BrentAllen

packsaddle, You said you understand why I didn't respond - well, you are wrong again. As I have said before on this site (I even gave you the answer earlier), I haven't studied the issue enough to make my own opinion. I have two problems with this whole ESC issue. 1. The issue is a moral problem for a substantial number of citizens, and their tax dollars shouldn't be used to perform it - similar to federal funding of abortion. 2. I am sick of seeing it hyped and politicized - John Edwards saying if you vote for him, spinal cord patients will walk again. Back when the Georgia flag was a hot issue, I was strongly against changing it (surprise?). I had a long discussion with a black friend, and he pointed out that he didn't care if I flew the flag at my house or anywhere else. The State flag, however, represented all Georgians, and many black residents found if offensive. I agreed after hearing his argument. Take the same approach to ESC. Many residents are against abortion and against ESC. Using their tax dollars to promote the issue is offensive to them, and against their religious views. I can see their point. Now, you would have to go ask each and every one of them Gern's question. I don't have their answers. I'll try to read up on the issue, in between my one hour a week (per hat, per boy, per......)

FB, I have been through a similar experience, in the Highpower rifle game. Many of us got to know each other through web pages similar to this one, and we then started meeting at the National Matches. For the most part, it is a very enjoyable experience. The online conversations become more meaningful and personable, as you can imagine. Many highpower shooters get to see each other every year at the championships, so some real friendships develope. The funny thing is many of these people were going to the matches for years, but never got to know each other - there just weren't that many opportunities to do so in the schedule. But now shooters set up places to meet after the matches, and find out where others are staying, so they can look them up. Too bad we don't have an annual event like that where everyone gets together. Heh, the 2007 National Annual Meeting will be held in Atlanta, in May. Anyone planning on attending?

"BTW, in the federal vs. private funding argument, federal funds generally make up anywhere from 50% to 75% (depending on the year) of funds that have been availabe for biomedical research." Source please. Mine says otherwise. "According to a 2005 study in the Journal of the American Medical Association: "Biomedical research funding increased from $37.1 billion in 1994 to $94.3 billion in 2003 and doubled when adjusted for inflation." Fifty-seven percent of biomedical research dollars came from industry and 28 percent from the National Institutes of Health (NIH). The JAMA study added that in 2003,"the United States spent an estimated 5.6 percent of its total health expenditures on biomedical research, more than any other country." In July 2006, the research lobbying group, Research!America, estimated that by 2005, health care research spending had risen to more than $111 billion. Of that total, industry spent $61 billion, government paid out $37 billion, and universities, states and philanthropies shelled out $13 billion. Total U.S. research and development expenditures, according to the American Association for the Advancement of Science, rose to $312 billion in 2004, nearly two-thirds ($200 billion) of it coming from private industry. Private industry and the government in the United States together provide 35 percent of the world's total R&D funding." http://www.reason.com/news/show/36942.html CDC is certainly part of providing for the common defense, regarding chemical warfare, if nothing else.

Yes, Gern, and the expenditures on Missle Defense, the atomic bomb and the war on terror all are towards a primary mission of the federal government - to "provide for the common defense..." From Time magazine, a good explanation on the difference between the atom bomb and stem cells: "Even the true believers among scientists, however, dispute eager politicians who have called for a Manhattan Project approach to research. "I hate to say it, but biology is more complicated than splitting the atom," Witte says. "The physicists on the Manhattan Project knew what they needed to accomplish and how to measure it. In biology, we're codeveloping our measurement tools and our outcome tools at the same time." Indeed, a massive centralized effort controlled by the Federal Government could do more harm than good. The key is to have the broadest cross section of scientists possible working across the field. When it comes to such an impossibly complicated matter as stem cells, the best role for legislators and Presidents may be neither to steer the science nor to stall it but to stand aside and let it breathe." Two years for the cure? That is exactly the hype and false hope clowns like John Edwards have sold you. I'm sorry if you think that the only thing preventing a cure from being discovered is federal dollars - that just isn't the truth. If people voted for Democrats over Republicans based on that logic, we are doomed as a country. Look, I hope all kinds of cures develope from stem cell research. I'm just sick and tired of all the hype, deception and blame-gaming. The facts are more therapies and cures are being developed from adult stem cells and umbilical cord-blood cells than from embryonic stem cells. But that doesn't matter to all you Bush haters - you just have to find something else to slam him on, and I'm sick and tired of it. He is a Christian man who prays for guidance. He is a faithful family man who stands for his beliefs. I think these are things we teach in Scouting.

ladyleader, Yes, that is one of the main points of WB - building high performance teams to achieve a goal, and leading and dealing with change. WB won't cause the situation you face to change over night, but it will give you the knowledge and confidence to develope a plan, to create a vision, to implement the changes you desire (get more parents involved, spread the load,...). Some might suggest you get more experience (wait a few more years) before you attend, but I think you are a prime candidate for WB, based on your post. The tiny amount of overall knowledge you might gain in a year or two about the BSA isn't going to make much of a difference in dealing with the challenges you face, whereas WB training goes right to the heart of dealing with those issues. I strongly recommend you attend the earliest session you can. Good luck! p.s. - they aren't slackers, they are potential leaders! :-) (ok, some might be slackers ;^) )

Oak Tree, Your math on the percentages is wrong. That 1 million Scouts will change somewhere around 1/4 each year. There are over 660,000 Webelos, a little less than half will be Webelos II's. A high number of them will at least cross over and try Boy Scouts. Even those who join and only attend one meeting are counted in determining the percentage. With all those Webelos II's coming in, and the overall number staying around 1 million, that means an equal number must age out or drop out each year. So, for the sake of this argument, let's assume there are 250,000 coming in new each year. My guess is the average age of Scouts earning Eagles is 15, taking them 4 years to earn the rank. If so, there will be close to 1 million new Scouts (250,000 x 4 years) join during those 4 years, in addition to the 1 million who were in when the Scout first started as an 11 year old. That means there have probably been close to 2 million different boys in the Boy Scouts during the 4 years it took a 15 year old to earn Eagle. My numbers come out to 2.5%, which may be low, but give credence to the 5% figure. For your numbers to hold up, the boys would have to be earning Eagle in one or two years, which isn't happening. Why do some people just assume the BSA is lying about everything? If I felt that way, I wouldn't be a part of this organization.

packsaddle writes: "The pattern is clear enough by now that I hope most of us can see it." Unfortunately, the only pattern I see clearly is a lot of hype. But since you see it clearly, please give me the details. What cures are coming, and when will they be here? It has been 5 + years since Bush authorized the federal funding. Other companies have been performing the research for years before that. You and Gern KNOW the cures are right around the corner, so give me the details. Most objective reports I read say IF any cures materialize, they are 15 - 20 years away. They were probably saying the same thing 5 years ago. Take the politics out of it, and there is still a huge question mark about any results. I just hate seeing all this framed in a way that Bush is keeping certain cures from being developed. THAT isn't truthful.

AnEagle, In Scouts, we teach the Buddy System - you always take a buddy with you when camping or hiking. Nearly every year there is Scout who gets lost in the woods, and a good number of them aren't found. A few years ago, out in Utah I think, a Scout was fishing with some others and fell in the lake and got wet. He went back to camp, by himself, to change clothes and disappeared. I don't think they ever found him. Camp was only a couple hundred yards from where they were fishing. Which brings me to two other points - wear the best piece of safety equipment out there around your neck - a loud whistle. Secondly, if you do get lost, stop moving! Blow your whistle to call for help (3 blasts is the international distress call). Moving in the wrong direction will just make finding you that much harder.

Yes, it is Trev. I wish we could make them see the future! Every time I walk past the NESA row at the Scout Shop (which is often) I get a knife in the gut as a reminder of my stupidity. The only advice I can offer, which doesn't come with much experience to date, is to ask some of the other adults to ask him about his progress in a very upbeat manner. As we all know, there can be lots of baggage between a father and son. Maybe start asking who he plans to invite to his COH, and talk about how proud everyone is going to be of him. That old Stephen Covey "Begin with the end in site" thing. Good luck! I look forward to reading about him earning his Eagle!

Ah, if only we could... Or at least turn back the clock. I had completed my service project, but was 2 merit badges short (Personal Management and Communications - I still have my Scout Handbook with all the details). Dear old dad kept pushing me to finish, but the more he pushed, the more I pushed back. Yes, I was an idiot. So now, in an effort to turn lemons into lemonaide, I hope to convince a lot of Life Scouts not to be a dunderhead like I was.

It's amazing the correlation between those who are so negative about popcorn (or anything else) and their units losing membership. Hmmmmm.... Can't never could. We are in an area with 7 Packs and 6 Troops within a 10 mile radius. These are fairly large units. Our Pack has 120 boys. I can step out my front door and see 4 houses with Scout families. One could look at the numbers and convince themselves that the market is saturated, that there is no way they are going to sell any popcorn. Or they could just go sell popcorn. I set a goal of $150 in sales per boy for our Pack, for a grand total of $18,000. This was a modest increase from the $16,500 we sold last year. The boys really took it to heart this year, and blew away my goal - they sold $26,577! Our top seller was over $3,100. So, please, don't tell me it is over-priced or deceitful or give me any other excuses. We are teaching the boys to pay for the programs we bring to the Pack, that they need to carry their weight. They are earning this money, not just having mommy and daddy pull out their wallet. Many people probably think Corvettes are over-priced, but there are plenty of salesmen making very good livings selling them. I believe that is the essence of salesmanship - convincing the buyer of the value of the entire product - popcorn, Council, unit programs.

AnEagle, Just to clarify, the Boy Scout Handbook and the Boy Scout Fieldbook are two entirely different books. The Handbook contains the Boy Scout advancement program and merit badges. The Fieldbook is an instructional book covering nearly all outdoor activities. Ah, to be back in college.... :-)

Hunt, I can't recall any Republican promising they were going to over-turn the don't ask/don't tell policy. Please show me who, what and when. Our school has a moment of silence each morning, which is exactly what I want. No complaints there. On the other hand, Republicans promised to deliver a vote on gay marriage, and have done pretty well on that issue. I don't see your argument holding much water. BadenP, We don't have a huge DEFICIT, we do have a large DEBT. Do you know the difference? The DEFICIT has been cut in half, three years ahead of the schedule Bush proposed three years ago. I have taken plenty of Economics classes at the Georgia Institute of Technology, College of Management. Since it appears you don't know the difference between DEFICIT and DEBT, I suggest you attend ECON 101. Also, Rumsfeld was Sect. of Defense. Does the SECDEF now set economic policy?(This message has been edited by BrentAllen)

Sue M, If possible, I would like to take a look at your materials as well. I have been invited to serve as a TG for our Council's summer course, in August. This is one challenge I want to be extremely prepared for. iballen@mindspring.com

My best advice is to head to your local Scout Shop and pick up a copy of the BSA Field Book. I think you will find it to be very informative and a pleasure to read. Your Scout Shop might also have books dedicated just to hiking. In addition to the other suggestions mentioned, if in a large group that might split up, set a time interval for rest breaks (start with around 15 - 20 minutes). This allows everyone to catch up (wait for the sweeper/drag to arrive). If someone in the rear has turned an ankle, the rest of the group won't get too far down the trail before they realize what has happened. The rest breaks also tend to keep everyone hydrated (water bottles usually come out), and they are a great time for everyone to check for hot spots (early sign of a blister forming).

Gern, actually.... Bush was the first president to authorize federal funding for stem cell research. He did not kill the funding, he just kept it from expanding to cover new cell lines.

Hunt writes: "By contrast, the Republicans have done little to deliver to the social conservatives to whom they pandered to get elected." Please explain further. Did they not pass a partial birth abortion ban? Did they not let the fantastically-misnamed "assault weapons ban" expire without renewal? If you are waiting on Roe vs. Wade being overturned, don't hold your breath. As much as I disagree with abortion, I think it is here to stay. Hopefully, there will just be fewer and fewer of them. Please explain the promises that were made, but weren't delivered. You may be correct - I'm just curious of your views.

BadenP, Speaking of keeping your word, I believe you said you were adding me to you ignore list. What happened? Yes, I did get that very nasty email you sent me - do you want me to post it to jog your memory? Such harsh words - from a minister?!?! Or did one of your friends steal your password again? That was a good one! By the way, I have never claimed to be a DE, as you mentioned. I am a volunteer - a Cubmaster and District Activities Chair. Please get your insults straight. Let's see - Republican economics have produced a record market, extremely low unemployment, low interest rates and low inflation. All that - with a minimum wage of $5.15, and low taxes. How is it possible??? Democrats have always pandered to the poor. They have convinced the poor that they need the Democrats in power to help them survive. That only the government can help them take care of themselves and their families. This is common knowledge. Bush proposed a guest worker program; it is not amnesty. My guess is you will see the Dems pushing amnesty. I think that would be a huge mistake.

packsaddle, The minimum wage argument is not really about those on the bottom. There are union jobs which have wages based on multiples of the minimum wage. A increase in the minimum wage means a big increase to union positions. Also, small companies that are forced to pay higher wages to entry level workers will be forced to reduce their work force - laying off workers. Those laid off workers are now looking at zero income, which I think would qualify as poverty.

Ooops - that should have been "councilwide PRODUCT sale..." not "produce sale.."

From The Boston Globe: "Lieberman refuses to close door on switching parties November 12, 2006 HARTFORD, Conn. --Sen. Joe Lieberman on Sunday repeated his pledge to caucus with Senate Democrats when the 110th Congress convenes in January, but refused to slam the door on possibly moving to the Republican side of the aisle. Asked on NBC's "Meet the Press" if he might follow the example of Sen. Jim Jeffords of Vermont, who left the Republicans in 2001 and became an independent, ending Republican control of the U.S. Senate, Lieberman refused to discount the possibility. "I'm not ruling it out but I hope I don't get to that point," he said. "And I must say -- and with all respect to the Republicans who supported me in Connecticut -- nobody ever said, 'We're doing this because we want you to switch over. We want you to do what you think is right and good for our state and country,' and I appreciate that." A spokeswoman for Lieberman would not elaborate when contacted by The Associated Press. Greenwich businessman Ned Lamont defeated Lieberman in the Democratic primary in August. Lieberman was elected to a fourth term last Tuesday as an independent, and said Sunday his political affiliation will be as an "Independent Democrat." The Democrats won control of the Senate with 51 seats. Lieberman and newly elected Bernie Sanders of Vermont are the Senate's only Independents. A switch to the Republicans would bring the Senate to a 50-50 division, giving Republican Vice President Dick Cheney opportunities to break tie votes. Jeffords' decision to quit the GOP and become an independent tipped the balance of an evenly divided Senate, handing control to the Democrats with a one-vote margin." My guess is Lieberman is milking this for all it is worth - and I can't say I blame him. He has the Dems over a barrel, and can probably get just about anything he wants. These opportunities don't present themselves often, or if at all. Cash them in when you can.

Eamonn, Where are you quoting the following from? When Not To Wear The Uniform: "Do not wear the uniform while selling a commercial product or service, even for Scout fundraising purposes. Are you saying the boys shouldn't wear their uniforms when selling popcorn? My Cub Leader book says uniforms may be worn: "During a councilwide produce sale or event authorized by the local council's executive board." We may be saying the same thing - just want to verify.

Easy, there Hunt - you better look a little more closely at the results of Tuesday. Yes, Democrats won and Republicans lost, but if you think liberalism won and conservatism lost, you would be incorrect. A lot of the Democrats that won are pretty conservative. In one of the biggest races, the liberal Democrat lost to a moderate/conservative Independent - Lieberman sent liberal Lamont packing. Heath Schuler is pretty conservative. Jim Webb used to be a Republican, serving under Reagan. It is going to be interesting how these conservative Democrats work with the liberal wing of the party.

Am I cynical of everyone I disagree with? No. There are some people I disagree with whom I admire, and enjoy debating. Am I cynical of you? Yes. Why? I think all this "he said 'no doubt'" mumbo-jumbo is exactly that. I don't know if you are going through all these contortions to bash Bush while deflecting for the Democrats, or for some other reason, but to me, your arguments make absolutely no sense. Sorry I hit a raw nerve, but for you to think you are going to see enough intelligence to make an informed opinion about decisions affecting our national security - and then offer an opinion which the president should consider - I think you are delusional! If you want to send the president or your representatives your opinion on gay marriage or other domestic issues, I think you should, and your opinion should be considered. If you need help in your community on a certain issue, I think you should be able to write your elected officials and request their assistance - and you should receive a response. But on matters of national security, where 90% of the pertinent information is classified, how are you ever going to make an informed decision? In that respect, I think you are naive.

pack, You are starting to crack me up, heh, heh, but I need a good laugh every now and then. You write: "My input to the decision would have been to demand this information from my representatives." So, a form letter from Isakson or Chamblis or your Rep. would really allow you to make an informed decision? Come on! You would have written the President of your informed opinion based on the intelligence cleared to be sent out to anyone who asked? You must have some mighty powerful tea leaves! What exactly would you have written to Bush? This I want to see.