scoutldr

Since it was a youth, and recent, I would ask the SM to have an SM conference about the meaning of "Trustworthy" and ask the scout what should be done to "fix the error". Ideally, scout should contact the lodge chief and ask that the "administrative error" be corrected as he turns in his Brotherhood sash. As appropriate "fix"? Restart the clock and wait 10 more months, then reapply for Brotherhood Honor. Have to give the benefit of the doubt, since there were errors on all sides.

Was this a youth or an adult?

Looks like a cost-cutting measure as well...all the awards now use the same parts, which reduces manufacturing costs. I'll hold on to my original Pro Deo Et Patria, which was durn hard to earn back in 1969.

"Purview" People who can't spell really annoy me...especially when they try to correct the spelling of others.

Hmmmm...if the "King of Siam" is taboo, can we still do "Birds in the Wilderness"??? Singling out a scout for embarrassment and ridicule? Just asking. I love Birds in the Wilderness...and the King of Siam.

I don't think it's that rare. We had a guy who came up as a youth...SPL, Eagle, Vigil, Lodge Chief, JASM, ASM, Camp PD, Camp Director, SM, etc. Then he became active at the District level and within a year or two, had the DAM and SB. Not to imply it wasn't deserved...just fast.

THere are lots of examples of POWWOW books on the internet. That should give you lots of ideas. When I was a CS leader, the book was a treasured hand-out that everyone looked forward to. Examples of classes off the top of my head: Crafts (usually the most popular, so schedule more than one session) Uniforming Religious Awards (maybe separate sessions for Catholic/Protestant) Advancement Fund Raising Pack Management Pinewood Derby Management (how to run double elimination, rules, etc) Pack Camping (family camping) Webelos-Scout Transition

Herbie, welcome. What is your position in the troop? Has the SM been to training?

There are two rules of Nature...never buy v1.0 of anything and never go to Week 1 of camp :-)We always expect Week 1 to be a little bumpy...new staff who need to work out the wrinkles, menu adjustments, supply issues, etc.. But what you described is a nightmare and people who were clearly out of their league. It might be more effective if dissatisfied parents wrote the letters to the SE, mentioning the word "refund" (yeah, good luck with that). I agree with the comment...it's how the challenges were handled that is disturbing. Not running the "lost scout" drill and having an unsafe waterfront program is inexcusable...better to shut it down until adequate trained staff can be hired. At our camp, we pre-register for MB months in advance...that way there's no excuse for not having enough staff. Be Prepared!

Welcome to the forums and congratulations to your prospective Eagle! And kudos to him for wanting to be properly uniformed! To answer your questions: 1) Yes. 2) According to the BSA Insignia Guide, badges of office or rank are not considered "temporary insignia". Temporary insignia are defined as those representing "events" such as camporees, summer camps, etc. At the Eagle BOR that I am privileged to sit, the Scouts frequently have a "brag book", usually a 3-ring binder with plastic pages (like for baseball cards) that contains his Scouting history, cards, certificates, pathches, photos, etc. They are nice to look at and the Board can use it to generate discussion, but not mandatory. 3) Yes, those are acceptable. That being said, if son shows up without devices on his square knot or a Den Chief patch on his sash, I doubt anyone will mention it.

If it's THE Historic Trail Award patch, it doesn't go on the uniform or official jackets at all. If it's a patch he earned for a specific event, then it's OK. "Temporary" patches are as temporary as the wearer wants them to be. That being said, patches earned as a Cub are not usually worn as a Boy Scout. It shouldn't be too long before he earns another one to fill that space.

Part of growing and maturing to adulthood is realizing that the "ethical" choice is not always, indeed it's usually NOT...the easiest, most comfortable, fun, cool or popular choice.

My nephew, who is severely LD, is a "lazy toad", to borrow a phrase from Eamonn. I don't really think the two conditions are connected, however. He was in Scouts until his first campout, which he was very excited about...then he found out he had to actually cook, clean up and do his share of the work, rather than just sit around and poke sticks in the fire. Scouting was just not compatible with his lifestyle, and his dad didn't do anything to countermand that notion. He is no longer a Scout, which is a real pity. If you want to play ball, you eventually have to get off the bench.

Has anyone ever run into a Freemason dressed in full "regalia" at the grocery store or at work? Not being a mason, the only time I've ever seen one was at a funeral where they rendered Masonic "honors".

Been thinking on this some, as I hate to give up on a boy, even those who are pains. One thing you said keeps ringing in my brain, "This particular boy was our first SPL; he was very motivated and loved his position as SPL. Then came election time. Several boys expressed interest in becoming the next SPL, we put them all on the ballot, however, this scout no longer wanted to be SPL and did not want to run. That was the beginning of his down hill slide." Whenever someone's personality or behavior changes and we can point to the time it changed, we should ask ourselves, "Ok, what happened at that time in his life to cause the change?" Drugs, alcohol, depression, girl problems, problems at home, parent marital problems? All possibilities. Or maybe not. Maybe he's just a brat. In any event, it might be worth a SM conference with Mom and/or Dad to gently express concern. Has he lost interest in everything, or just Scouts? Maybe they are unaware...or maybe they are and might be grateful for the help. Just a thought. We are not shrinks and can only do what we can do. But maybe we shouldn't toss him to the curb quite yet. (I'm getting soft in my old age, I guess)

"What if the scout and the parents say we never knew or The SM has it in for us?" Are the requirements not written in the scout's Handbook? One solution to this, if the scout doesn't show up and participate, don't recharter him at the end of the year. You have offered him a custom POR and he refused. That would be it for me. If he wants a POR now, he has to be elected, just like everyone else. If he has merit badges left to earn, provide him a copy of the Counselor list and wish him luck. No troop outings in the past 3 years? The first step to success is to show up. I'd be willing to help any scout who asks for it...but they gotta meet me half way.

Gutterbird, YOu already know the right answer. Stick to your guns! ALL of the requirements must be met...including Scout spirit, which it seems is lacking here.

If being a smart-aleck in the 8th grade is a legitimate reason to deny the Eagle, none of us would have received it.

Sorry...my mouse finger had a spasm.(This message has been edited by scoutldr)

First thing, you would hear a collective CHEER from scouts and parents alike. Secondly, we'd probably have to dispense with Advancement, since there would be no use for rank badges. Watching the TODAY show Saturday (or was it Sunday?) morning, they quickly panned on a troop in the courtyard outside the studio. Not a pair of Scout pants or shorts in the whole group. And the First Class Scout in the very front had a pair of plaid shorts on. Looked pretty tacky on national TV (especially considering they probably KNEW in ADVANCE they would be on national TV!). Didn't catch where they were from and couldn't see the CSP, so they shall remain nameless.

This gets more bizarre by the day...how can a District hold an EBOR without the Scout's (and parent's) knowledge and consent? All I can say is, if this were my troop and District, your son would be an Eagle Scout now, taking all that you have said at face value. Your only mistake was in not transferring to another troop/District when you had the chance. As an Eagle Scout and 30 year Scouter, I too, am embarrassed.

I think it depends on the Chartering Organization (a concept that the GSUSA does not use). I have read about units in Scouting Magazine for Hmong boys and we once had a Sea Scout Ship consisting of muslims. If a CO desires to "target" (or "limit", depending on your POV) their unit, they are free to do so.

Thanks, "white eats". That's what I said back on Page 1.

Uniform Police here. We've discussed this ad nauseam on this forum in the uniform section. The BSA does not use the terms "Class A" and "Class B". Those are military terms. Even in the Army, when the uniform of the day is "Class A", that doesn't mean "just wear the shirt and whatever pants or shorts you want with it"...that would look pretty ridiculous, no? In my opinion, if your Troop is not going to wear the "Official Uniform" (including all its parts), then they are NOT in uniform and it doesn't matter "how strict" you are. You're either in proper uniform...or not. The best thing to do is "lead by example" and try to get your youth leaders to do the same. Cost is a cop=out. Parents don't want to buy pants, but won't think twice about dropping $50 for a video game or a trip to the movies. THere are ways around that...get a parent to start a uniform closet...cruise the yard sales, thrift stores, eBay and Craigslist. Have unit fundraisers so scouts can earn money for uniforms. WHen scouts outgrow the uniforms, recycle them to younger scouts. Have regular uniform inspections and reward expected behaviour. If scouts don't think it's expected, you'll never get there.

What should we do? We welcome him back and help him in his quest. Having a job is part of character development, too.