Scout experience. After awhile, he finally understood but wanted them in the same den regardless; one working on Wolf and one on Bear {den was primarily Wolfs (Wolves?)}. Although I highly recommended that he did not try to work both programs in the same den I believe there is really no rule against it. Possibly later as a Webelos den, rules may prevent non-Webelos in the den. Any comments?

Bob White, you refer to Cub Scout requirements prohibiting a 9 year old from earning his AOL. I do not believe this to be correct. Similar to Boy Scout joining requirements, I only know of grade requirements OR age (Be active in Webelos 6 months since 4th grade OR becoming 10 years old.) Am I missing something?

Sign of the times: "He treats us like men. He lets us wear earrings." --Torrin Polk, University of Houston receiver on his coach John Jenkins.

I was a registered Scouter (Den Leader) and when my older son joined a Boy Scout Troop I filled out an application to be an ASM (continuing to be a den leader). Fast forward to two years later and I was asked to become Scoutmaster. Lo and behold, the previous SM never turned in my application for ASM (even though I took leader specific training and outdoor training for SM). Being dual registered with the den leader as my primary position, I was not aware that I should have received two registration cards. The only way I found out was when I was helping with rechartering and found out I was never properly registered in the first place! Live and learn.

It is my understanding that your son lists/asks for individuals to give letters of recommendation for him. However, he will never see those letters. After the Eagle board of review get finished with them, they are destroyed. I admit, I'm struggling to remember what I've had in training on this subject. I've never had to deal with the process directly.

UN resolutions were passed with respect to Iraq. Iraq has violated those resolutions. Now the question becomes, what does the UN or any other independent country do about it? The UN has no real standing army. The UN has passed resolutions that we (USA) have not been too enamored with and have choosen to ignore. No one doubts that Saddam is a "bad guy." After listening to Powell yesterday, I say we have legitimate reasons for attacking Iraq (violation of UN resolutions). But the USA has a very long track record of NOT attacking every tyrant in the world who uses force, torture, etc. for his own personal gain. With Saddam & Bush it is personal. Why did Reagan/Bush support Saddam with cash and money when fighting Iran? He is no different now than he was then. Getting rid of Saddam is the easy part. What to do with Iraq afterwards is the difficult task. We better have an answer for that before we pull a "regime change."

Have them come over to my house and see who can do the dishes the fastest! We have held cooking contests where the boys need to plan and cook a meal with a strict spending limit. The task may be cook a dinner for under $30 that feeds a patrol of eight. Each patrol goes off and plans, purchases and then cooks the meal (and cleans up). This takes at least two troop meetings. The judges can either be the SPL/ASPL or the SM/ASMs (taste tester). After the official taste test, everyone eats! The "finals" are usually held during the monthly outing.(This message has been edited by acco40)

I believe that a "chat" could possibly augment a PLC meeting but not replace it. You lose so much online by not being able to read tone, voice inflection, body language, etc. We need to teach the boys how to deal with people. I also believe the "niceness" factor increases when in person vs. on-line (especially when on-line means anonymous).

Role models & behavior. We should not make role models the occupation of Saints only. Take for example the behavior of smoking. I don't smoke, my parents and some of my siblings did. My children were taught, by the public school system that smoking is "bad." Young children have a very difficult time differentiating bad behavior from bad people. They were confused when told smoking was bad and that their beloved grandmother smoked. Was she a role model for the grand kids? You bet she was. Children (and some adults) need to know that good people can have bad habits. They also saw their grandmother struggle with COPD and eventually die from complications from it. That was a wonderful lesson for them. They saw first hand that tobacco use can have detrimental effects. The same goes for obesity. Our culture gives out enough "anti-fat" karma already but seeing the former Scoutmaster (+300 lbs) who could not do many of the activities that they could did NOT give them the impression that it was okay to be overweight. The best teaching we can give youngsters is "cause and effect" which works much better than lectures. I'm not in favor of obese, smoking, homosexual, atheists as leaders but we should also not be so quick to judge others. Statistically, the above behaviors have been shown to be detrimental to ones health. Exact cause and effect have not been proven for all of them. And yes, there are healthy obese, smoking, homosexual atheists out there. We should be honoest with our children. They are much more perceptive than what we give them credit for.

To diverge slightly from the Don't ask, I'll tell ... debate. In the early 70's, females were not allowed to hold all adult leadership positions within the BSA. For example, females could be den mothers but not Cubmasters. Without arguing the merits of this policy, how did the policy change of allowing female leaders now hold CM, SM, etc. positions come about? Did anyone have their membership revoked for debating this topic either in private or public? I'm guessing that public and private discourse both weighed in the decision. Can anyone elighten me on this topic?(This message has been edited by acco40)

A little like pulling teet? I assume that that was a typo but dare I ask what the correction should have been?

Who exactly is "they?" I am a Webelos den leader and a Scoutmaster. There always seems to be a confusion of who does the den chief work for, the troop or the den. In practicality, the den chief works for the den or den leader. A troop can't force a den chief onto a den, but conversely, a den leader can only ask for a den chief which is ultimately a Boy Scout position. My experience is that a boy who decides that he wants to become a den chief makes himself available to a pack or den and then works very closely with the den leader. It is important for the den leader to realize that the den chief position is an opportunity for the den chief to learn and hone his leadership skills. Unfortunately, too many young Boy Scouts see PL and SPL as prestige positions and may not look as highly at the den chief position. I think the position provides an excellent training ground for future leaders especially if the den leader empowers the den chief to do his role.

That, BW, is a very reasonable policy. I just wanted to make clear that not agreeing 100% with all of the BSA's policies does not automatically make one a candidate for expulsion. Their is a proper and a non-proper way to go about change as you have stated. I remember a few years ago when the Supreme Court decision was first made, a group of Scouters in the St. Louis area (I read an article in the St. Louis Post-Dispatch) wanted to form a parallel scouting organization that accepted gay leaders. I emailed to them my opinion that if they wanted to change the BSA policy that they should work within the system to change it. Voice their displeasure to 'national' in a constructive way. My family happens to be very involved in the Trails End popcorn fund raiser at the unit, district and council level (#4 in the nation mind you). This past year we had a handful of stores that had granted us access for store sales in the past, deny us access and the stated reason was that they disagreed with the BSA policy. Although I feel they were somewhat misinformed, it was well within their legal right to do so. When I passed along this fact to my Council Executive, without stating any of my beliefs (nothing but the facts) the CE got pretty defensive and argumentative with me. I guess he just did not want to deal with the subject. By the way, it was brought up one on one and not in "public."

"The BSA doesn't distinguish between an avowed homosexual and a person who speaks out against the BSA." Be careful here BW. What exactly do you mean by "speaking out against the BSA?" You want to make changes for commissioners with respect to roundtables. Is that speaking out against the BSA? IMO, no. NJCubScouter may want to change the BSA policies on sexual identity. Is that speaking out against the BSA? You may argue that one is a procedure and one a basic "ethic" or "moral" but I believe that is hollow. I agree with NJ and the BSA about the Declaration of Religious Principles "... but is absolutely non-sectarian in its attitude toward that religious training." OBEDIENT. A Scout follows the rules of his family, school, and troop. He obeys the laws of his community and country. If he thinks these rules and laws are unfair, he tries to have them changed in an orderly manner rather than disobey them.

BW is correct, CC and SM (or CM) is a problem waiting to happen. One committee position that I think can work out rather well and sometimes even better than a non-family member, is Advancement Chair and SM. From a record keeping and database management perspective, keeping it all under one roof sometimes aid the process (one computer/notebook, easily reviewed by both, etc.). I'm an SM and I specifically DO NOT want my signature on the Troop checkbook. Although I agree that the Committee answers to the CO, I really believe the Committee should help support what the SM needs to carry out the program. That does not mean that the SM dictates to the Committee, but if the boys want to go to Philmont, for example, have made a good thought out plan, the Committee should help "make it happen." Another example, when the boys and I (SM) put together the annual planning (troop calendar & themes) the Committee reviews it and either supports it or turns it down. They don't have line item veto power!

In southeastern Michigan, check with John Dyer-Hurdon who "runs" a local Scouting Museum in Washington, Michigan (just north of Detroit). See: www.ojibwa-cvc.org/museum.htm

I have the following Merit Badges from that era: Atomic Energy, Cinematography, Computers, Electronics, Environmental Science, and Space Exploration Sorry, couldn't resist. Congratulations to the the "young" man on his accomplishments. I wish I could help. Earning his Eagle at 14 years of age was quite an accomplishment in those days (still is if you ask me).

One of the tasks that I believe both Presidents Clinton and Bush did/do very well is in comforting the nation after tradegy. Clinton after the Oklahoma City bombing and other occasions and Bush after 9/11, Shuttle, etc. That is a task that I would find very difficult to do.