skeptic

Sorry about not linking; just forgot that "I" have NESA on my favorites. Thanks for posting it.

Desert; I find a number of them a bit clumsy at least, and yes, even odd to some extent. But, they are jumping off points. Have seen a number of ceremonies that have been pasted from two or three of these. Whatever the scout and his family feels is good for them.

Oh my; NESA just did something useful. :-}>

NESA Presents the Eagle Scout Award Suggested Ceremonies Booklet

Out of print for more than 20 years, NESA is happy to bring this useful information to you. Heres what is in the updated piece:

Eagle Scout Awards Suggested Ceremonies BookletThe Eagle Scout Pledge

Ceremony 1: The Challenge

Ceremony 2: History of the Eagle and Man

Ceremony 3: Lighting the Eagle Trail

Ceremony 4: The Light of the Eagle

Eagle Scout Light Box

Ceremony 5: The Light of the Eagle (alternate wording)

Ceremony 6: An Eagle Scout

The Eagle Scout (poem)

Ceremony 7: Order of the Arrow

Ceremony 8: The Voice of the Eagle

Ceremony 9: The Picture Ceremony

Ceremony 10: Parents Ceremony

Eagle Scout Recognition Dinner

Ceremony 11: Citizenship Ceremony

Sample Mayoral Citation for Citizenship Ceremony

Ceremony 12: Alternate Opening Ceremony

Ceremony 13: Closing Ceremony

A huge Eagle Scout thanks goes out to Aloha Council (Honolulu, Hawaii) Scouter Kevin Doyle, who used OCR software to scan the old booklet, then he edited it and designed what you see here.

You likely can use any comfortable material, as long as you model the design after the vintage style, and have the correct color. For his size, you may have no other choice; but they do show up on eBay in larger sizes. But, they also tend to get pricey if they are complete and have anything collectible on them.

But, someone on this board may point you in the right direction. You might consider reposting in the collecting thread, or the uniform thread, just to get more viewings.

Yep; have had parents tell me they cannot find any of the info. Tell them to look in the handbook, on the inside covers, and they act as if that is not feasible. Maybe they are visually regressed, or cannot read. Makes you want to scream sometimes.

Brent: Okay, I tried to find specifics relating to the wear of uniforms in the National Rules and Bylaws. But all I could locate were the various protection clauses, which apply to other threads on these boards, including revocations, selling unauthorized items, or selling things obtained without proper authority. They do refer to "as referenced" in various publications.

So, you may be right in your statement regarding all or none. I suspect we might find contradictions between some manuals and other paper publications, depending on whom actually published them, and how old they are.

Certainly we should strive to get boys to be properly uniformed. But we should not make it an issue that will turn them away, either by embarrassment or lack of ability to pay.

JMHO

Directly from the actual Rules and Regulations; found while looking for any specifics regarding actually wearing the uniform. Could not find "any", other than referencing other publications. But, this certainly seems to deal directly with the question in this thread.

"Protection and Use of Badges and Insignia; National Rules and Regulations.

Clause 9: All badges and insignia shall remain the property of

the Boy Scouts of America subject to recall for cause by the

Corporation or its duly authorized representative."

So, while I realize many would say it is not relevant, uniforms "are not required", period; they are only recommended and encouraged. No where in the actual governing documents is having a uniform specified.

Now, if one does have one, certainly every effort should be made to have it worn correctly, and to have whatever belongs on it placed properly. But, again, there is no restriction on partial uniforms either, as that is viewed in many cases as better than none at all. Early on, scouts were encouraged to "earn" their uniform by various means; or to simply earn a part, such as the shirt, traditional smokey style hat, or just the neckerchief. Many units arranged to have neckerchiefs at least for their troops. Old photos very often show scouts with only a neckerchief, and possibly a hat.

Our uniform bank does hardly ever has enough pieces to make complete uniforms possible, but can start a boy often. Sizing is often the problem, as the only ones coming in are smalls, and boys already there have grown, and may be the donors looking to find one to fit. Granted, we are the oldest and poorest troop in town, serving the lowest income area, and always struggling to stay viable. The cool thing is that we have a number of very vintage, and one antique uniform we use for display.

Last night we had two boys in complete uniforms, one from the closet and that dates to the 50's, even with the red piping,and one current. They looked good. One had shirt up, including a neatly worn necker; three had just shirts (one always has to be reminded to tuck it in). I am almost always in complete uniform unless something unusual is going on, though I wear an older early 80's shirt to meeting normally, saving the more current last issue shirt for formal use. Like most of us around for a while, I have a number of shirts, each with different things on them. This "is" an improvement over last year; so I guess we are making progress. Three new boys, still have yet to get uniforms, but the grandfather of one, and mother of another said they hoped to go and get them soon.

Whatever they wear, they are welcome. Whatever they wear, they seem to usually have fun. That is the important part.

JMHO

Kinney was featured over the weekend in the PARADE MAGAZINE. He is shown as a 13 year old boy scout in a photo, and he is currently a cub leader for his son. Does anyone know if he became an Eagle; have not been able to find the info on line yet. May just be looking the wrong place. Just curious, as we all understand, or I hope we do, that Eagle is great, but not a complete reflection of scouting and its effect on youth.

See link below to read about Jack Pape, Life Scout who just won the 2011 American Spirit Award. What a great positive piece.

http://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2011/03/22/boy-scout-jack-pape-wins-2011-american-spirit-award/

While I have always, since the onset of the pin, encouraged my Eagles to give the pin to someone other than myself, explaining that surely there were adults who pushed, prodded, and inspired them to make the final effort, I do have one. And, it is worn proudly on my left pocket flap. Not in line with the guide (soon being left behind); so be it.

Maybe it is simply my age, but to me, having the "basics" down pat first if absolutely the most important issue. It is obvious to me that the kids who for whatever reason simply "learn" their times tables, for example, have far fewer problems later. It is obvious that kids who learn to read, and "sound out" words early, are generally more successful going forward in every subject. Fragmentation, and not enough focus in the first two or three grades appears to have very negative effects as the children progress (or it keeps them from actually progressing at grade level).

Some students will simply get it more quickly, but moving forward before they do is asking for failure, discouragement, and problems later.

JMHO

We have used the traditional travois as chariots at COR off and on for years, as well as at troop level. While they have no wheels, they are easily dragged, often modified with a fourth cross piece as a pusher. One scout rides on the device, and they have to redo the lashings at the spot,if it comes apart. You might be able to modify it to actually have wheels, but could become an issue of time and so on. Might allow patrols to bring their own wheeled spar, but still have to put it all together. Or, you might furnish the wheeled spar at the game site. Experience suggests that you might want to have helmets for the rider, and maybe even elbow and knee pads if desired. The kids love it, but the spills can be a bit scary on occasion.

As a credentialed teacher who has now subbed for over 12 years in all grade levels and 3 districts, I think I have a pretty good perspective on California schools.

It is definitely important that the parents be involved, and support the teacher and school. The schools that have open style set ups tend to have fewer problems overall, though there are still way too many. And, when I worked one of the charter schools, they seemed to have students that were more interested. Both types are far more family/parent related.

Every school is short staffed, short of supplies, and now trending towards over crowding in classes, even at the lower levels. Until a few years ago, it was obvious how important the class size restrictions from k-3 were. It was far easier to help kids and actually observe those struggling and give them additional encouragement. And they tended to be more attentive as well, partly due to the extra attention, but also because they soon learned it was not that easy to pass under the radar. The attention level seemed to continue into the first half of 4th, but then the kids began to realize they could get by with more, due to larger classes. And by 5th, the patterns were beginning to show as to whom would slide if they could. This is not helped, in my opinion, by requiring mainlining too many kids with various types of special issues. They tend to be far more disruptive and take a lot of the teacher's time, even when they have aides. This is not fair to the other kids, or at least that is my feeling.

Another thing that really gets to me are the numerous disruptions from outside the classroom by intercoms, phone calls, student messengers, or kids with assignments to collect recycling or see if they can help the smaller kids (they apparently get extra credit where this happens; but they just sort of show up). They also seem to have a lot of assemblies that give out ribbons and so on. Most of the kids are bored to death, and you have to watch them carefully, as they will easily find ways to cause mischief. Most of these awards could be given on the class level and take far less time from the actual teaching day.

At least in the districts in which I have worked, there is still some attempt towards exposing classes to music and art. But, it is no longer a regular part of the curriculum in most schools, and is dependent on parent volunteers or hourly temps. They also get P.E., but not every day. Many schools no longer have librarians except one or two days a week; so the teachers have that job added onto the others they already have. And psychologists and nurses are not in every school either, but spread throughout the districts. So far, high schools seem to have retained at least one counselor each, but the multiple counselors that were normal are no longer the case, with obvious ramifications.

Classrooms are no longer being cleaned daily, nor grounds tended regularly in most schools. This is also a factor in the way kids and parents see the school, even though they may not admit it. I can see a difference in classes where the regular teacher is strict in regard to cleaning up the room and keeping it neat; the kids tend to be less problematic and cooperative. HMMMMMMM!

The best teachers always find a way to succeed, and most are generally trying and somewhat successful. There are a few that concern me. They are either burned out, or really should not be in the job. But there are not nearly as many of these as you would think from some of the comments we see or hear. There are, in my opinion, too many superintendents with high salaries. Too many principals still seldom get involved with the students directly, especially in larger schools. This is partly due to the simply overly burdensome demands put on them. But, it would be great if they actually taught once or twice a month in various classes. You know what they say about being in the trenches.

Discipline is a real problem, and educators are paranoid about law suits. This leads to many ignoring whatever they can, rather than take the chance of being threatened by parents. And, as pointed out, expectations of actually doing the work is not there for many kids (and parents encourage this). Nor, do most schools seem to actually hold students responsible for much, unless it is extremely bad. Getting away with small infractions all the time simply leads to trying to do it with larger ones. And, grade inflation is rampant. Somehow, "average" is no longer acceptable. Getting a C is somehow like failure to many kids. Finally, somehow, the connection between basic language skills and elementary math as building blocks for everything else is lost. Reading, and as an extension, writing are "absolutely" required to be able to learn other subjects, even math beyond basic arithmetic. Yet, kids constantly are not given the early help when they need it, and become discouraged and eventually the most challenged simply give up. That of course leads to many of the the other problems already noted.

No easy answers. Certainly it is not the teachers' fault for the most part, though a few surely should be weeded out. In California, they pay into their own retirement, and they are not eligible for Social Security; so certainly they should not have that pulled out from beneath them. And, most, even after many years, only make a little more than $60k, while starting pay is less than $40K in most districts, with the likely hood of pink slips every year now, as well. Most dedicated teachers also spend large amounts of their own money for basic supplies today; at one time they spent that money on extra items to enhance the classroom experience.

Finally,those who continue to trumpet the short work days, and so on, please open your eyes and see the realities. Most teachers are at the schools a minimum of half an hour early, and many earlier; and they stay after for staff meetings, prep, special help classes, and grading. Then they take stuff home with them a lot of the time. Add on special evening activities, counseling clubs, and, especially the newer teachers, teaching summer school. And, at least in California, they also have to have at least 5 years of college, then get additional updated training.

Surely I have missed a lot. I should note that I too quit subbing in high school. After the 2nd physical threat in two assignments, I figured it was not worth it. And, now that I am older, I find myself sticking to the mostly 2nd through 5th, as the middle school kids are becoming more difficult; or I am simply losing my patience.

They have a short article on model kits for training airplane spotters. Six kits are listed as available, and scouts and troops are encouraged to build as many as possible to send to training groups to help better learn plane recognition.

Has anyone seen any of these? It would be cool to find one or two, built, or even better, not built.

Article by F.C. Mills, national director of health and safety. Quoting Yale Physiologist Dr. Howard Haggard. Mr. Mills is discussing the "new" health form issued at this time. Mr. Haggard is comparing routine maintenance of cars, to care of ourselves and our children.

"It is always amazing to me that people should se so clearly the necessity for correcting the defects of the inanimate machines _ the automobile; see so clearly the cause and effect there, but see it so poorly in regard to the living body. ............It is to me a startling commentary on our civilization of a mechanical age that we will give automobiles benefits that we will not give to school children."

Perhaps "snakes, snakes, snakes, as big as garden rakes?".

So, prof, have you ever done jack rabbit races, or similar events in your particular locale? I grew up in the high desert, and summer was tedious and hot, so you had too little to do. Jacks liked headlights, especially on the long, flat, straight two lane roads. So, we would go out when it was dark enough, and search for some new hares (their technical name) near each other, ones a bit too enamored of the lights, and set up the race. Each contestant puts his hare in one of the lanes; some used sticks for placement, but the "real" racers used their bare hands. Once happy with your lane spot, you counted back down the road the determined distance, say 50 feet, and turned to face your racer. At the sound of the starter's voice, you took off running, timing your speed and pace. At the last second you jumped and landed both feet down, balanced for best effect on your heels, but not so hard to hinder the "slide". Winner, of course, was the one who slid the farthest. On occasion, you had to have a slide off; now that was really tricky, as you can imagine the racers could be rather road worn after the initial slide. Fun in the desert in the late 50's. (:-}>

Too many hat pins give me a headache.

prof; You mean you do not dig "shredded mole pie?". Almost as good as roadkill stew.

No one will, or should be, bothered by a temporary special wearing of the sticker for supporting something.

JMHO

hops:

I love it. Thanks for the real eye opener. Never thought of it from the perspective of individual students. Send it to your local pols. If any actually respond, perhaps they might try to move positively. But don't hold your breath.

Not sure about your question; the Medal of Merit has no age limit. It is worn by anyone who has or had earned it, if they choose to do so. A scout would be encouraged to wear it, rather than the medal, except in formal events; just like the religious awards.

I will compromise on the idea. Only scouters who earned First Class prior to 1950 can wear one. That was when the earning of it was the most intensive, and when it was still considered to be the real highest rank, while the others were simply acknowledgements of more merit badges.

It was not until after WWII that National registered scouts as Star, Life, or Eagle; it was First Class with merit badges.

It is a unit award which recognizes the previous year's completion. My understanding is that "all" uniformed troop members wear it for the year it is in place, 2011. It should be removed the following year and replaced with whatever the new recognition might be, or left off if not earned this year. No one should be wearing the previous years' patches with others beneath them. Old ones go on a brag rag of some sort, or in a book, or wherever you put them.

Gentlemen and Ladies:

Why is it that so many that post on things here seem to only focus on perceived negatives of the subject thread? I suspect that a large percentage denigrating NESA already have not even bothered to actually look at the NESA site, or make the effort to find the possibilities it offers. Here is the link to the site. There are two sections; and yes one, with a few more items of interest, requires actual membership.

http://nesa.org/index.html

While I have been a life member for many years, deciding it was a good investment when it was $100 or a bit more, the actual cost is very low, even without life membership. Besides the scholarship support, it has the "potential" to be a truly viable instrument in councils, and camp support. They are working on improving it, and have done so. Yes, the changes are glacial, and often frustrating, but they move forward. The networking "possibilities" are potentially large, especially for younger members with more ability or desire to move about. The magazine revamp is very good, and has become far more interesting. There are areas in which they have tried to make it even more useful; but so far they have not really become particularly viable; but they can be.

As far as local NESA goes, those councils that have had the right people with the right foresight utilize the chapters for a myriad of support for the council programs. If your council does not have an active chapter, perhaps you could be the one to drag it into existence, rather than **** about how much of a waste of time it is, or a rip off.

"On my honor, I will do my Best". "To obey the SCOUT LAW". etc. Maybe we can all do a bit better to think about what these words and ideas mean, and then work to do "OUR BEST" wherever we may serve, and quit finding fault with things, rather than working to make them better.

JMO; off the soapbox.