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moosetracker

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Everything posted by moosetracker

  1. moosetracker
    Packsaddle - we crossed in posts.. Actually you and Eagledad arguing over knot tying at a BOR or EBOR seems strange to me, because that is a question that is taboo.. It is considered retesting, and you are not to retest.... So both of you are wrong to even think it is appropriate to ask at a board.. As you can see with what TAHAWK showed with the current Training on BOR's it is not mandated, but highly recommended.. So with that - For normal BOR's highly recommended is always that the boy come in and give the scout salute and do the scout law and oath... (These all may be considered
  2. moosetracker
    Thanks TAHAWK ... I am correct, that the head of our Eagle Board definitely took this training... WOW.. even the question he uses is pretty much word for word..
  3. moosetracker
    packsaddle - Isn't that pretty much any question asked in a SMC or in an BOR or EBOR... Questions that try to get the scout to think, ponder, perhaps are difficult for him to come to a decent answer without some thought and reflection.. But, which really have no right/wrong answer... If you could change anything in the troop, what would it be? What is the most challenging part of Leadership to you? What was your most challenging Merit Badge and why? What will you do as an Eagle Scout to give back to Scouting?
  4. moosetracker
    But what do you consider stupid?... Should it only be those on the Eagle Board with the positive attitude? You questioned our board asking the Scout to discuss how he follows the 12th point of the Scout Law.. You felt to do so was an ambush and was being preachy.. Yet from all I have learned from this thread, the head of our board not only asks the question in a perfectly correct manner, the scout may explain something about his spiritual beliefs or he could skirt around anything personal and just state actions he does in his everyday life that shows he is being reverent.. Action rather
  5. moosetracker
    You do not have to give the scouts pat answer.. But, you can give them knowledge about BSA's viewpoints about religion and that Adult Leaders are to be open and non-judgmental of a scouts religious viewpoints no matter how weird.. And you can give them practice with thinking about and answering the question if hit with it in either SMC or BOR for the lower ranks.. But, if you treat the subject as taboo, and your scouts are unprepared, that is your call.. When BSA started making a big deal over conservation with adding in "Leave No Trace" some troops poo pooed it and did things the old sch
  6. moosetracker
    Packsaddle took your post and went one way with it, I went the other.. Am I thrilled with the changes?? No.. Do I think there will be problems rolling this out when they have left BSA's position on "Duty to God" clear as mud, because they themselves have not felt the need to address it in any training material to date?? Yes.. That being said, your scouts have the potential to hit this question at some point in their scouting Career.. It should not be at an EBOR, in which this question may start popping up in more EBOR, because who knows if the Eagle Boards are being instructed to ask
  7. moosetracker
    With your line of thinking Mozart the scout could trip up on any points of the law.. Q. How have you lived up to the Oath and the Law? A. Well yesterday I did pretty good, I took out the trash and saved a kitten from the tree, but last week was not so good as I lied to my mother that I was going to meet Pete after school but I was really in detention because I was caught smoking in the bathroom.. But last month was rough some good some bad.. I pestered my parents for the new IPhone since all the kids are getting them, when I know the one I have is working just fine, and I lied to the S
  8. moosetracker
    LeCastor - I see your point that Baden Powell saw god in the Judeo-Christian sense.. Does not mean that BSA sees it that way, it was formed by using Baden Powells BS as a model, but it was always it's own organization, and it did create different policies right from the start.. We do not do our duty to our king either.. Perhaps BSA did start off with BP's idea for God, which is why it is stated that way in their policies .. But BSA's actions show they have changed from that opinion. As others have stated over the years as the world got smaller due to being able to travel faster and more com
  9. moosetracker
    My memory is failing me.. I know I've been gone for a while, but my memory had Fred being one of those I would have long debates with over my liberal views vs his conservative ones.. Hmmmmm... Must have had the wrong Fred.. I have posted 2 links on this thread.. I think they are in conflict with each other on this very point.. But, when I started a post about it, I found the first link was a little more sketchy on what to do with the non-believer scout while the 2nd one basically said "Throw the bum out".. So when I saw it wasn't as black and white a comparison, I scratched the post..
  10. moosetracker
    By definition having a religious belief is "a strong belief in a supernatural power or powers that control human destiny;" and has nothing to do with considering yourself a member of an organized religion.. But, that is where I think some well meaning Scouters will trip up.. You can have a very personal religious belief where your superior being conforms to no beliefs of an organized religion.. Religion of Moosetracker, party of one... The religion of the rock, the religion of the tree, the religion of the streetlamp.. Seriously my sons belief which mixes Greek mythology and nature, the
  11. moosetracker
    So far we have been enjoying the new forum.. A few quirks, but not many.. Welcome back.. I too took a long Hiatus.
  12. moosetracker
    Sounds like a great scout meeting.. I bet the scouts enjoyed themselves.. Just to note your statement: We have a few people posting here that as a troop they camp with adults a good distance away from the scouts, and about a year or two back it was ok for a patrol to do their own patrol (not troop) campout no adults, but the rule was changed to disallow that, and very few could ever do that.. We are the country of the neurotic parents, and they would probably sue for the moon if something happened, especially without adult supervision.. We still have something set up that
  13. moosetracker
    Mozart - perhaps why our board just asks the scout to explain the 12th point of the law which is "Reverent", not "God"... I think the head of our board more often uses "Higher power" himself whenever I have heard him speak of it, and it probably would be a good thing for Scout Leaders to try to adapt to.
  14. moosetracker
    Yuck, that will be messy... How many times have I taken an Adult App and then later had to chase down the person because I forgot to check if they signed the place that was on the back of one of the pages rather then on the front... Oh, about half the amount of times I have taken Adult apps... This will be another thing I will forget and have to chase down people for..
  15. moosetracker
    Nah... I think God is not as concrete to BSA as you are thinking it is.. Take this in the Q & A I pulled from this link : http://www.bsa-discrimination.org/html/bsa-god_policy.html Q. How does the BSA define religion? The BSA does not interpret God or religion. That is the role of the Scout's family and religious leaders. Q. What religions are involved with Scouting? Virtually every religion is represented in the BSA. Q. Some people maintain that God is a tree, a rock or a stream. Would a person believing such be eligible to be a member of Scouting? The BSA does not seek to in
  16. moosetracker
    So why don't you like the Shinto scout?? To be honest, I never heard of Shinto and so had to look it up and BSA's view to it from all I see, BSA is OK with it, so why aren't you? http://www.inquiry.net/ideals/faiths/index.htm http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/Membership/ReligiousDates.aspx - do a search for Shinto, it is on the BSA Calendar, but a word in the midst of yadda-yadda Also there is a audio/book, that says it BSA Shinto, but not sure if that BSA is really OUR BSA or the letters stand for something else. http://www.gadgetsandpresents.com/blksn6203.html
  17. moosetracker
    Eagledad is calling us abby-normal.... If you think taking fabricated examples, or one time examples to make a case is something only scouters on this board do... Let me invite you to some of our committee meetings which can be knock-down drag-out and also some of our scout parents... It really is not an abnormality of the scouters on this board to use this technic when arguing passionately for their case.. So I consider scouters on this board to be quite normal to the scouts, scouters and scout parents that I meet in person. I therefore unclassify us as abby-normal..
  18. moosetracker
    Hopefully those units that are going to be over the top controlling on the issue of religion have already been doing that, and the boys have either chosen to live with it or walk away, let us hope this change does not give them a feeling they have more license to harass.. Which leaves the units that have stayed away from this topic and left it to the family.. If uncomfortable today, they will be uncomfortable tomorrow to broach the subject regardless of BSA saying now you gotta do it.. So, yes.. I hope there is some training offered.. Maybe not an official BSA training ever SM must take, but m
  19. moosetracker
    I was looking for some statement made in some official BSA documentation something about a boy choosing a rock as their higher power and that would be fine.. I know I had found it once or twice in the past, but couldn't today (so if anyone knows where it is, maybe they can post it.) Anyway in my search I stumbled upon this piece, which is a blog in the Scouting magazine so maybe it was in the actual magazine and other of you have seen it, but I thought it addressed a lot of what we have been discussing.. First seems that it is not unusual for our EBOR to discuss Reverent or duty to God, so
  20. moosetracker
    Yeah it's not really an area, it is more based on each CO ... We have been in units with weak CO leadership, you find them to sign the forms and that's it.. We have been in ones with very strong CO leadership.. the strong CO seem to have the better running units from my personal experience.. The troop my son finally landed in has a very feisty firecracker COR, she not only ran our units but when she said jump the Council would jump.. She knew who ran council and since there were few COR's getting involved at council level she knew she carried a big stick.. But, she was this little bitty lady,
  21. moosetracker
    I never thought of the red meat to the conservative right.. I always thought it was to strengthen a legal fight with atheists, but that is a totally plausible thought.. Really both are, killing two birds with one stone so to speak.. I also agree that conservative Christians can take this and run with it.. I see plenty of out-of-hand moments ahead, and rethinking and changes ahead as they find some of their zealot religious right folks take this way out of hand and drive scouts out of the program.. While religion can have a place in BSA, it can not become a thorn in it's side..
  22. moosetracker
    Mozart I don't know how preachy you can get with a streetlight and little green men from Mars.. My son has sat on this board and probably will again when he moves back into the area, his belief is wild I don't quite know it, but I know it is some concoction of Greek mythology and nature.. He has no problem with this board, but was put off when the guy his wife & he asked to officiated the wedding (it was not a priest but someone from the Masonic Lodge who had a license to marry) said he wouldn't marry them until he knew they had some religious belief, he was fine with his wife's normal
  23. moosetracker
    I do not know why, most questions variate scout to scout depending on their scouting experiences but there are 2 or 3 questions always asked, one being to explain what the 12 point of the scout law means to them. Do not know why the guy who heads the board see it as an important question, especially when his belief is he doesn't care if the scout believes in the lamp post or men from outerspace as their higher power.. But the way it is asked I think the scout can skirt their own personal beliefs and just give a definition. No they don't ask sexual orientation, but I know there have been 1 or
  24. moosetracker
    Seriously again this will depend on how rigid the EBOR is on this.. Our board has denied a scout who stated he was an atheist, but with another the poor scout said enough to leave doubt but in the end, they passed him.. It was a while back so I don't remember things word for word, but scout when asked said he did not believe in god.. Then board had him go outside with scoutmaster while they discussed it.. The SM explained to scout what his words meant to the board.. When the scout returned (I believe the board was going to not pass him) but he hastily explained he was not an atheist and t
  25. moosetracker
    Before going to the DE, keep it in house.. If the scoutmaster can get him to back off by laying down the law with this is my job, that is your job.. Don't cross the line.. Then the next line of defense is your COR who has the ability to have the CC do his job, and not the SM job.. If the COR is not helpful, then up the ladder to the Institutional head (IH) of your CO.. After that you can move to your DE, but only if the COR & IH are too weak to pull rank on the CC.. If they are totally backing the CC, then the DE will not cross the line and take the opposite position of you COR & IH.
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